posted
Okay, this is a bit of a rant thread, and I know that so many things are messed up about it, but I need to vent.
Why do guys always WANT something from me??? I'm nice, funny, they can call whenever they want, and I'm definitely a friend. What is wrong with this???
I've been dating someone, and I like him. That squicked me out enough that I was in a bad mood a few months ago, but I recovered from that and am now content with seeing each other once a week or so and talking to one another another time in the week besides that. We have a had a BILLION conversations about timing and how everybody else seems to go so fast and being rushed and how that's just not cool - you'd think he'd understand this, no? I mean - we have that in common! That's why he's smart, cute, Mormon, and single at 29! Everyone else goes too fast!
So why's he pushing ME? I've only known him for two months. Granted, it isn't a lot of pushing, but still, dang it. I guess I know the answer to this - I'm just not as interested, I suppose - which means I need to tell him that. If I were, then I wouldn't be freaking out. But dang it..... I like talking to him once a week and seeing him once every other week or so. I like being friends.
quote: I've been dating someone, and I like him. That squicked me out enough that I was in a bad mood a few months ago, but I recovered from that and am now content with seeing each other once a week or so and talking to one another another time in the week besides that.
I dont' get this? You dated someone, and you liked him, which caused you to be squicked out? Wha?
Posts: 13123 | Registered: Feb 2002
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posted
No... just more of a girlfriend/more than once a week committment.
Maybe I'm a little bit paranoid. If so, it is not without reason. I mean, of all the times I've proposed to, I only dated one (the best, my favorite, and I think the reason I'm still a bit gun-shy) for longer than two months. This is already past the two month mark.
posted
Dang it, maybe that's it. For me, there are two landmarks - two weeks, and two months. Eighty percent don't make it past two weeks, and a grand total of ONE has made it past two months. So this freak-out is almost predictable. *thinks*
quote:You dated someone, and you liked him, which caused you to be squicked out? Wha?
posted
Well, have there been times when, over the course of a week, you've thought, "Gee, I wish I could be doing this thing with Anonymous Guy...."
If not, seeing him only weekly is probably a good idea. If so, then seeing him more than once a week is probably fine.
As to officially calling him a "boyfriend:" there's a girl in my office who's been living with a guy for three years, but refuses to call him anything but "my friend." She doesn't want to feel "tied down." It's a personal quirk, and hopefully he'll understand. For my part, assuming you like the guy and aren't really considering dating anybody else, I don't see why you might not consider the whole "boyfriend" thing; it's not like you're talking about engagement or anything.
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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quote:you're talking about engagement or anything.
Have you SEEN Mormon dating customs? DD and JB met in March, got engaged in May, and got married in August. This is actually very, very normal. I just think its a bigger committment than I would like it to be.
Dang it, I think I need to keep it to weekly, then, maybe. I saw him on Saturday, and he called again yesterday, and I could tell he was delighted to talk to me, and actually, I hadn't really thought about him since Saturday. *scowl* Dagnabbit. I can't help that.
posted
Maybe he's been down the road of "let's be friends" before. If he's pushing at all, maybe he justs wants to have some idea of where this is headed.
Posts: 4625 | Registered: Jul 2002
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posted
Well, it's headed for me running for the hills if he keeps pushing me.
I don't know... I do like him. He's sweet, cute, smart (engineer - loves science), likes politics, truly converted, comfortable with himself, and thinks I'm funny and brilliant. On the other hand, he prefers Seinfeld to the Simpsons. I just don't know. I'd like to keep seeing him, but I'm not comfortable with more than once a week (yet?).
Posts: 26077 | Registered: Mar 2000
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You have to actually tell him that you just want to be friends. "I'm not sure, but I've gotten the feeling that you want to be more than friends. I just want to make it clear that I like you a lot, blah blah blah, but I dont' want to have a relationship right now(edit: should be changed to 'with you')." Don't say 'not ready' or 'maybe in the future' or something like that. That's just confusing and makes the person think that if they persist long enough, they'll eventually win you over. Understand, though, if you don't actually want to be just friends, but are too nervous or scared or something to want to date him right now, then you have to be prepared to lose him as he pursues someone else.
posted
*kicks the ground* That's what I was afraid of. *scowls again* I liked it the way things were. Now I have to find another friend.
Posts: 26077 | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
Do you think you might be interested in more than just friends? Is it the particular guy that you're not sure about or is the whole relationship issue?
Posts: 4625 | Registered: Jul 2002
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Cause a) if you're eventually going to be running for the hills anyway, and b) if he's freakin' you out, tell his ass that he's pushing you in a way you don't like.
On another note, using DD & JB's timeframe as a reference... jaiden and i should be on our second kid... (presuming of course having chidren immediately after getting married)
That's freaky.
