I just heard Ender's Game script got greenlighted with Asa Butterfield as Ender and Harrison Ford as Graff. Gavin Hood to direct. Expected release 2013.
Did I miss the pandemonium? No running through the streets screaming? No high-fives? No fist-bumps? No groans?
I know it's not writing related...but, geez, not a peep from anyone...
Posted by aspirit (Member # 7974) on :
I thought everyone knew about the movie and the casting of Butterfield as Ender, but...wow, the movie will be full of big names, won't it? That makes me a little nervous. Viewers will carry in their memories of other characters into the movie. Oh, well. I try not to judge a movie before I at least watch the trailer.
Posted by JenniferHicks (Member # 8201) on :
I like Harrison Ford, but I think he's miscast as Graff. I would have rather seen him as Mazer Rackham. As for Asa Butterfield, all I've seen are photos (I haven't seen "Hugo" yet) and he does look about what I always imagined Ender would look like.
The cast also includes Abigail Breslin as Valentine and Hailee Stansfeld as Petra.
I'm not doing any fist-bumping yet. Ender's Game has been one of my favorite books since I was 10. I'm anxious about a movie version because I'm afraid they'll mess it up.
Posted by Crystal Stevens (Member # 8006) on :
I agree with you, Jennifer. Too many times I've seen the movies totally ruin how the book was written. I sure hope they do it well.
Posted by Corin224 (Member # 2513) on :
Wow . . . I thought the news had already been made.
Yeah, I actually like Ford as Graff . . . exactly what I pictured, and Ben Kingsley as Rackham is what I'd heard and is spectacular.
Oh, and Hailee Stanfield (the girl from True Grit) is Petra Arkanian.
And don't worry too much about how bad the movie might be. It appears Card's a producer, so while he's not making ALL the decisions, he's providing a LOT of input.
I've been posting updates on my Facebook daily . . . figured there was similar happening around here, and I just wasn't looking closely enough.
Good stuff happening. Spectacular casting, if you ask me.
Posted by Treamayne (Member # 9700) on :
quote:Originally posted by Crystal Stevens: I agree with you, Jennifer. Too many times I've seen the movies totally ruin how the book was written. I sure hope they do it well.
Not to mention I'm fairly sure this isn't the first time Ender's been greenlighted - though it's never seen completion yet.
There was one line in that article that really scared me:
"Set in Earth's utopian future, "Ender's Game" stars "
uhhh....Utopian? I never got that from the book.
In the end I'll do like I do with all movie adaptations, expect the worst and hope for the best.
Posted by Brendan (Member # 6044) on :
Asa Butterfield is how I imagined Bean, not Ender. Is there someone cast for Bean yet? That is perhaps (behind Ender and Graf) the third most important case member.
Abigail Breslin as Valentine is similar to how I imagined Valentine, but Petra I always thought had harder lines in her face than Hailee Stansfeld (Carrie-Anne Moss style). As for Jimmy Pinchak as Peter, he's got the psychotic look - perhaps too much - but does he have the super intelligent look that is really needed to carry Peter off?
Posted by Corin224 (Member # 2513) on :
Here's the latest casting news that I've seen. Looks like they kept the racial variety in the cast, like the book. This is the first I've seen of most of these. Can't wait to pick through the casting.
Shooting starts after the first of the year, and the release date is March 2013. It's pretty solid, and definitely not a false start this time.
Posted by Corin224 (Member # 2513) on :
I LOVE Aramis Knight as bean. Looks the part, though I can't remember him IN anything.
Posted by JenniferHicks (Member # 8201) on :
Thanks, Corin. That's a more extensive cast list than I've seen anywhere else. I had no idea that so many of the Battle School kids had been cast.
Posted by Treamayne (Member # 9700) on :
IMDB Lists Ben Kingsley as Mazer too. Interesting.
It also looks like they are increasing the ages of the cast. The actor playing Ender is 14 now, and Bean is 12. Wonder if they'll accelerate the timeline to keep the same actors for all stages of the movie (since EG is a few years from when Ender leaves for Battleshool until he finishes the war - and aging/regressing young actors is much harder then adults) or if they'll find even younger people to play the earlier parts of the roles?
[ December 23, 2011, 06:56 PM: Message edited by: Treamayne ]
Posted by EVOC (Member # 9381) on :
The problem is a movie can never capture what a book can. So to expect a movie to be as good as a book is a tall order. I have seen a few come close, but generally its hard to do.
Capturing thought and other moments from the book will be hard. So, those of us with some preconceived notions will disappointed.
Posted by LDWriter2 (Member # 9148) on :
I thought it was ready to be shown. I saw the trailer a couple of months ago, which I mentioned in the TV and movies thread. I might be misremembering but I thought the release date was sometime next year.
Or there wasn't a release date. My memory seems to be a bit foggy on that point. As to how well they do.. I agree with Evoc and those who seem to be saying that they mess up a lot of books to movies but not all of them. So I don't know how well they will do... or have done.
Posted by Treamayne (Member # 9700) on :
Well, I am prepared to like both. Princess Bride makes a much better movie than book (one of the few where I like the movie better) but Jurassic Park, for example, was a good movie and a good book. Even if they were both good for different reasons. The trick will be accepting it on it's own merits and faults rather than just comparing to the book.
