posted
I remember crying sitting on the kitchen floor after putting my six year old daughter to bed, seriously contemplating turning myself over to the police for being a criminally bad mother. It helped a lot, however, to talk to my sister about it. She's a doctor and could tell me exactly what hormones were causing havoc with my daughters emotions and how and why. She also told me it would get better, and it did although it took a few months.
To me it sounds like your daughter may be in this period of turmoil right now. If you truly hate whining, it might be easier to make her stop if you wait a while. If messing with her food or kicking the dog were what got to you in a bad way, that's what she would be doing. In the meantime, you'll just have to suffer. Just don't lose faith in yourself or in your parenting abilities.
Think of it as a foretaste of what puberty will be like Posts: 99 | Registered: Apr 2003
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posted
PSI-- We're having the same problem with Super-K. The 'can't understand you' method is starting to work, but we've had to discipline ourselves to use it consistently. I wish we had done it MUCH sooner-- he learned that talking in that type of voice got him attention, and we're having to retrain him.
The problem with raising children is that so often you figure out how to eliminate bad behavior after it's already become a habit. Hindsight, blah, blah, blah. So it's only useful for the next child. But when that child comes around, she has a completely different set of problems, so you don't even get a chance to use the mad skillz you developed with the first one. . .
Posts: 14554 | Registered: Dec 1999
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posted
I don't remember what my mom did when I was a whiny kid. I remember learning very quickly that it was pointless to whine, though. Maybe I'll ask her and come back with some advice.
I do remember being a kid and not wanting to go to bed because I was afraid I'd have nightmares. :/ I never did, but I was afraid I would.
Posts: 4816 | Registered: Apr 2003
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posted
Aspectre, I think I do understand what you are trying to say here. Certainly none of us want to stifle our kids' voices. I know I don't. But there are two conflicting goals at work here (for me). One is the goal of letting my child express himself. The second is the goal of having a home where everyone can feel at peace, relaxed, themselves. Having a six-year-old whining and shrieking directly interferes with the second goal (and not just for the parents; other siblings might be trying to do homework or talk with friends or just read in front of the fireplace.) It is not at all inappropriate for parents to say something like "we understand that you are going through a tough time right now and we want to help you through this. However, you MAY NOT do xyz; it disturbs our peaceful home, and that is not good for any of us. Feel free to be extra loud in your bedroom." That, by the way, is as close to an exact quote as I can come up with for what I said to my daughter when she was seven and particularly loud and whiny and shrieky. She was also stubborn. It took some time for it to sink in. But she's thirteen now. We did survive. Now let's see if we can survive thirteen…
Posts: 628 | Registered: Nov 1999
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posted
It's so nice to know that I'm not the only parent that has had problems with whining! Thanks for all the great suggestions.
Last night we sat down and had a talk with Operaetta. It ended with us saying that from now on she would get one warning to stop whining, and after that her punishment would be no story time that night and no reading in her bed. Usually after story time the kids get 30 min. to look at books in their beds before lights out. So effectively the punishment means an early bedtime as well. Operaetta was very distressed by this plan, so that's good. I will let you all know how it goes.
Aspectre, do you have children? I'm wondering if you truly understand what the problem I'm having with my daughter is all about. It's not so much the tone of voice, it's the fact that she is talking back. We've always taught our children that they are free to disagree with us and discuss why. However, when I say that we can't eat at McDonald's and Operaetta whines, cries, and stomps around for the next hour this is not acceptable. Does this help your understanding?
quote:. . . maybe you just have to turn it into an endurance contest? Surely an adult can be more stubborn than a child . . .
hehehe . . . I wish!
-o-
I do believe in spanking, but not for this. If your child has no other issues, maybe you can get away with pulling out the Big Gun for whining, but when you escalate to Big Things too quickly, you run out of things to escalate to when worse behaviors come along. Pretty soon, you may find that you spank for any offense. The lack of differentiation between punishments for minor versus major infractions is one of the indicators that often leads to child abuse.
Similarly, taking away a meal for this strikes me as using an excessively Big Gun.
-o-
When my daughters' whine I say, "Use big girl voice," and I don't respond to what they are actually saying. If the whining continues, I simply ignore it. Luckily, my daughters don't really have a whining problem--I've got plenty of other problems to make up for it!--but if they were to continue to the point where it was really aggravating me, I suppose would put them in time out. When they throw tantrums, I put them in time out and ignore them.
