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I'm reinstalling Windows XP on a system for a friend. He originally had XP installed on this system, and we decided to upgrade some of it and reinstall the OS. He has a cracked copy, which, I assume, is ancient (from when the first versions of XP came out). The machine is a custom built Athlon 1Ghz, with about 576MB of memory. Video card is a Chaintech nVidia chipset (not sure which specifically, but it ran fine under XP before this issue).
Every time I boot from the CD and begin the installation, it freezes at exactly the same point. There's the blue screen, and it's loading the drivers at the bottom...when it gets to "Setup is starting windows." It's done. Nothing happens. No CD activity, no CPU activity, and no HD access.
So, I tried installing windows 98SE. Yes, that works perfectly fine. Memory checks out ok, as far as I can tell, and I'm not getting any random errors. Video card is Windows XP compatible...um, it was running XP before, so what the heck? Thinking myself stupid, I tried the backdoor: upgrading Win98SE to XP. It froze, repeatedly, at the same point. Grrr.
I acquired the most recent version of Windows XP, including service pack 2, but it yielded the same results. Frozen at "Setup is starting windows."
posted
Sorry, remember, I've tried two separate disks. This is not a CD issue. I've also used both the CD-ROM drive and the DVD-ROM drive to boot from and start the installation. Both drives and both disks freeze at exactly the same point.
Posts: 1813 | Registered: Apr 2001
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posted
Ok, Pass 1 is almost done. I'm waiting on Test #9, which is the bit fade test (this is unlikely...), but it takes the longest to complete. I'll let it run through these a couple more times just to be sure. No errors so far.
Posts: 1813 | Registered: Apr 2001
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posted
Sorry, it's not a degraded copy, either. Remember, I have tried TWO different disks (one ancient, one new), and both have hung up with the same results, at the same point in the installation.
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I'd be tempted to format the hard drive and start fresh. (Assuming that this version of XP is one that can be used for a fresh install. If it's an upgrade disk, you can't do that.)
But I'd check the knowledgebase on microsoft.com first just to see if there are any articles describing this problem.
Thinking while I type, another thing you can try is check out the system's component's vendor sites and see if their knowledgebases report this issue.
(Can you tell I like online knowledgebases?)
Failing all that, I'd take it in to a qualified Microsoft certified shop and have them do it. 'Course, you do have to legally own your OS disks in that event.
Posts: 5948 | Registered: Jun 2001
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What upgrades did you install? You mentioned that you upgraded the system; what did you add?
At this stage, I strongly suspect a bad driver, but it's also possible that you've got a bad piece of hardware.
The step you're failing at is the start of the actual installation, if I understand you correctly. At this stage, you'll be running standard VGA and default IDE drivers, and little else.
If you can boot to CD -- and you can -- try booting and then manually copying the files to your hard drive, then running the installation from there.
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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Exactly how far *do* you get in the Windows installation before it croaks?
My guess is that the master boot record is fubared somehow, but it could be a bad hard drive, or some other old file floating around that isn't playing nice, too.
So, go into the repair XP option on bootup from cd and scandisk, format, and run fixmbr and then try to reinstall again from the actual XP version.
Posts: 13123 | Registered: Feb 2002
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posted
How long are you waiting for the setup to continue from that point? I've seen computers that take FOREVER to get past that point. More often than not it's because of a slow/crappy hard drive. Don't pay attention to the lights on your computer. They can be deceptive sometimes. And just for kicks and giggles, yank out that 64 meg stick of ram. I'm willing to bet it's slower than the 512 stick, and that will really hurt your computer more than the extra RAM will help (And really, that might be the cause of the problem right there).
quote: If you can boot to CD -- and you can -- try booting and then manually copying the files to your hard drive, then running the installation from there.
Do you know a trick for this? Cause more often than not, I always get a "Setup cannot run in DOS mode" error message when I try stuff like that. XP seems to be picky about how it starts up on a boot. If you know something I don't, PLEASE let me know, there have been hundreds of times that would have been useful to me
[ April 27, 2005, 08:51 PM: Message edited by: Boris ]
Posts: 3003 | Registered: Oct 2004
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posted
XP says it's copying files to hard drive before actually beginning installation. While I've never looked into it, I had always assumed that it was doing exactly that--copying the installation files to the hard drive-- as doing so made a lot of sense.