When I say expect the worst and hope for the best: the best is a live action rendition that retains the essense of the story, it's themes and the power that drove us to like it in print format. It can be different and accomplish this, I'd expect differences. The worst (to me) is when they do something like Jumper where the only thing unchanged is the title and the main character names. The whole of the original story is lost in the new "Hollywood vision."
In the latter case, I wouldn't mind so much if they changed the title and bi-lined it as "inspired from X book." That indicates to me, as a consumer, not to expect the same story. But, if you keep the same title and say it is "based on X book" I hope to at least get the essence of the same story.
Looking forward to it no matter the outcome, though.
Posted by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (Member # 59) on :
Haven't seen HUGO yet, but just saw REAL STEEL, and I think that kid would be good as Ender. <shrug>
I'll just be happy to see the movie. (Watching REAL STEEL, I was once again impressed with what they can do in movies now. Special effects are an art form in and of themselves.)
Posted by Robert Nowall (Member # 2764) on :
I was a little surprised to read that they were casting...I thought it'd been held back until actors of the right juvenile age could be cast in the lead parts. (Not that I care much for Ender's Game...I like many other Card books but not that...when the Alvin Maker books come to the big screen, then I'll be interested.)
Of course, once the writer relinquishes his creation to the big screen, he loses what little grip on it he had to begin with. Once a movie's made, the new reader's visions of Ender's Game will be forever dominated by what they see in the media...
(Not that I'd be likely to go anyway...I'm not a big moviegoer, and my most recent movie-viewing was on TV / DVD, wading through The Lord of the Rings extended edition again, catching Tora! Tora! Tora! on DVD, and, yesterday, watching the end of Man Hunt. When the next Pixar or the new Hobbit is in theaters, I'll go.)
Posted by Brendan (Member # 6044) on :
I read that OSC is a producer on this project. If true, then he would have more control than a typical author.
Posted by redux (Member # 9277) on :
My biggest concern about this movie is the director Gavin Hood. I saw X-Men Origins: Wolverine and despite a good cast of actors the whole production felt uninspired.
Posted by MartinV (Member # 5512) on :
quote:Originally posted by Corin224: I LOVE Aramis Knight as bean. Looks the part, though I can't remember him IN anything.
Well, at least he looks like Greek with African ancestry. Meanwhile, Hailee Steinfeld doesn't strike me as an Armenian.
I think this is simply the industry's way of trying to come up with something that will replace the Harry Potter madness with something else. Ender and Bean have eight books combined so it can last at least as long as the Potter mania. Plus, it's American, not British. That should make Hollywood happy.
Edit: judging from the fact most of the actors are 15-year-olds, I think we can expect the romance element to enter a bit sooner than book 3.
Posted by LDWriter2 (Member # 9148) on :
Martin you might be right but they have already tried to find the next Potter madness with Hunger Games and, as I have learned recently, "Daughter of Smoke and Bones" Or is it Bones and Smoke?
Posted by Corin224 (Member # 2513) on :
Yeah, there's really no 'next Potter' at the moment. Hunger Games won't cut it, since it's decidedly NOT children's material, and IMHO, most of the Ender series is unfilmable. MAYBE Speaker, but it won't draw crowds like Potter.
And don't get too down on the casting 'til we see some production shots. Between makeup and voice coaching, nationality is something that can change drastically on film.
So far, much of what I'm seeing looks very positive, and as a practiced film fanboy, I've learned to be a bit skeptical.
And remember, OSC talks rather passionately about making sure you have control when your film gets made if you care at all about it. His Producer title is NOT just a vanity title. He may not be doing the daily grind type of work, but you can rest assured he'll be helping make the important decisions everybody's so worried about.
Posted by shimiqua (Member # 7760) on :
I'm sorry.... Moises Arias as Bonzo?
Rico and Bonzo don't mix... I'll give him a chance, but anybody associated with Hannah Montana makes me nervous.
That is all.
I'm super excited for the movie though.
Posted by redux (Member # 9277) on :
I think "Eragon" and "Percy Jackson and the Olympians" were expected to rival the Potter movie franchise but they both fell by the wayside. I personally don't think "Ender" has the potential to be an explosive movie franchise like "Potter" or even "Twilight."
This is probably why I would be a failed movie producer.... but I would have James Cameron directing "Ender" using his 3D technology. I remember watching the start of "Avatar" when Sully wakes from cryo in zero-G and the camera orienting itself thinking - wow, that would work in "Ender's Game."
Posted by MartinV (Member # 5512) on :
quote:Originally posted by Corin224: And remember, OSC talks rather passionately about making sure you have control when your film gets made if you care at all about it. His Producer title is NOT just a vanity title.
OK, that's good to hear because in my fantasies I wanted to do that too in case any of my stories go that far but I thought I was pushing it.
Posted by Corin224 (Member # 2513) on :
Well, MartinV, it's a great goal, but it's not a terribly realistic one. OSC also talks about the fact that holding out for that kind of control is a virtual guarantee your movie won't get made. You also have to make sure you know how to produce a movie well. He's spent a lot of time getting that knowledge, and he's still a relative newbie from what I understand. But he has a lot of pull, and he's worked in a lot of different media, so he's getting away with it.