[ September 02, 2003, 09:42 AM: Message edited by: Pod ]
Posts: 4482 | Registered: May 2000
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quote:Is it the particular guy that you're not sure about or is the whole relationship issue?
*considers* You know, I'm not sure. I'm a little bit skittish at the moment, but that may not be just it. I was joking about the Seinfeld/Simpsons thing, but only about halfway. There are a lot of instances where our worlds don't touch (mostly leisure time tastes), and I think I miss that a little. I realize NOBODY is a perfect fit, but still...
quote:On another note, using DD & JB's timeframe as a reference... jaiden and i should be on our second kid... (presuming of course having chidren immediately after getting married)
Yes, actually. That is the customary time frame of this culture, the boundries of which I am trying to navigate. I HATE this. For crying out loud!
posted
Kat, without knowing anything about the guy, I think you should take the plunge. People have to LEARN how to date -- and given the ages and circumstances of the people involved, now is a good time for you two to start.
Two months is long enough for you to decide if he's a decent romantic possibility, or if you really DO just want to turn him into a completely platonic friend -- and his asking you to decide at this point is really not unreasonable.
You should be able to tell, by now, whether his voice gets your heart racing, and whether you look forward to seeing him. If not -- if he's just a warm body you like bringing to movies -- then you actually OWE it to him to tell him that. But if so, you're doing yourself a disservice by letting your fear of the unknown drive you away.
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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posted
Kat, that depends on him and how you handle yourself around him. It's not totally a given. If you tell him that you just want to be friends, it is possible that he might be able to swallow his feelings and be friends with you. Some guys can do it. I find it very difficult, myself, but I know lots of guys who can. The problem is made impossible, though, if you don't treat him as a friend. I think the big point here is not to treat him as a girl friend, but as a guy friend. As lame as it sounds, that means no physical contact, like hugging and whatnot. Speaking for myself, kind of uncomfortable when you are attracted to someone.
Man, this whole conversation makes me feel all young again. Yay, living vicariously!
Posts: 13123 | Registered: Feb 2002
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quote:whether his voice gets your heart racing, and whether you look forward to seeing him.
Hmm... there have definitely been "Oh, I can't wait to tell him that." moments, but they are about equal with the "hmm... nice friend." moments. The nice part is, we can and do talk about everything - so I can actually tell him fairly straight out. He's used to it.
Stormy: Aren't I older than you?
I am very good at the guy friends thing - my best friend is a guy, and he's fairly allergic to hugs unless I'm crying or very, very happy, in which case I get a pat on the shoulder. So that's not an issue.
quote: People have to LEARN how to date -- and given the ages and circumstances of the people involved, now is a good time for you two to start.
The thing is, I think he really likes me. I don't want to take advantage of that for "practice".
--- Man, I love Hatrack. This is wonderful stuff, guys.
One tip - if you go with the friends route, don't ask him to drive you to the airport so you can fly somewhere to see you're new boyfriend. Sometimes nice guys do stupid things to themselves.
Posts: 4625 | Registered: Jul 2002
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posted
Oh zan.... *hug* Yea, that completely sucks. Holy crap.
I had one friend in college whose first reaction on meeting a fabulous girl was to introduce her to all his friends - who usually agreed on girl being wonderful and promptly asked her out. He lost more than one prospect that way.
posted
Nobody has the same tastes, Kat. My husband and I disagree on important issues like politics sometimes. Sometimes, we even get angry at each other over these issues. It is temporary, only in the same conversation, but we do disagree that much sometimes.
One thing you are going to have to learn: There is never going to be someone that fits your ideal perfectly.
Who cares about Seinfield vs Simpsons in marriage? I hated the Simpsons, my husband loved them. It was an irritation to me. Lots of little things about my husband are an irritation to me, not just a cute little quirk. I would change them if I could, and still have the man that I love. That is part of being married to a person that is a different individual than you are.
I don't love him because he is my soulmate. There is no such thing.
posted
I have decided to rearrange my criteria. At this point, the filtering process takes place BEFORE any dating begins, and from then on, I'm going with feeling. He's very nice, cool, cute, smart, and good, and so passes the filtering process. I'm just trying to weigh feelings here.
At two weeks, I freaked out a little bit, but decided it was worth and I wanted to know him better. At this two-months freak out, I don't have the same "definitely want more" feeling.
I'd manufacture it if I could. I can't, though. There's no use faking it.
posted
I'm not saying that you should automatically be his girlfriend because you are afraid of being skittish.
If there is no chemistry for you, there isn't. But if there is for him, then you better not get his hopes up. But if you do feel like it might be nice to kiss him, then there might be chemistry, and you are right to wonder why you are scared. In that case, just keep on trucking and take things slow. Tom has some good advice.
