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fugu, I think many are harping on your phrasing as opposed to your intent. If you had said, "I enjoyed his earlier works more than the later ones", you wouldn't be getting so much flak. The intent is the same but it may be perceived differently by some.
Posts: 2022 | Registered: Mar 2004
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I'm sure I could produce quite wonderful works in the name of Card.
Edit: Of course it wouldn't be near as good as the work of the original. And just for everyone's information I like all of Card's work no matter how it sizes up to his other books.
posted
As Kat pointed out, some of Cards recent works are as good as anything he has ever written.
But if you look over his whole career, there have been quite a few flawed books.
I think that one reason people feel that his books aren't nearly as good as they used to be is because of comparing the books from the last 5-odd years to Card's entire career beforehand.
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While I wish you unparalleled success in any endeavor you undertake, S.R. I hope we don't see any titles like this: Speaker for the Undead..........
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I think punwit has tapped it right on the nose.
Katie, I haven't gotten around to reading the Women of Genesis ones yet, but I bet you're right. I'm sort of burnt on the Enderverse things, though I love Card's dialogue in them, even when the story doesn't push my buttons. I started reading Shadow Puppets while sitting with my mom. It was fun until I realized that Petra main motivation seemed to be getting in Bean's pants so she could have a bunch of smart little Baby Beans. I can't explain why that should bother me, but it did.
That isn't meant as criticism of his writing, more as a statement that it was just becoming less and less the kind of story that pushes my individual buttons. I'm sure there are lots of great stories out there that lots of people enjoy reading that I wouldn't, or that I would have to be in the right mood for.
And there are also some really awful stories, badly written, that I unabashedly enjoy. It was bad pulp fiction that got me through those weeks in ICU, not Cormac MacCarthy or Annie Dillard.
So I admit I have no discernable taste. Posts: 1664 | Registered: Apr 2004
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I would be devistated if Mr. Card abruptly stopped writing. But, at the same time, I'd be relieved because I could finally catch up and read all his books (he's got about twenty years of writing on me).
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AntiCool -- I'm betting Wyrms. Probably becaise it has this big Wyrmy thing that, for some reason, our heroine finds really hot. Interesting world, really, but a climax that is not for the squeamish (or for me, though I claim not to be squeamish )
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[Quote]While I wish you unparalleled success in any endeavor you undertake, S.R. I hope we don't see any titles like this: Speaker for the Undead..........[Quote]
How about Speaker for the Dead Until Reincarnation????? Or Shadow Muppets??? Or Knee in My Side??? I would like to write someday. But with ideas that have boiled in my own head.
Just a question, how does the title President for a Month sound?? For a biography on William Henry Harrison that I've got in the works.
Edit: I started working on the biography before I read Red Prophet so before anyone starts pointing fingers, lets not be pointing fingers!
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That would be one of my guesses as well. I own it, but overall it is probably my least favorite OSC book.
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Syn, I think that Card's issue in the recent Shadow books hasn't been "conservative" at all. It might bear some superficial ties to other conservative causes, but this whole child-rearing issue seems to be a personal one of Card's, not motivated by any larger political strategy.
Posts: 1539 | Registered: Jul 2004
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If not Wyrms, then my next guess would be Hart's Hope, since it more or less begins with child rape by a supposed heroic figure. I liked Orem. He was cool. But I had a lot more sympathy for Quean Beauty than most of the other characters, probably because we didn't have to read about her killing her child. But the idea of making your rapist immortal and giving him constant boils and diarrhea? That just... rocks.
Yeah. I'm evil. But that's not one of his stories that enjoyed very much.
Posts: 1664 | Registered: Apr 2004
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Its ok Geoff *pats Geoff on the back* you're not the only one that lost his mind.......and by the way......why don't you refer to your dad as dad? Just for courtesies(I'm sure I spelt that wrong; so how about just to be polite) sake....I was just curious......