The ONLY other writer I know of that's done this is Suzanne Collins. She wrote the screenplay for Hunger Games, and is an Executive Producer, but she's spent over a decade writing for Nickelodeon and getting TV shows out the door, so she's not a newbie to the industry.
I'm sure others have done it, and a lot of producers / directors have tried to go the 'writer' route, but it's not a common crossover.
Posted by Treamayne (Member # 9700) on :
Dean Koontz walked out on USA when they were making the TV movie of his Frankenstein book (The movie went ahead anyway with changes and was not very good as I recall). So, I guess he had input but when they wouldn't follow the story he made, he took his name off of it. I'm pretty sure JKR was very involved with all the Potter movies though - enough to insist they only cast from the UK.
I think Eragon and Percy Jackson could have been up there with the Potter films, if they had been done correctly. They weren't, though, so I doubt we'll see more of Eragon (though all 4 books were decent I thought) but book 2 (Sea of Monsters) of Percy is slated for film in 2013 I think.
Also, I hear Odd Thomas is coming to film too.
Posted by LDWriter2 (Member # 9148) on :
This is TV but I'm kinda surprised the Jim Butcher was so involved with the TV Dresden Files after they changed it so much. It was a totally different story and character.
I thought I heard they were doing a second Eragon. Maybe they changed their minds.
Hmmm, you know there are Werewolf books and vampire but are they many books about Frankenstein... not counting remakes of the basic story. Green has various Frankenstein creations as a guest, in two of his series every so often but I don't recall any others. Now that could make an interesting challenge.
Posted by Corin224 (Member # 2513) on :
quote:This is TV but I'm kinda surprised the Jim Butcher was so involved with the TV Dresden Files after they changed it so much.
Not just stayed involved, but was thrilled with a lot of the stuff they did. The interviews I saw with him, he was quite clear that it was, as you say, a different character and story, so he didn't feel like his books were threatened by it. He also acknowledged he didn't know enough about how to make a TV show to really second guess all of their decisions. And he admitted to being impressed with some of the changes they made in a "Damn, I wish I'd thought of that" kind of way.
THOSE are the type of writers studios like to work with. He'll definitely benefit from playing nice if he ever gets anything on screen in the future.
How many Dean Koontz books have you seen on screen?
(actually, that's a good question, 'cause I'm not sure I know the answer to that!)
Posted by Treamayne (Member # 9700) on :
Well, some of the changes in Dresden Files were out of necessity too. Such as changing Murphy's name from Karrin to Connie because IRL there is (was?) a Karen Murphy on CPD. The name had to change for legal issues.
And it looks like there have been 17 Koontz books adapted to Film - though how many he participated in and approved the final product is anyone's guess.
Anyway, back on topic. I had a thought - do you all think Ender will be geared to a young audience, teen audience or adult audience? If it is geared to a young audience, do you think the fights and outcomes with Stillson and Bonzo will change much?
V/R
AT
Posted by Tiergan (Member # 7852) on :
I think teen to adult. I think while the leads are all young, to do the movie right it has to have all the violent elements in it to get the movie right. And if they hold back, the movie will lack the impact of the book.
Posted by Corin224 (Member # 2513) on :
Yeah, the whole point of the story is Ender's choice to be not just violent, but ruthless, when it matters. He fights the fight once, and it's for all the chips. You absolutely can't hold back on those scenes with Stilson or Bonzo.
This is definitely a teen to adult movie. Gearing it any younger will be a mistake, IMHO.
Posted by shimiqua (Member # 7760) on :
My favorite children's book is, 'The Wolves in the Walls' by Neil Gaiman. I think we forget that children love to be scared.
Think of all the fairy tales, or monsters in books that are considered creatures from children's stories.
This is probably off-topic, but I think you can gear a book or movie to children and have characters die.
How wussy are we trying to make our children anyway?
Posted by Robert Nowall (Member # 2764) on :
Look at it this way, if an Ender's Game movie is a succes, it'll breed sequels and sell more books---but, like I said above, the writer's further influence over the characters will be severed. But if the movie is a failure---say, like nearly every movie made from a Stephen King book, either artistic or at the box office---it'll still impact sales and such, and Card's control over Ender and Company will still be lost...
Posted by JenniferHicks (Member # 8201) on :
quote:Look at it this way, if an Ender's Game movie is a succes, it'll breed sequels and sell more books---but, like I said above, the writer's further influence over the characters will be severed.
Playing devil's advocate ...
Ender's Game has become a classic in its own right, not dependent on a movie version. Twenty-five years after its debut, it's still consistently in Tor's top 10 best-sellers. The most current Tor list I can find has it at No. 1. And Card has three more novels in the Top 20 there, including two Ender books. I don't think he's in any danger of losing fans or sales if the movie isn't a critical or box-office hit.
I also don't think Card will lose control of his characters. Yes, new readers will be influenced by what they see on the screen. That certainly happened with me when I read "The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo" after knowing who had been cast in the American movie version. In my mind's eye, Blomkvist is Daniel Craig.
But Card has written 12 books in that universe, another one to be published next month, and at least one more in the works. The mythology and characters have a long history that runs much deeper than one movie adaptation. I said earlier up this thread that I'm anxious the movie will not "get it right." But whether it does or not will not stop me from reading the books. They're a different animal. Maybe I'm flattering the general public for thinking most of them must realize that, but I don't think I am.