Posts: 3495 | Registered: Feb 2000
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posted
Kat, have you tried on-line dating? As bad a reputation as it has, I find that as long as you have a *recent* picture going into it, it's a really great way of getting to know people quickly, and well, before you actually meet them.
Posts: 13123 | Registered: Feb 2002
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posted
There is one phrase that I will always, always love a certain someone for: Picking who you love is the last selfish thing you'll do.
Look, I'm not worried about "ever getting married", or any of that. The Lord knows me, he knows what I'm like, and I haven't (permanently) gone against any promptings he's sent about this kind of thing. The only time I have was the first time I got engaged, years ago - that was a terrible experience, but it's not the Lord's fault. He said it was a bad idea. It'll be okay. Life isn't a race.
Hence the bit of frustration, though: I have to make a decision soon, and I have a feeling I'm going to lose my friend. Dang it.
posted
Well, to be fair to him, we became friends after he sort of asked me out. This whole scenario is neither unpredictable nor unfair. I should probably be glad I've had as long as I've had. (We do go Dutch on things.)
So basically, this is the normal dating process. I just had not-quite-forgotten how much I hate it.
posted
On a serious note, why do so many people I know get upset with me for not having something happen with someone? My dad is still upset with me, and my grandma had to be talked down off the wall by my grandfather who told me he trusts me and I can love whomever I want and do whatever made me happy.
I mean, really. Close my eyes and think of England?
posted
Kat, from now on, when you start dating someone, you should tell them up front that if you receive a marriage proposal from them before one full year is up, they will automatically be dumped. That way, there is no need to freak at week two and month two. Besides, you can always change your mind later.
(I have no advice on the current situation, just thought I'd stick my 2 cents in on the other part. )
Posts: 9871 | Registered: Aug 2001
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...as to actual advice, Tom and Saxon have handled that very well. I have nothing to add to their words of wisdom. Posts: 10886 | Registered: Feb 2000
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posted
Kat, if I were you I wouldn’t make any decision about this while you’re in the middle of the two-month panic attack. The situation (and the guy) deserve to be judged on their own merits and you can’t do that if you’re in the grip of an emotional reaction based on past time-frames or other people’s time-frames.
Posts: 9866 | Registered: Apr 2002
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dkw: That's a good idea. *thinks* But it is almost exactly two months! June 21 - Sep 1. Nine weeks. He attempted to have the conversation right on time!
posted
But he hasn’t proposed, he just wants to “go steady,” right? (Or whatever you call it once you’re out of high school )
Since he agrees with you that the “typical” LDS relationship expectations move too fast, I don’t think you need to be worried that he’s going to consider you engaged if you agree to date him.
Posts: 9866 | Registered: Apr 2002
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posted
Alas, dear sister, you are just too irresistibly charming for your own good.
My fellow Hatrackers are full of sage advice, but I'd like to add a personal bit of it for good measure:
If you are confused and befuddled at the prospect of liking him in a romantic way, or you know that you're not interested in him romantically, that's something you need to remember from the beginning. Decide now before you jump in.
I've had the frustrating experience of dating someone because I thought I might be able to learn to like him, and it all turned out very badly. I really really really regret showing interest where there was none.
If the thought of being his girlfriend freaks you out, there's probably a good reason, even if you can't logically pinpoint it. Let him know now before he gets a lot more attatched than you'll ever be.
Posts: 8504 | Registered: Aug 1999
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posted
Lets look at it from "Guy's" point of view.
He meets a very nice lady.
His friends and family ask what's going on. He says, "We are just doing things together now and then. We are friends. We even go dutch."
They say, "Dude, no wonder you aren't getting anywhere. All women want a commitment. Watch TV. Woman want commitment. Men don't. You'd better show her you are open to commitment, have an answer to "where is this relationship going?" or else you will loose her man."
Basically, give him your feelings and your needs. Don't worry about hurting him. If you sit down and tell him everything you are telling us, one of two things will happen. He will freak and run away, which means it wasn't meant to be, or he will continue to be friends, quite possibly happy with the situation. He may be pushing because he fears that is what you may want and he doesn't know what to do.
I've been in such situations. It is not fun.
Oh, one last thing Kat, if you do stay as backup buddies, weekly wonders and don't get any closer, know that he may find someone closer, someone else to cuddle and kiss on a definate schedule.
Then again, so might you.
Posts: 11895 | Registered: Apr 2002
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Looks like you've already gotten plenty of sage advice. Only have one thing to add -- deep breaths. Lots of 'em. Helps me fight down panic attacks -- might work for you too.
Posts: 32919 | Registered: Mar 2003
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Dan - very good idea. I think I will. Wish me luck.