Posts: 6026 | Registered: Dec 2004
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I haven't read Hart's Hope yet. I was guessing Lost Boys. It was just a little too real and too awful for me, and I will never read it again. Kinda like I thought Requiem For A Dream was a beautiful, touching, meaningful movie and I will never watch it again. Unless I had kids, in which case I'd show it to them around adolesence. As I have no intention of having kids, it's probably a moot point.
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I am a believer in looking out for children, but what bothered me was the whole, "I am gay, but I am going to marry a woman thing." And the whole circle of life speach, and also the fact that Bean and Petra knew that was going to happen, but they went to that guy anyway. That just bothered me a lot.
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I have been unable to ever finish Lost Boys. That book hits waaaaaaaaay too close to home. One of these days I'll manage it.
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It was painful to reread it. Even though I don't have children, several parts of it made me cry, especially the end, which was not something I did when I read it when I was younger.
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I actually advised my mom not to read it. We're very similar in a lot of ways, and with how it hit me, and me not being a parent, I really didn't think she'd want to read it. That's the only time I've ever told someone not to read an OSC book.
posted
I would say that Card's books keep getting more and more emotionally engrossing the more he writes, and consequentially more and more exhausting to read. He gets so far into their thoughts and emotions that it becomes quite a lot to work through.
I must say that his insights in all his "historical fiction" works have been pretty influential in how I think about those people and events later on. I still picture Sam floating around on a chair when I read in the Book of Mormon.
I do have to take a break from the genius-level conversation that his characters always have. It makes me feel like a slow thinker. Sometimes I wish Card would create a character of more average intelligence and perception---someone I could relate to.
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kq, me too. That was the most emotional and poignant book I have ever read. I recommend it to everyone I can.
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quote: I would say that Card's books keep getting more and more emotionally engrossing the more he writes, and consequentially more and more exhausting to read.
Really, you think so? One of the reasons I don't like his newer stuff is that his characters seem increasingly fake, didactic, and divorced from real emotion. There's not much "real" emotion in his books anymore, at least not as I'd recognize it -- not even in Enchantment, which I otherwise enjoyed; all the characters' motivations just seemed plastic to me.
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I sort of felt that too. Stardust by Neil Gaiman is a good parellel for that book and I liked it much better for some reason. I must figure out why....
Posts: 9942 | Registered: Mar 2003
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Hrm. Enchantment I am going to disagree with you on, Tom. His other new stuff, I agree... the character's aren't very well emotionally driven. Enchantment, however, he definetely got into the heads of Jewish Russian Immigrants. I gave it to my friend Lena, (a Jewish soviet immigrant), who absolutely HATES fantasy and sci-fi, and she loved it... she identified very completely with Ivan, and said Ivan's parents were perfect extrapolations of people she knew in Minsk.
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Whoo hoo?? Title...good yes? President For a Month: The Life of William Henry Harrison I began working on it before I read Red Prophet but mostly I just want to know if you guys think it is a good title.........
Posts: 6026 | Registered: Dec 2004
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posted
The last book of his I read was Pastwatch, and that was some considerable time ago. It was okay. My Card collection is not among the books I've packed to take with me on my move. I do, however, plan to read Lost Boys someday.
That reminds me, though, that I need to pick up a copy of Neuromancer so I can pack it. It's been way too long since I read that one.
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Hart's Hope is my least favorite OSC book - it didn't speak to me at all, didn't engage me or keep me engaged. However, that is the only one in that category. My favorites would include Pastwatch and Enchantment. I loved them.
I would be sad if he quit writing. I want more books! Besides, part of the reason I enjoy reading his books so much is so I can learn from the best. [/butt kissing] Cuz, ya know, I write sci-fi, too.
Would I want to meet him in person? Yeah, it'd be cool to go to a book signing. On the other hand, I've never been one of those types who are enamored of celebrities and such, so if it never happens, it's not a big deal. At least I get his books - that's way more important.
Edit: to correct title of book. Which just goes to show how much it didn't agree with me.