Posts: 13123 | Registered: Feb 2002
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posted
Well, there are a few different parts to it. It doesn't actually copy anything to the hard drive until you see a progress bar. Once that is full, it's done copying files and reboots. Are you getting to that progress bar and then things get shot during the copy process? If not, does it stop working before or after that point.
(If it stalls out at the point when it says, "Starting Windows" in the lower left corner, just know I've seen computers hang at that point for 5-10 minutes and then continue on with the installation just fine)
[ April 27, 2005, 10:58 PM: Message edited by: Boris ]
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posted
Sorry it took me so long to get back here. I just spent 4+ hours trying to help a customer of mine get their DVD burner to work right. I appreciate everyone's input on this issue. Let me tell you what I tried, and what finally solved the problem.
First, to answer some of the questions posed here:
HollowEarth - I "acquired" the new copy of XP from a friend. He's reliable. I didn't purchase XP in this case, because my friend I'm helping never purchased it. I'm not keeping these copies of XP. Once I get everything installed here, he gets the disks again. It's his moral issue if he wants to buy XP, not mine. I'm just his little computer helper. (For the record, I pay for all the software I use now.)
jeniwren - This was a fresh install. I did try google, but I didn't get any results. Had I not solved this almost immediately upon returning tonight, I would've taken the suggestion to heart. I do like Microsoft's online knowledgebase.
TomDavidson - The upgrade was a hard drive upgrade. HD wasn't even plugged in while attempting the XP install. Good point about trying to copy everything to the HD and then install.
Storm Saxon - Except that I installed Windows 98SE without any issues whatsoever. So unfortunately, the MBR is working fine.
Boris - I did wait. Half an hour, one time, just to see if it would twitch. Machine was definitely frozen.
Now, what solved the problem. I stood over this machine for several minutes, contemplating what to do. I unhooked the DVD drive, because I only needed one CD drive to boot and install from. Turn on, boot, freeze, turn off. I removed all but 256MB of memory. I have no idea why, in hindsight, because it all checked out fine. Turn on, boot, freeze, turn off. I checked the jumpers on the drives. Nothing helped. It froze at "Setup is starting Windows."
Then I reset the BIOS to failsafes. It worked fine, after that. Now I wonder, looking back, why I didn't try that earlier on. I don't recall feeling like I had any indication that resetting the BIOS would solve the problem. Troubleshooting procedure didn't lead me there right away. Live and learn, right?
So, to wrap this up, I do not know what tiny setting was causing a conflict, but most likely, a setting in the BIOS was causing the havoc in the XP setup routine.
Thanks again for your help here. I'm going to leave this thread up through tomorrow so people can read about the solution, then I plan to delete the thread.
Posts: 1813 | Registered: Apr 2001
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quote: Storm Saxon - Except that I installed Windows 98SE without any issues whatsoever. So unfortunately, the MBR is working fine. [Smile]
I saw that you had installed 98 o.k.., but that doesn't mean that your MBR still couldn't have been hosed as far as XP went or that something from the cracked version wasn't right to begin with and causing the installation of the legit version to not go through. That's why I wanted to get the hard drive clean and install the legit version.
I do not get why your BIOS solved the issue, quite frankly, unless it was reading the hard drive wrong to begin with and naming it something else and not handing off to the OS (XP) correctly. Can you elaborate on your bios version so I can look up what this 'failsafe' thing does. I've never heard of a 'failsafe' setting on BIOS.
Posts: 13123 | Registered: Feb 2002
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quote: I saw that you had installed 98 o.k.., but that doesn't mean that your MBR still couldn't have been hosed as far as XP went or that something from the cracked version wasn't right to begin with and causing the installation of the legit version to not go through. That's why I wanted to get the hard drive clean and install the legit version.
A bad MBR will not ever in any way affect the Windows XP setup. MBR is replaced completely when Windows is installed. MBR only needs to be repaired if you get an "UNMOUNTABLE_BOOT_VOLUME" or similar Blue Screen at start up. Why? Because the Master Boot Record is simply a pointer to the boot partition. The BIOS looks at the first sector of the Hard Drive, where the partition information is stored, to determine where the active boot partition is. Once it finds that out, it starts up. One of the first things the Windows installation program does is change the MBR to point to where the OS is located on the hard drive. So basically, any re-installation of Windows will repair a corrupted MBR. It's just a lot quicker to boot into the recovery console and fix the problem manually.