Annie - *grin* The price of being fascinating, I suppose. Seriously, I know what you mean, though. This is a bother, but it just isn't fair. Where does that "keep hanging around - maybe you'll like him more later" meme come from, anyway? It's awful! to everyone involved!
My older brother has told me that - that I'm much too picky, and far too selfish, and to pick someone with my head, get married, and everything else will come. In other words, arrange myself a marriage. Whatever. He married the girl he loved, that fit him, and was happy on his wedding day; I don't know why it is so shocking that I want the same thing.
Posts: 26077 | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
Hadn't we determined from previous threads about your family that you are some kind of abberation of coolness from the normal goofiness that seems to pervade the rest of your family? Posts: 13123 | Registered: Feb 2002
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No. Don't give in to the next guy that approaches you because you must get married.
But... don't be scared. A wonderful, fantastic marriage isn't guaranteed by the man you choose. There is no guarantee. You may find someone who you fall deeply, madly in love with, who is perfect for you, and ten years into your marriage he changes. Maybe he changes shortly after you get married. No, he wasn't hiding anything from you, but his behavior when he has a woman to take care of him and his behavior when he has to take care of himself is different. He couldn't have told you that, he may not have realized it himself.
The choosing, that is important. But what goes on after you get married is far more important and makes a much greater impact on how good the marriage is. I think people forget that, and I think that is why there is so much divorce. "I can't live with you anymore, you aren't the man I married." Of course he isn't. Everyone grows and changes.
So in the choosing, give them a wee bit of room to not be perfect, because you know you'll find things out that make them less than perfect when you get married. Write a list of qualities you want in a man, then divide those out into "must have" and "can live without".
An example of must have: "same spiritual beliefs"
can live without: "the same taste in books"
must have: "responsible"
can live without: "a charming way with words"
must have: "a good heart"
can live without: "an intuitive sense of when and why something is wrong with you"
And Kat - they always want something from you because you are a kind, good woman and they are looking for a wife. Be sensitive to that. In our culture, at your age, that is what is happening with dating. It either progresses towards that, or it doesn't. In this case, it hasn't for you and it has for him. So don't be angry at him. He didn't mean to need more from you than you want to give. Don't be angry at yourself. If you aren't attracted to him, and I guess if you don't think of him at all except during your dutch dates, then that isn't a switch you can flip. Just let y'all be who you are, don't be so scared by the gravity of the situation, and be kind.
"Life is too important to take seriously" - don't know where it came from, my best friend in HS used to quote it.
Posts: 3495 | Registered: Feb 2000
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*grin* But y'all haven't met my baby brother - who supports me completely.
He's adorable. He has learned to crochet, and is crocheting for me a blue and black beanie for Christmas. He's taking it very seriously. I can't even tell if he thinks it is remotely funny or not, so we exchanged solemn letters discussing the relative merits of my color options. I'm afraid to tease him.
Amka:
I get what you are saying. Yes, yes, all those good qualities, but here's the thing:
Frankly, good writing, wit, and humor is what flips my switch. Not looks (although that doesn't hurt *dreamy*), not athleticism, not machismo, not even education. On a very basic level, that is what I like the most. I refuse to believe that the quality that I am attracted to most in guys, that I find in every friend that I value, and that makes me want to be around someone is mutually exclusive with being a worthwhile, good person that fits me.
There are Hatrackers that prove it isn't <insert list of cool male Hatrackers so we have a mutual frame of reference>. Heck, there are even Mormon Hatrackers that prove it isn't impossible for everything important to me be in one person <insert another list - no, I'm not putting actual names>. I have friends and even a few relatives that prove it isn't.
I understand that Perfect Person isn't around. However, I'm not going to grit my teeth and endure something I don't want because someone/thing says I should.
posted
Hmmm, have been reading this thread all morning, not really sure what to add. I think you have gotten some good input from other posters.
quote:I've had the frustrating experience of dating someone because I thought I might be able to learn to like him, and it all turned out very badly. I really really really regret showing interest where there was none.
Yeah, I had that happen, too, years ago, before I got married. The guy was very interested in me, so I gave him a chance, and was perilously close to marrying him. Then, I met someone who I was really interested in, and ended up having to dump the first guy as delicately as I could.
On the other hand...I would add to the comments about being too picky. You will never find someone who "perfectly" matches you in every way. I love my husband, and we get along well. But that doesn't mean we agree on everything, or that we are always perfectly attuned to each other.
I guess the key is deciding whether or not your friend is someone who you could be more interested in, or someone you just want to be friends with. (Your comments above seem to point to the latter, but only you can decide that for sure.)
I hope everything works out for the best for you, Kate.
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