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Hart Song? Do you mean Hart's Hope? Or perhaps we should compromise: Hart Soap!
I don't refer to Card as "dad", like others have already said, because I hate the idea of name-dropping.
Also, not everyone who reads this site is necessarily aware that the guy named "Puppy" is Orson Scott Card's son. I think it would be distracting and confusing if I used a different name for him than everyone else. So I say "Card" and "OSC" and figure that most people will just read it and get the point without needing to stop and go, "WOW! This guy is Orson Scott Card's SON! Whoop-de-frickin-DOO!"
Or worse, "What's this guy talking about? What does some idiot's dad have to do with my favorite writer?"
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Not my favourite - actually, I'm hard-pressed to say what my favourite is.
Probably a cross between the Alvin Maker series and (oddly) The Folk of the Fringe.
If OSC did stop writing I would be kinda upset. I remember a couple of years after I had first started reading Card, I went to America (2003 it was. Washington).
We had a day off from this law thingy we were doing so I went in hunt of a bookstore. And there I found it. Rows and rows of OSC books that are out of print / not sold in Australia. It was amazing.
I bought 8. Sure, I couldn't afford dinner for a couple of days. But hey! That feeling - all these new Card books just waiting for me to delve into them - was fantastic.
So, I'd miss that.
( I love that feeling when you discover a new author, read one of their books, love it and then realise "Hey, there's an entire back catalogue for me to explore now!" )
Posts: 4393 | Registered: Aug 2003
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I would be sad -- actually, that should be will be sad, as OSC will likely retire from writing during my lifetime.
While I don't read everything he writes, I look forward and devour most of his books. And reread his older ones often. While Wyrms is extremely intense, it's one I enjoy rereading. Hart's Hope, not so much. And Lost Boys I barely finished once, and will never read again (I alternated between sobbing and fury after reading the short).
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Personally, as a theatre guy, I wouldn't mind if he stopped writing novels if it meant he was going to focus more on plays. Then again, I have been patiently waiting for the next two Pastwatch books . . . and maybe a sequel to Enchantment . . . and more scripture-based novels . . . Posts: 786 | Registered: Jun 2003
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I suppose I would eventually stop buying his books.
Hart's Hope is probably my favorite novel. I do not blame Beauty for what she did to Palicrovol, but I do blame her for what she did to his allies and her subjects. A Planet Called Treason was very enjoyable as well, although it is obviously a very early work. I will have to find Treason now. Taken separately, Treasure Box and Homebody were good, but when I read them one right after the other they seemed too similar. Lost Boys the book blew Lost Boys the short story out of the water.
IMHO, Card is one of the best short story writers of the latter half of the twentieth century. I suppose I need to read more short stories, but damn! The only author with such a consistently excellent output (edit: when only short stories are considered) of the last century was Saki.
Edit: I have not read any of the Women of Genesis series. How do they compare to his other novels?
posted
I wouldn't be disappointed at all if he stopped working on books that were part of a series. I found that the Alvin books and the Shadow series both became extremely tedious. I haven't read the latest books in either series.
On the other hand, I really enjoy his standalone novels. Lost Boys is my favorite Card novel, and books like Enchantment and Homebody are a close second. It is my hope that when he wraps up his series work, he sticks to standalone novels. It's because of these books that he's one of my favorite authors.
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I know not everyone is going to love everything I love, but considering I feel Hart's Hope is a masterpiece I can't believe there are people who truly dislike it.
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I would have to second that motion, Fitz. Except for the Lovelock series. It is not just OSC either; most series longer than three or four books tend to decline in quality.
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Danzig - True, but I fully expect Martin to break that streak. If only the fourth would come out already. Posts: 7600 | Registered: Jan 2001
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I fear Lovelock may never make it beyond book one. It was my understanding that Lovelock was a prospective trilogy, though. I think Orson Scott Card is more than capable of writing a great trilogy. I agree though that any series can get tedious beyond three books, despite the skill of the author.
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