Edited to add another (long) thought: After all I just said, it occurs to me that really, writers lose control over how their characters are interpreted the moment the novel hits the shelves. Each and every reader interprets what they read in a slightly different way. How I see Ender is mostly likely not the same as how the next random person sees him. I'll admit that a movie does give some "legitimacy" to one interpretation, which is a conglomeration of the script and what the actor and director do with it. But it's still only one interpretation out of the millions that have already been formed by readers worldwide. How I see Ender, Bean, Petra, Peter, etc. won't be changed by how they're portrayed on the screen.
I've probably put way too much thought into this.
[ December 31, 2011, 06:23 PM: Message edited by: JenniferHicks ]
Posted by redux (Member # 9277) on :
quote:Originally posted by Robert Nowall: But if the movie is a failure---say, like nearly every movie made from a Stephen King book...
Do you mean failure as in not being good interpretations of the books or failing at the box office? Since I would say that the majority of movies based on a book or short story by Stephen King have been fairly successful at least in becoming part of the pop culture. But I do readily admit that many of the movies have been quite liberal in their interpretation of the original source.
Posted by LDWriter2 (Member # 9148) on :
I agree with Jennifer. Failure of the movie will not harm OSC all that much.
I don't know the ratings but from what I heard the first couple Lord Of The Rings movies were duds and I don't think it harmed the sell of the books.
Of course that last make of LOTR it is powerful. I wouldn't mind seeing them again.
Posted by Corin224 (Member # 2513) on :
Yeah, anybody see Starship Troopers? Spectacular book, I wanna puke every time I think about my senses being violated by that piece of junk they called the movie version of it. I still love the book and re-read it often.
You make a REAL movie version of it, one that's powerful and that captures people, and THAT'S the one they'll remember. Like the LOTR movies, and like Ender's Game.
If it sucks, people will forget about it and move on, and decades later they might try again, or they might not. But either way, the books will always be some of the best sci-fi ever.
The movie can't hurt that.
Posted by EVOC (Member # 9381) on :
I like Starship Troopers the movie, but in its own way. Of course the book is way better.
The Green Mile and Shawshank Redemption are two great movies. But, I haven't read one thing by Stephen King so I have nothing to compare it.
I have high hopes for Ender's Game, and if it does well enough for sequels that would be great. If they ruin it, I will curse, yell scream, throw a fit then probably forget all about it. But fingers crossed we all love it (something tells me that will be the real debate).
Posted by LDWriter2 (Member # 9148) on :
Oh, yes Starship Troopers is another movie that was bad in one sense but didn't seem to harm the book or writer. Of course kinda hard to harm Heinlein now but he still has a rep. And he of course couldn't assist with the movie.
I hope they don't do to Enders what they did to Starship and take just one small section of the book to run with. I'm not sure if we can tell for sure from the trailer but I don't think they did that.
Or did what they did to "Battlefield: Earth" I never saw that movie but I hear-from a few sources- it was not good.
But some books Hollywood has done a good job with. With Dresden Files I wouldn't minded a few changes if that was all and the same with this movie.
Posted by aspirit (Member # 7974) on :
Battlefied: Earth the movie was a much closer adaptation of the novel than the Starships Troopers movie was to Heinlein's novel of the same name. The dominant themes and overall tone of the Starship Troopers novel were completely different than those of the movie.
I think some major changes for the Ender's Game movie could work well. I once read that Card had written a psychiatrist into one of his movie scripts to give someone for Ender to emote with. I'd rather have a new character than an Ender who comes across through the whole movie as coldly distant from other people.
Anyway, the Ender's Game movie will probably change reader's perceptions, but I doubt it can damage the original novel's popularity. Even atrocious movies like The Last Airbender seemed to have intensified the source material's popularity.
Posted by Corin224 (Member # 2513) on :
quote:I'm not sure if we can tell for sure from the trailer but I don't think they did that.
There's a trailer? Not sure how that can be when they haven't started shooting yet. I've seen a bunch, but they're mostly fan-made, nothing official.
Tho, I have been wrong before. Got a link to it somewhere? If it is legit, I'd love to see it!
Posted by Robert Nowall (Member # 2764) on :
Never had the courage to watch Starship Troopers...though, honestly, it's not one of my favorite Heinleins to begin with.
As for losing control of the characters...take, say, the movie saga of Sherlock Holmes, from the recent Robert Downey Junior one back beyond Basil Rathbone. Some were faithful adaptations, some weren't, some used little more than the names...and, really, do any of you think the Robert Downey Junior ones have anything to do with the characters and stories written and created by Arthur Conan Doyle beyond the names? (I've only seen bits and pieces, and maybe there's more faithful stuff lurking in there somewhere---but, from what I've seen, I doubt it.)
That could be the fate of Ender's Game---maybe all the more so if it's successful.
