quote:If it's any consolation, I consider Bushwacked to be one of the two weakest episodes of the season. Still quite good, and still well worth watching (and there is one sequence in particular that I love), but not as good as most of the other episodes.
What do you think is the other weak one? I'm going to hazard a guess and say "Safe" but I'm not sure anyone else feels my boredom with that episode.
Posts: 4655 | Registered: Jan 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
Safe is weaker than most of them, but stronger (I think) than either Bushwacked or The Message. I go back and forth sometimes on which episode is my least favorite, but it's usually The Message.
Teshi, yeah, wasn't that interrogation sequence great? Best thing in the episode, especially, as you said, the Zoe/Wash part.
I can't tell you how much fun I'm having vicariously watching the show for the first time again through your eyes. I'm interested in hearing as much analysis as you feel like writing. You're not going to hurt my feelings by taking it apart. I'd wondered about the crew of the train's complete obliviousness to the huge ship flying directly above it. I hadn't been bothered by the sound aspect so much, due to the fact that the train was making all sorts of noise itself (there are other episodes, by the way, where you can tell that the ship does make noise while in flight in atmosphere), but I was surprised that there weren't any onboard sensors that would have detected the ship. Then again, I suppose that adding sensors to check above the train for space ships might not make much sense from a cost perspective.
I can't wait until you get to Our Mrs. Reynolds, by the way.
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
I was thinking about my nitpicking, and I realised why I do it, why I'm kind of an active participant. When I'm watching tv and there's something wrong with the set, I just accept it, if I notice it at all. Slight hum? Where? My brother or father will get up and prod the tv a lot in an effort to get rid of the hum.
It's the opposite with stories. For me, stories are the 'machines' that need prodding when I see a plot break or somesuch.
However, just like a tv hum being pointed out to me, and poked and prodded instead of ignored or leaving it unnoticed, I can see how other people might be very annoyed to have me being a bit nit-picky over stories.
Anyway, with that out the way, and I meant it in the most good natured sense, I just wanted to explain why I realised it wasn't such a great idea to take it apart (and believe, I really could if I tried, to the point when you would run away screaming ):
Noemon, the train issue is kind of interesting. Twinky was right; there are tiny windows on the train and if you listen to the ship, it makes a very faint sound considering its size. It is believable when you think about it.
#3 (Bushwacked) was definately scary. When I was falling asleep I kept seeing scenes from it (mentioned vaguely because of spoilers). Yes, I'm a total wuss, but no I didn't have nightmares.
I also didn't like this because of Jayne's little joke. I know Jayne's not supposed to be a very nice character but that was totally out of line .
#4 (Shindig) ... well you see my reaction. It was a great relief after the constant tension and gore of Bushwacked. Very funny, near-perfectly written.
The thing about Firefly I've noticed so far is the dialogue is never bad. In most shows there's that line which makes you cringe, but Firefly doesn't really have these .
I'm still waiting for the villan without an accent ! I suppose it must be from historical convention- when the Russians were evil, when the Germans were evil etc., when the cockneys were low down, yet rather comical criminals .
[Oh and the entire scene at the start with the electronic billiards was a set up for the sign (sorry once again for being vague), which was good because I was thinking "how is it easier to have fake balls that real ones?" ]
quote:Yes, I'm a total wuss, but no I didn't have nightmares.
I gave myself nightmares this week playing Resident Evil 4. It's one of the best games I've ever played, but because I play it alone in the dark with a surround sound speaker system, I scare the bejeezus out of myself and wind up waking up in a cold sweat wondering where my shotgun is.
posted
It's really intense. More so than watching a scary movie, because you're right there in it and oh my god do those dogs have TENTACLES?, you know?
Is your essay done yet?
Posts: 10886 | Registered: Feb 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
Raja's distaste for picking things apart has caused me no end of frustration over the years. You can't know how much you love and appreciate a movie until you've taken every loose thread and pulled it apart and find out just how much of the fabric remains. I guess he's just happy wearing shabby pants. Or something. Posts: 3243 | Registered: Apr 2002
| IP: Logged |
I'm so fed up with it. I'm reaching the point where I honestly don't care if government officials are corrupt or not as long as I don't have to write about it!
Posts: 8473 | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged |
You know how rare it is for movies, let alone tv shows, to carry of the whole 'flashback to a somewhat troubled childhood/youth' thing? Well, to my mind, Firefly manages it.
Book's got a story !