The reason the BIOS changes fixed things is likely due to the recent upgrades (Speaking of which, what exactly were the upgrades?) not getting completely recognized by the BIOS. That's just a guess, so don't hold me to that.
Posts: 3003 | Registered: Oct 2004
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posted
Yeah, Boris, I'm thinking you're right about the settings. However, I do remember going into Setup (BIOS) and seeing the drives correctly recognized, under "HD Autodetect".
BIOS is AMIBIOS (Simple Setup Utility v 1.24k)
Yes, the option was, "Load Fail-Safe Defaults"
Basically, it just reverts back to basic, unmodified settings, the way I understand it.
Posts: 1813 | Registered: Apr 2001
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posted
The BIOS coulda been corrupted to first install a highjacking boot virus. Then each time that there was an attempt by the new bootup to install a patch over the hole, the hijack-ware coulda just prevented the patch from being installed. Which in turn caused an automatic shut down of the new bootup.
Setting the failsafes returns the BIOS back to the original pathways -- ie it won't run the boot virus first -- which then allows the new bootup to patch and continue to overwrite: effectively closing the security hole which allowed the infection in the first place, and "erasing" the boot virus.
No, I don't know what I'm talking about. Haven't had to deal with it, so haven't had reason to look deeply into, think about it. Just repeating what I think I've read about patches and dealing with boot viruses in computer-ezine articles-for-the-masses. So do not take my word for it. Check, do some research.
quote: Setting the failsafes returns the BIOS back to the original pathways -- ie it won't run the boot virus first -- which then allows the new bootup to patch and continue to overwrite: effectively closing the security hole which allowed the infection in the first place, and "erasing" the boot virus.
Nope. This doesn't do anything to a BIOS loaded virus. Only thing that does anything (And usually doesn't do anything either) is flashing the BIOS to a newer version. Most BIOS viruses have disapeared due to increased security on BIOS chips. If you have a BIOS virus, you can usually only do two things to fix it. Replace the BIOS chip, or replace the whole motherboard.
edit: to note that Boot viruses usually hijack the boot sector of a Hard Drive. AKA, the aformentioned MBR. Those are actually going away as well, because most hackers now aren't trying to kill computers, they're just trying to steal money/make money through use of Trojans and Keyloggers.
[ April 28, 2005, 02:30 AM: Message edited by: Boris ]
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quote: Yeah, Boris, I'm thinking you're right about the settings. However, I do remember going into Setup (BIOS) and seeing the drives correctly recognized, under "HD Autodetect".
Did you just upgrade drives? If so, the BIOS may not have selected the mode for the drives...Or there might have been some overclock settings, or some other settings that were previously screwed up. I wouldn't recommend using "Fail Safe Defaults" for normal operation, though, since it slows things down a bit. If there is a factory default or optimal default setting, I'd use that instead.
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quote: So basically, any re-installation of Windows will repair a corrupted MBR. It's just a lot quicker to boot into the recovery console and fix the problem manually.
I don't believe this is true for any version of Windows, is it? This is something new in XP, I believe. One of the things you sometimes used to have to do to get rid of a virus that resided in the MBR/Boot sector was to fdisk /mbr or low level format the whole drive. Reinstalling windows did not resolve the issue.
In any case, I stand corrected on the mbr under XP. Thanks.
Posts: 13123 | Registered: Feb 2002
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posted
aspectre, thanks for pointing out the possibility. I'm pretty sure no viruses infected the machine, but I'll do a thorough check before returning the machine to him.
Boris, whatever setting prevented me from completing the windows XP installation did NOT prevent me from completely installing windows 98SE. Yeah, there are some huge fundamental differences between XP and 98SE. Tentatively, I agree with the possibility the BIOS incorrectly loaded settings for the HD. I'll probably never know for sure.
Again, thanks for the help, Hatrack. Posts: 1813 | Registered: Apr 2001
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I don't recall feeling like I had any indication that resetting the BIOS would solve the problem. Troubleshooting procedure didn't lead me there right away. Live and learn, right?![[Cool]](cool.gif)
I'm going to leave this thread up through tomorrow so people can read about the solution, then I plan to delete the thread.
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