Posted by EVOC (Member # 9381) on :
quote:Originally posted by Robert Nowall: As for losing control of the characters...take, say, the movie saga of Sherlock Holmes, from the recent Robert Downey Junior one back beyond Basil Rathbone. Some were faithful adaptations, some weren't, some used little more than the names...and, really, do any of you think the Robert Downey Junior ones have anything to do with the characters and stories written and created by Arthur Conan Doyle beyond the names? (I've only seen bits and pieces, and maybe there's more faithful stuff lurking in there somewhere---but, from what I've seen, I doubt it.
I think the James Bond Movies are another good example. Some are good adaptations of the books, others are nothing more then Characters.
Posted by JenniferHicks (Member # 8201) on :
quote:Originally posted by Robert Nowall: As for losing control of the characters...take, say, the movie saga of Sherlock Holmes, from the recent Robert Downey Junior one back beyond Basil Rathbone. Some were faithful adaptations, some weren't, some used little more than the names...and, really, do any of you think the Robert Downey Junior ones have anything to do with the characters and stories written and created by Arthur Conan Doyle beyond the names?
Ah, I see what you're saying. Funny, I've had that same complaint about the Robert Downey Jr. adaptations. They're good, fun movies, but they're not Sherlock Holmes. Same problem I had with the Russell Crowe Robin Hood movie: good movie, but he wasn't playing Robin Hood. Both of those characters are in the public domain and their creators dead and unable to protest the mangling. I would hope with OSC acting as a producer, he won't let something like that happen.
Posted by LDWriter2 (Member # 9148) on :
You have to scroll down all the way to the bottom. But on the way you're see that his novels are being adapted in all kinds of ways. Games, Graphic books, and a couple I wasn't sure if they were other movies, games or what. And that a new Ender book will be out this month.
As to Sherlock Holmes with Downey Jr. I didn't see the first one- I love Holmes, I think it's time I read them again--because it diverted too much from the original but I've heard the second is closer to the original premise.
Posted by MartinV (Member # 5512) on :
quote:Originally posted by LDWriter2: I thought I heard they were doing a second Eragon. Maybe they changed their minds.
Don't get me wrong but the only thing that made the Eragon movie memorable was the kinky torture treatment Sienna Guillory gets from Robert Carlyle. Never thought I would see that in a PG movie...
I like the Sherlock Holmes movies with Robert Downey Jr. but then I like pretty much everything directed by Guy Ritchie.
Posted by redux (Member # 9277) on :
FYI - that trailer is a fan made trailer. It's not the official movie trailer.
Posted by aspirit (Member # 7974) on :
quote:really, do any of you think the Robert Downey Junior ones have anything to do with the characters and stories written and created by Arthur Conan Doyle beyond the names?
I've yet to read the Doyle's stories or see older Sherlock Holmes shows, but I have friends who are fans of the stories and other friends who are fans of the shows. Those who know Holmes only from TV don't seem to like the recent movies much, but the readers say the movies are more faithful adaptations than what they've seen before.
I've seen and enjoyed the movies that star Robert Downey Jr. and Jude Law, and saw many (if not all) of the characteristics described in the Wikipedia article for Doyle's Holmes.
People will carry their own expectations into a movie theater that don't have to do with the source material. Opinions about the actors, director, and producers will bias the viewers before the opening credits roll, just as marketing and pop culture references to the source material will.
I was hoping for no-names for most of the Ender's Game cast so that viewers (particularly those who haven't read the novel) will watch the movie for more than how the characters compare to the actors' previous characters. Some directors know how to handle pre-conceptions well, though.
Anyway, like kdw, I think we should all be happy a movie is finally being made.
Posted by redux (Member # 9277) on :
I've read several of Sir Arthur's Sherlock Holmes stories and in my humblest opinion Downey and Law are no Sherlock and Watson. The screenwriters simply used enough "character tags" to make them sufficiently recognizable.
I personally found the Guy Ritchie film boring and uninspired - much more interested in flashy fight choreography than actual detective work.
Posted by Robert Nowall (Member # 2764) on :
To cite another example...in the books, Tarzan was articulate and literate, an Oxford man if my memory serves, a man who taught himself to read English before he could speak it...but even before the sound era and Johnny Weismuller, once Edgar Rice Burroughs let the movies have Tarzan, his creation was down to "me Tarzan, you Jane." The damage was done.
I understand J. D. Salinger was so distressed by the movie made from one of his short stories---the title escapes me---that he never again sold any of his work for adaptation, so there's never been a "Catcher in the Rye" movie. (Then again, Salinger didn't need the money a quickie movie would have brought in---once his books became texts for the school curriculum, his sales were guaranteed to be high.)
Posted by redux (Member # 9277) on :
quote:Originally posted by Robert Nowall: To cite another example...in the books, Tarzan was articulate and literate, an Oxford man if my memory serves, a man who taught himself to read English before he could speak it...but even before the sound era and Johnny Weismuller, once Edgar Rice Burroughs let the movies have Tarzan, his creation was down to "me Tarzan, you Jane." The damage was done.
You sir are correct! I had forgotten about this bit of trivia! In fact, Tarzan spoke English with a French accent.
On a side note, many of these wonderful heroes - Sherlock Holmes, Tarzan, Conan - can be found on http://www.manybooks.net/
The stories have entered the public domain and are free. So we can read the originals then nitpick the movie adaptations ....