Again, nothing was wrong with this episode. The dialogue is so clean, I still can't get over it! I have a reaction to things that happen, yes, but it's a reaction to the intended meaning of the lines. (Except for a sudden outburst of "She turned me into a newt!". Luckily my roomate isn't home.)
Speaking of home, there was rather a lot of it in this episode. I'm actually kind of confused why it was called "Safe", because there wasn't very much safety and there wasn't really a lack of safety enough to be an ironic title. Hm.
Favourite line (from Jayne, surprisingly): "Dear diary. Today I was pompous and my sister was crazy."
Why is this show so awesome?
ps. So, twinky. You play the guitar, right? Can you play the themesong?
Posts: 8473 | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged |
(I have to be really careful what I say about this one, because of spoilers.)
It's getting kind of redundant to say it was fabulous. They all are. If I find one that isn't I'll comment but so far except for the blood-and-guts of "Bushwacked" I'm liking them all.
The best thing about this episode is I didn't see "it" coming at all. You know what "it" is if you've seen it. I can't really say anymore .
I like the growing Inara/Mal thing. It's very well done .
I'm dying to know about Book!
My only question is River's lack of picking up "it". She barely featured in this episode- perhaps she wasn't feeling so coherant- but compared to "Safe" I wondered why she had no reaction. One possibility is that she had a scene but it was edited out. It would have given "it" away, that's for sure.
quote:I like the growing Inara/Mal thing. It's very well done .
I'm dying to know about Book!
Well, you're going to really hate them for canceling the show . . .
Also, River's still very much in and out at this point, mentally. She's very complex, and only gets more complex as the series goes on (you'll love/hate the last episode).
Posts: 15770 | Registered: Dec 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
Don't tell me that! My brain immediately went in to scenario mode and none of the scenarios were good!
Don't tell me anything! If they don't explain any of the plots, or people turn out to be the ravaging blood-blatter beast of Traal that's okay as long as I don't KNOW!
I suppose, there's always the movie.
Posts: 8473 | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
Teshi- There's a deleted scene from Our Mrs. Reynolds that I absolutely love that features River.
Posts: 4655 | Registered: Jan 2002
| IP: Logged |
This one was the most sensitive one so far. Or perhaps I'm in a more sensitive mood, having just finished the essay and suffering from mild-illness-that-strikes-at-inconvenient-times. I really liked it, of course, even the somewhat deus-ex-machina subplot (with Fess), which actually managed to be really good . (Of course I liked it! do I even have to say that anymore?)
Yeah, so this one definately did some major character development for Jayne, River, Simon and Kaylee, which was really nice to see more of who they are and more of where they could have gone had people not been murderers and killed one of the best shows ever conceived </rant>.
I have to say that Jayne is one of the funniest characters EVER written. And it's simply because he's so NOT funny, hee hee.
This episode could have been a lot longer. I think that's the case with all of the episodes except "Serenity". They should have done a Sharpe-style tv-movie thing, darnit.
posted
So twink, you really count The Message among your favorites? I'd love to hear your thoughts on it--it's always left me cold (well, compared to the other episodes of Firefly. Compared to any other show it's great stuff).
Teshi, you'll get your wish to see a more developed, extended storyline this Sept. when the movie comes out. It occurred to me that you might not know that one was in the works. Same cast, with Joss still at the helm. Reavers are going to figure heavily into the plot, which I was a little disappointed by, but even so, it's going to be Firefly (well, Serenity really), so you know it's going to be good.
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
Hm. I don't like the reavers because they're really too grusome for me to watch much of. It turns the plot into horror. I hope the movie's not completely dominated by reavers...
But yes, I am looking forward to having a longer plot, although I have no idea how its going to work, what with half-invented characters and all.
Posts: 8473 | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
To me the reavers are much more frightening when they're alluded to than they possibly could be when actually shown on the screen. But yeah, I don't really go in for horror much either.
What do you mean when you say that the characters are half-invented?
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
According to what I've read, the movie is going to be done in such a way as to be accessible to people who aren't familiar with Firefly, without being a retread of what those of us who *are* familiar have already seen. How Joss is going to pull that off I don't know, but if anyone can do it he can.
Something that I've wondered about--that colony ship had an atmosphere, and wasn't especially cold from what I could see. Why didn't they smell the bodies instantly when they opened the door into that chamber?
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
quote:So twink, you really count The Message among your favorites?