I have a digital timer which they can clearly see me set. Time-out lasts exactly six minutes, because they are six years old. HOWEVER, time out does not begin until they are quiet. The screaming is done, any physical demonstrating is done, and so forth. Until then, time-out has not begun. Any time they start back up again, the timer gets reset, and I say "Oh, time out hasn't started yet!" I find this pretty effective in shorting out any tantrums while in time-out. Something about being aware that there is a physical mechanism involved in ending time-out, and not merely my whim (How angry am I? Have I forgotten they are there?) seems to empower them: they control when they get out of time-out.
Posts: 13680 | Registered: Mar 2002
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posted
I had a lot of ideas on what parents should do that I only realized were unrealistic after I had kids.
just sayin'
It is perfectly legitimate to train your children not to whine. Their whining interferes with the efficient and peaceful running of your household. It can also be disrespectful of you, and accepting disrespect undermines you ability to effectively teach your children. (Nonparents also imagine that they will have endless amounts of patience when they have kids, or that they will only have to deal with one problem at a time, allowing them to devote all of their resources to that one problem; in reality, it doesn't work out like this.) Finally, whining will not be acceptable in later life, be it at school or in the workforce. Can you imagine if your spouse whined all the time? So training your child not to whine is living up to your commitment to prepare him or her for later life.
-o-
I want to reiterate my feeling that you should not use too big a punishment for whining (though). Believe me, there are worse things. I really think ignoring, coupled with time-out only when you are really at the end of your patience, is the best approach. Escalating often causes your kids to escalate (believe me, another lesson learned the hard way!) and taking away stuff teaches your daughter that whining gets to you, and so if she is angry (say she asked for a cookie and you didn't give it to her) and she wants to make you mad, because she's mad, well she now knows what will do it. If she finds that whining doesn't make you mad, it simply doesn't get results (even if you put her in time-out, do so dispassionately: you are not mad, you are removing her because her whining is interfering with whatever you need to be doing right now), then she hasn't learned how to get your goat, how to get even with you. She has simply found something that is ineffective.
She will stop whining when she decides it is ineffective. Somebody else said this, and it is absolutely true. However, you may not always know what her goals are. Her goal may no longer be to get the cookie, but to annoy you for saying no. If you are getting bent out of shape, then, her whining is effective whether or not she gets the cookie. So you need to make sure it isn'nt effective. If you can, figure out what she gets out of it. But a fairly good bet is that it has to do with your reaction, or the effect of whining on you.
Posts: 13680 | Registered: Mar 2002
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quote: The room method has a tendance to escalate when it starts with whining. If it's just a punishment for arguing with her brother, etc., she's cool with it. But for some reason if I send her to her room because she's whining she goes beserk. Screaming, refusing to stay in room, etc. It's like the Exorcist but without the head spinny and vomiting thing.
The one thing I haven't seen anyone mention in this thread is that this sounds simply like attention getting behavior. She doesn't mind being put in her room for something she did wrong, but when she's whining, she wants your attention, and putting her in the room is unbearable, because it does the opposite of what she wants.
Likewise, taking away story time is taking away attention time, so that could be effective.
Personally, I think story time is such an important learning time that I would never use it as punishment. But since you've already outlined this as the result when she whines, you should carry through with it. Never fail to carry out a punishment you have threatened. (But never threaten a punishment for reasons the child can't understand)
I think you've done the right thing in terms of letting her know IN ADVANCE what the result will be if she whines. Once she is whining, she won't be thinking rationally about consequenses. But sitting her down and telling her what WILL HAPPEN gives her time to process the thoughts behind her behavior. This is when she will actually learn.
I also concur with many people here who suggest you should ignore her when she whines. Since it seems to be your attention that she wants, any attention, good or bad, will reinforce the behavior.
The only problem I see with your current "agreement" is that the punishment doesn't occur until bedtime. In the meantime, she has already lost her story, so does that mean she could whine for the rest of the day? If that happens, are you back to putting her in her room?
If this turns out to be a problem, I would have the talk with her over again, and swap the loss of bedtime for an immediate trip to her room. Remember, the key is to make this stipulation BEFORE the whining episode happens, so she has time to process it.
Posts: 3735 | Registered: Mar 2002
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posted
I don't know how to stop it. I do know that it's useless to whine at my house, doesn't get you anywhere except to make mum angry.... But I do know you should nip it in the bud as soon as you can. I have a cousin who is about 10 or 11 and still whines in that little baby voice, and another cousin who is 19 and still whines if she doesnt get her way..... Don't let them get away with whining it only gets more annoying as they get older. And it's bad to use the tactic that you will give them what they want if they stop whining because they will still whine next time so that you will reward them when they stop..... Well thats my 2 cents. Well 5 cents (they don't have 2 cents anymore in NZ).
Posts: 315 | Registered: Jun 2002
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