Posted by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (Member # 59) on :
Hey, I'm a Sherlockian (and a Baker Street Irregular, of sorts) from way back, and I love the new movies. But then, I tend to love movies that are violent and funny. <shrug>
The movies show Holmes to be brilliant and eccentric, and Watson to be much smarter than he is portrayed in the books, but it works for me.
As an additional data point, however, I also enjoyed WITHOUT A CLUE. Go figure. Posted by Crystal Stevens (Member # 8006) on :
Tarzan learned English from school books left by his parents in the cabin they built in the African jungle. But the first language he learned was French when he rescued a Frenchman connected with the expedition headed, I believe, by Jane's father. Tarzan took the Frenchman into the jungle and helped him recooperate from his wounds. The Frenchman didn't speak very good English but could read it. This allowed him and Tarzan to communicate so he could teach Tarzan how to speak French.
I've read the complete Tarzan series at least three times. I hope my memory didn't fail me when it came to what I just wrote .
Posted by Robert Nowall (Member # 2764) on :
I don't think Watson was a complete dummy in the books, it's just that Holmes saw his way to the solution much faster than anyone else...see? That's a classic change made for the movies---Holmes remains super brilliant, but Watson becomes a bumbler.
Something along these lines could befall Ender's Game easily...
(Footnote: one of Burroughs's [many] lapses comes when Tarzan posts a sign with his name spelled out---before he could have known how his name would have been spelled.)
Posted by LDWriter2 (Member # 9148) on :
As to the Downey Jr. Holmes. I watched the trailer and I didn't recall any boxing matches nor romance in the books. Of course it's been a long while so I could be forgetting a small scene or two.
But two people at work have seen and loved the second movie. One guy thought the ending was great... no hints of what it was.
Hmm if that was a fan trailer where did they get the space station scenes? Or were the space shots all made up and none will be in the movie?
And I would love for them to do a trailer for my first book published no matte what the case. :_
I have seen trailers for paper books.
Posted by redux (Member # 9277) on :
quote:Originally posted by LDWriter2: Hmm if that was a fan trailer where did they get the space station scenes? Or were the space shots all made up and none will be in the movie?
The space shots look like a mix of Halo and Star Trek (it looked like the reboot) - maybe some Starship Troopers. The scenes with the kid are a mix from Soldier (the Kurt Russell movie), Star Wars (the Boba Fett clones) and the end Haley Joel Osment in A.I. (the Spielberg movie).
Posted by LDWriter2 (Member # 9148) on :
I've seen only a couple of those so wouldn't have been able to recognize scenes from the others... Oh well.
Posted by Pyre Dynasty (Member # 1947) on :
quote:Originally posted by LDWriter2: As to the Downey Jr. Holmes. I watched the trailer and I didn't recall any boxing matches nor romance in the books. Of course it's been a long while so I could be forgetting a small scene or two.
I have read some of them recently and yes Holmes was a boxer, they didn't have any scenes where he was boxing but every once in a while when they run across a tough who recognizes Holmes from the ring and expresses his admiration. As for romance, Watson is quite the ladies man. Holmes's only true love is Irene Adler who only appeared in "A Scandal in Bohemia" and it was more of a mutual respect for the woman who beat him at his own game.
On another note after reading Card's article on Andy Serkis it made me wonder if it wouldn't be an absolutely terrible idea to have Serkis play a CG Ender.
Oh and adding to the list of characters messed up by film: Frankenstein's Creature, and Dracula.
Posted by Robert Nowall (Member # 2764) on :
All this talk of Burroughs makes me wonder about how this upcoming John Carter of Mars movie will play. The Burroughs Mars books, after all, feature what might best be described as "a mindboggling amount of nudity," and you know how anything below an "R" rating would handle that...
On animation and Andy Serkis...I haven't sat through the Spielberg movie but I've seen pictures and clips, and, (1) I wondered why they just didn't do it in live action, and (2) they might have strived for realism, but some element of humanity seems lacking in their eyes, so much so that the characters seem less human than, say, the rats in Rattatouille or the cars in Cars, who were essentially caricatures rather than characters. And I think the Andy Serkis thing worked better when he was CGI-mixed in with live actors...I don't know if you'd want to go that way with Ender...
Posted by MattLeo (Member # 9331) on :
Why worry about any cinematic adaption of a favorite story? It's bound to be *different*, because cinema is a different kind of medium.
I was for the most part delighted with Peter Jackson's treatment of LotR, and wasn't in the least put out by minor, or even some *major* changes in the plot. The only change I really objected to was in the character of Faramir, because it undermined Tolkien's themes about human nature.
At best a movie adaptation sheds new light on a character; Sean Bean's performance as Boromir prompted me to go back and read the Boromir scenes with new appreciation.
So what can you expect from an adaptation of Sherlock Holmes that hasn't been done? We've had the very loose (Basil Rathbone) to the highly accurate (Jeremy Brett). Well, one thing that hasn't been depicted accurately is Holmes *youth*. When he takes up residence with Dr. Watson in 1881 he is (depending on which textual evidence you cite) between 20 and 27 years old. Watson, having been granted his Bachelor of Medicine in 1878, would be 26 or 27. Inevitably Holmes is played by an actor in his forties or later.