Basically because the music at the end is unbelievable. I get shivers listening to it. I really, really hope that one day some of the music from the show (particularly the piano and string selections) will be available on a CD.
As to reavers, they can't be offscreen monsters-under-the-bed forever. Sooner or later we'll have to meet them (more so than we already have, of course).
Posts: 10886 | Registered: Feb 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
Hm...I'll have to listen to that when I get home from class tonight. The only non-theme music I really recall from the show is at the beginning of Heart of Gold.
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
The Reavers are also the only "villain" that has already been introduced and can be used as an antagonist.
As for the smell not assaulting their noses instantly...it's more dramatic?
The pressure outside the 'lock was higher inside, so when the door opened, the air blew inward and kept the smell from drifting back until a suitably dramatic moment.
The internal filters were still working, thereby minimizing the amount of odor that could accumulate, but the filters weren't designed to handle that much carnage, so the bodies themselves maintained a thorough stench in close proximity.
posted
As far as I know, they haven't had a running feud with the Alliance - with the exception of hiding River from them and the crew's general dislike.
Which might take a great deal of backstory to bring non-Firefly watchers up to speed.
Reavers, however take two lines of explanation to understand why they are a bad thing.
As for the Blue Hands - sorry, doesn't ring a bell.
posted
Oh, right, you're the one that always says something about Dukes of Hazzard in Spaaaaaaace. I knew there was some otherwise sane, upstanding member of the community that had a problem with Firefly, but I couldn't remember who it was.
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
quote:The only non-theme music I really recall from the show is at the beginning of Heart of Gold.
The theme is fine and all, but the string and piano stuff (there's one chord progression in particular that is used in several poignant moments)... oh, man.
In the DVD extras the composer says that after writing the bit at the end of The Message he called Joss and said "look, I've got this segment here but it's just too beautiful for the scene -- I wrote it as a goodbye to the show," and Joss said "leave it in." I'm glad he did.
Posts: 10886 | Registered: Feb 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
I think the Reavers are one of the weakest aspects of the show. They're not important or necessary. They're the cliched nightmare monster with no other purpose than to scare. They don't serve any useful purpose.
Posts: 4655 | Registered: Jan 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
As Twinky noted, I was drawing a parallel between the pointless eye candy of Daisy Duke and the nearly pointless eye candy of Joylene Blaylock.
Although I feel the need to add the disclaimer that I don't think Enterprise is a particularly good show either...I lost it when they mounted phaser cannons on retractable mechanical arms...
posted
I don't know about pointless - they do provide a hard and fast baseline of "evil" in an otherwise ambiguous mythology.
The social and political commentary viewers might derive from the "Pax Alliance" doesn't exist when you try common ground with someone or something so undeniably despicable as the Reavers.
In some respects, it's like using Nazis in movies...very few people ever mourn the Nazi dead or try to argue that the Nazis are terribly misunderstood creatures and we need to broaden our points of view to encompass theirs.
Are the Reavers particularly well thought out or especially creative as villains go? Not really.
But they do service a purpose.
-Trevor
P.S. Anyone have a count on Godwin's Law yet?
Edit: Sorry Twinky - there was nothing else on in the same time slot. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.
posted
I've read people theorizing that the reavers represent the a kind of clawing emptiness that is battling to take over Mal's soul after he's stripped of his faith at the battle of Serenity Valley. I don't think I really buy it though.
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
I just got done watching The Message, and twinky is right that the music is phenomenal. The story, though...it just isn't spectacularly good like the rest of the series. I can't wait to hear Teshi's thoughts on this one. There are a number of things I could say about it, but I don't want to give any plot points away.
Oh, I thought of a another contender for my top three favorite episodes--Out of Gas. What's that make, five episodes that are in my top three? And of course, Ariel and Heart of Gold really deserve to be up there too.
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
Printer-friendly view of this topic
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
. 
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
):![[Confused]](confused.gif)
.![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
! I suppose it must be from historical convention- when the Russians were evil, when the Germans were evil etc., when the cockneys were low down, yet rather comical criminals ![[ROFL]](graemlins/rofl.gif)
![[Laugh]](graemlins/laugh.gif)
You're all crazy.![[Angst]](graemlins/angst.gif)
.![[Evil Laugh]](graemlins/evillaugh.gif)
![[Wall Bash]](graemlins/wallbash.gif)
![[Cry]](graemlins/cry.gif)
![[Monkeys]](graemlins/monkeys.gif)