Robert Downey is one of the few actors who has both the assertive presence and physical vigor to play the young Sherlock, and the movies have some interesting takes on the character, depicting him as having something like autism spectrum disorder. His martial arts and weaponry skills are *entirely* canonical.
Of course in any adaption it's the supporting players that really make or break the show, and in Sherlock Holmes stories that means Watson. Nigel Bruce's Watson was dim -- a cheap screenwriter's trick to make Rathbone's Holmes seem all the more intelligent. Edward Hardwicke's Watson is probably the most consistent with the stories. Jude Law, especially in the more recent of the the Downey movies, has a very interesting take on Watson, showing him as a sporting man with an poorly hidden taste for excitement. That's not so much canonical as an interesting extrapolation. Watson's sporting habits might well explain how while he is manifestly an excellent doctor, his medical practice never seems to be demanding and he apparently pays only sporadic attention to building it up. That's the best you can hope for in an adaptation -- to have an interesting take on the characters.
At first I thought Law's Watson was a little *too* bright, but on reflection this is pretty much the level of competence we see in *Hound of the Baskervilles*. Sherlock's reliance upon him to defeat Moriarty is both a nice bit of character development and a clever bit of plotting that's worth examination. It allows Moriarty to be a more formidable adversary, yet still be credibly defeated. He can be Holmes equal or superior mentally and physically, but being on the side of good, Holmes can delegate more responsibility.
As for Enders' game -- don't hold your breath until they start shooting.
Posted by LDWriter2 (Member # 9148) on :
Speaking of Holmes B&N has the Complete Holmes for the Nook for 2.99
Neat and cool
And for the Dune loves evidently there's a new Dune book. Or at least they are pushing it right now.
The Sisterhood of Dune.
Posted by Robert Nowall (Member # 2764) on :
Seemed like a great idea, but I couldn't decide on which Nook edition to get...I seriously considered buying a trade paper edition when I saw it in B & N yesterday, but I think somewhere in my piles of books I already have one. (Saw the new Dune book, too, but lost interest in those even before Herbert's death.)
Posted by redux (Member # 9277) on :
Why pay when it's already in the public domain? For older works I check gutenberg.org and manybooks.net first.
Posted by JenniferHicks (Member # 8201) on :
quote:So what can you expect from an adaptation of Sherlock Holmes that hasn't been done? We've had the very loose (Basil Rathbone) to the highly accurate (Jeremy Brett). Well, one thing that hasn't been depicted accurately is Holmes *youth*. When he takes up residence with Dr. Watson in 1881 he is (depending on which textual evidence you cite) between 20 and 27 years old. Watson, having been granted his Bachelor of Medicine in 1878, would be 26 or 27. Inevitably Holmes is played by an actor in his forties or later.
If you haven't yet, you should check out Steven Moffat's three-part series "Sherlock," which sets the stories in modern day London. There will be three more installments shown this month on PBS in the U.S.; the older ones are on Netflix instant streaming. Benedict Cumberbatch and Martin Freeman play a young, active Holmes and Watson. As a bonus, the show is very well-done.
Posted by axeminister (Member # 8991) on :
Wait... Steven Mofatt did those?
I am so there. That guy is freekin awesome.
I've told him as much on Twitter, too. =)
Axe
Posted by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (Member # 59) on :
I'm with you, MattLeo, about Faramir (whom I loved in the books), but I have a theory about why they did it that way.
They wanted to show Aragorn struggling with his role as the Returning King, and so they chose to have him have doubts about himself (which he only sort-of did in the books), and his attraction to The One Ring was part of that.
So they couldn't have anyone else who was able to completely and automatically resist The One Ring (as Faramir did in the books) in the movie or it might detract from Aragorn.
I just wish they'd made up for it by putting more of Faramir and Eowyn in the extended version.
Posted by redux (Member # 9277) on :
I looked up some more info on the Ender's Game movie and it is being produced by Alex Kurtzman and Roberto Orci. If these names are not familiar to you look up the Transformers movie and the Star Trek reboot.
While those two movies were successful at the box office I wouldn't necessarily call them particularly good movies, or movies that were true to the source, let alone movies that will withstand the test of time.
Seeing how the guy who directed X-Men Origins: Wolverine will also be directing Ender's Game I am starting to have very low expectations for this movie. Then again, maybe it will pleasantly surprise me. I suppose I should reserve judgement until I see it Posted by MartinV (Member # 5512) on :
I find that going to the movies with low expectations is the best thing to do. That way you're always pleased with the result. I've gone to watch Master and Commander with very high expectations and I was disappointed in the end. Then I rethought the whole things, watched it again and was remarkably happy with it. I use that as often as possible now.
Posted by Robert Nowall (Member # 2764) on :
quote:Why pay when it's already in the public domain?
Some of the public domain stuff, or even the cheap Nook editions, just doesn't "run" right on my Nook...longer pages, a table of contents index thing that just doesn't work, and difficulty in just loading it up. Besides, one might want annotations or a good introduction or illustrations...
*****
I've only been sorely disappointed by one movie I went to the theater to see---"Pearl Harbor." The battle scene was fine, but, on the whole, it was three hours of my life I'll never get back. Every other movie I've ever been to has pleased me, sometimes substantially.
I've been surprised by some things, too. I watched a shoot-em-blow-em-up thing called The Marine one day over at my brother's house---it wasn't something I'd've turned on here on my own TV---and I was kinda surprised at how entertaining it all was, for all its limited acting and plotting.
Maybe with movies I'm easy to please---but I don't go to a lot of 'em.
(I have a theory about film critics...that they have to go see so many movies that they become so jaded and hard to please that they can't appreciate the good qualities of anything but the top-of-the-line stuff---and top-of-the-line is defined by their own peculiar interests and expectations. Or that the movie the critic raked over the coals may have been and may yet be a moving and life-changing experience for someone else seeing it---who might not because of what they've written.)
Posted by billawaboy (Member # 8182) on :
Just got goosebumps. I went to www.hatrack.com. This is what I saw:
Want to Be in Battle School? Open Casting Call for Extras in New Orleans This Weekend
Ender's Game open casting call being held at the Hilton Garden Inn located in the Warehouse District of New Orleans on Saturday, January 14th from 11am to 3pm.
Alexis Allen, along with Batherson Casting, are seeking bright and talented kids and teens ages 10-17 of varying ethnic background for the feature film production of Orson Scott Card's "Ender's Game"; based on one of the most famous science fiction novels of the last 40 years.
The film stars Harrison Ford, Asa Butterfield, Hailee Steinfeld and Abigail Breslin. Oscar-winning Director Gavin Hood will be filming Ender's Game in New Orleans from February until June 2012, providing those selected with up to 8 weeks of work.
To be considered, please come to the open call this weekend, located at the address below between 10am and 2pm
Hilton Garden Inn 1001 South Peters St New Orleans 70130
Please also bring a recent snapshot of yourself. Homeschooled students are especially encouraged, because of the work during school hours. ----
Holy cow...they're really doing it. It's really happening.
BTW, I found Ender's Game thru the unabridged audiobook - I've never read the book! I was literally *told* the story. I've tried finding other audiobooks that good to no avail. I must have listened to it 20 times atleast.
I'm hoping Ender's Game the movie will reflect the images and scenes evoked by the audiobook. The opening of the audiobook is simply the best. I hope in the movie script they have something like:
FADE IN:
INT - MONITOR SPACE - OVERHEAD SHOT From far above, in a sea of PITCH BLACK, a thin pale BOY lay on his side on a bright cold sterile metal table. He is still and quiet, staring off into the distance, waiting, unsure of what is to come. As we move towards him slowly, we hear the grim deep voice of COLONEL GRAFF in the darkness.
COLONEL GRAFF (V.O.) I've watched through his eyes, I've listened through his ears, and I tell you...he's the one - or at least as close as we're going to get.
Whenever I hear those opening lines in the audiobook...goosebumps. My hairs stand on end. I really hope they do justice to the opening and mood of the book.
Posted by KayTi (Member # 5137) on :
My friend's 16 yr old son tried out for the movie today! He's waiting to hear if he got a part, terribly exciting. I wish I could have taken my own 10 yr old boy down there for auditions but the 14+ hr drive gave me pause. That would be a LOOOONG commute. Posted by billawaboy (Member # 8182) on :
@KayTi - Do it! 14+hrs? Roadtrip! If two adults go along, that's just 3-4 hours driving over two days - with a brief hotel stop at night.
It'd be a fun experience - the bonus would be getting the part!
Posted by LeetahWest (Member # 9402) on :
quote:Homeschooled students are especially encouraged, because of the work during school hours
Too bad Utah is way too far away and I would have no place to stay. Oh and I guess the fact that my oldest is only 7 doesn't help either. But hey! I have nieces and nephews in that age range . . . Wish I could have done that. It would be something worth telling the grandkids about.
Posted by MartinV (Member # 5512) on :
If they really wanted to make the movie authentic, they should cast each character from the exact country they come from. I don't mean to be a b**h but Americans do have a very distinct way of behaviour. If everyone in Battle School behaves that way, it's not going to be what the book intended.
Posted by redux (Member # 9277) on :
quote:Originally posted by MartinV: If they really wanted to make the movie authentic, they should cast each character from the exact country they come from. I don't mean to be a b**h but Americans do have a very distinct way of behaviour. If everyone in Battle School behaves that way, it's not going to be what the book intended.
This reminded me of a Cheerios commercial that aired here in Canada. Everyone had a British accent. Then I was watching a US station and the exact same commercial was aired but this time their voices were dubbed with an American accent.
Posted by Crystal Stevens (Member # 8006) on :
quote:Originally posted by MartinV: If they really wanted to make the movie authentic, they should cast each character from the exact country they come from. I don't mean to be a b**h but Americans do have a very distinct way of behaviour. If everyone in Battle School behaves that way, it's not going to be what the book intended.
I understand where you're coming from, Martin, but I've seen people from one country play people from another country quite frequently and do it well. No reason why it can't be done again. Lucy Lawless has a very pronounced Aussie accent (since she is Australian) but not one bit of it came through in Xena. I'm not positive, but I believe David Odgen Steirs (sp.) is from Texas but played a brilliant Bostonian in the TV series "Mash". I see no reason why any nationality cannot be played by someone not of that nationality if coached to do it and do it well. It's been done time and again.
Posted by aspirit (Member # 7974) on :
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