And the nominees are!
 

Far Cry for the Blind

The scraping sounded like claws, now moving closer. Kevin reached under his bed and withdrew his sword. He traced the cold edge, feeling warm droplets slide down his hand.

Something rapped against the door. He steadied himself. A moment later wind brushed him and the door slammed into the wall. He took his stance as whatever-it-was charged toward him, a monster?

Now! He threw himself into his swing, slicing easily until he struck bone.

"Ouch, dammit! What are you doing!" It was the wizard Merzin.

"Oh, sorry," Kevin said, "I thought you were a monster." His excuse sounded lame, even to him. "Well, I am blind you know," he added hastily. Then asked "Where'd I get you?"

[This message has been edited by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (edited May 15, 2008).]
 

Blind Men Never Lie

Three days before the end of the world the beasts had come. Kevin would never forget the fine details of that day, despite being deaf, mute, and blind. He recalled the vibrations as tens of thousands were killed and scattered. He was so tuned into his physical world through touch that he barely missed the other senses. And when touch could not guide him, his nose could. He'd spent years mastering the scents of left and right, forward and backward, male and female, breakfast and dinner, etc.

But now he'd awoken where his powers could not help him. A motionless, anti-physical, scentless void where he was trapped. And only one person knew how to escape the magical vortex. And it wasn't Kevin. It was you. Will you help him?

[This message has been edited by JustInProse (edited May 15, 2008).]
 

Blackmail

Only seventeen years. Kevin had never imagined Mara would come looking for him so soon. He kept his door shut tight against the shrieks of the hounds. Bad enough that he would be blind…and OLD without being temporarily deaf when she found him. At the time, his eyesight had seemed like a small price to pay for acceptance in this community, but the years had not been kind to a blind man with no useful skills. Why couldn’t he have died?

The shrieks of the hounds were replaced by the screams of dying men. Humans were dying out there, and they had no idea why, or how to make it stop. But the gods would not expect him to take up arms against his own army. Would they? He heard a sound behind him. The familiar high pitched voice of the captain of the hounds sent a wave of homesickness washing over him.
 

The Guardians

"Grandpa, guess what we found," Miheal and Colm ran up the porch steps and pounded across the plank floor.
"A bird's nest?" Old Kevin said. "No, you're too excited for that. I can hear the devil in your voice! A snake, perhaps? Tell me the color and let me feel his scales--I'll tell you his story."
"No, no. Much better," Miheal said. "We followed the creek into the woods, just a little ways. We found these carved stones, big and small, all in a row. There's hundreds--"
"More than that," his brother interrupted. He placed their prize in his grandfather's hands.
The stone was cold. It radiated cold, as if the sun hadn't seen it in a long time. Kevin ran his finger through deep grooves--

[This message has been edited by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (edited May 30, 2008).]
 

The Obsidian Prism

“Constantine,” Kevin called to the raven as he fumbled with the straps of his sword. He heard the wing beats and felt a waft of air as the bird landed on his shoulder. The fighting outside the hut became louder--someone screamed--he had to hurry.

“Now we shall see if the old man was a fraud.” He lifted the small bottle of potion to his lips and drank a single drop as the old healer had instructed—when the time comes, you will know it. Pain erupted and he dropped to his knees. He was distantly aware of the raven leaping onto his head, its wings arcing round to grip his face and cover his empty eye sockets; its head rested on top of his own. Then the pain stopped and colours and shapes blossomed in his mind—it worked--he could see through the raven’s eyes. With a pounding heart he drew his sword

Having Heard the Forest Weep

The blind do not see visions. I suppose I was fortunate in that aspect. All in the township suffered from them, except for me and the Minotaurs. Even before the arrows began to rain from the forest around midday, the townsmen screamed in agony. The lamented having seen their own deaths play out before them in the visions cast from the spectral minions deep within the forest.

The screams are what haunted me,both from the beasts that sprang from the forest, and those from the men they devoured. Trembling beneath my table, I prayed for the screams to stop and clenched my sword. Slowly they did, only to be replaces by
 

See No Evil, Hear No Evil

Kevin placed the blade to his flesh. The beasts were coming. Their shrieking attack, would take away one of his senses, leaving him deaf. He would counter, and take away two of theirs. Smell. Blood dripped from his arm to the rug on the floor. He donned a lion skin, and climbed to the rafters above.

They came through the door, on all fours, horrid beasts, with spikes on their underbellies. Drawn to the sent of blood they closed. The rug gave way to a spiked pit, as Kevin reached down and slammed the door, casting all into his familiar darkness. He waited until their pathetic shrieks died. Only two remained. He dropped the bag he had been kneading in his hands. Sight. The bag exploded, flaring in a blinding light.

Kevin dropped to the floor, sword in hand.

 

Blind Mans Bluff

This batch of recruits to the militia was like all the rest. No respect for a blind man. “Hellert! Step forward!” The young half-giant made it known he wouldn’t be pushed around by a hindered human. Kevin followed his heavy footsteps and muffled grumbles. When the seven-foot tall lad was a few feet away Kevin tossed his bamboo pole to him. “Knock me down and you can go home, course completed.”

Hellert never hesitated. Kevin heard the pebbles shift under his feet and the air whistled from the bamboo pole. In a motion as smooth as a dancer, Kevin ducked, swept a leg under Hellert’s feet and snatched the pole from his grasp as he fell.

“Werewolves attack at night and rely on smell to find you. Mages employ fog to mask an advance. Witches will use

[This message has been edited by JustInProse (edited May 15, 2008).]

[This message has been edited by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (edited May 15, 2008).]
 

Sound and Fury

I remember when I stopped being scared of the dark. As a child, I was frightened by the night. Later, when darkness became my life and forced me out of the militia, even my days were filled with terror. But I clearly remember that day, ten years ago, when the sentinel's horn summoned our village's motley army together.

That day, I was at home, making lunch and feeling utterly sorry for myself. As usual. People say when you lose a sense, your other senses become heightened. Before my accident, I would've told you that was bulls-h-i-t. But I know I heard an urgency in the horn's wail that told me, this time, it was no training exercise. I shivered. Could it be the Screamers, coming back to finish the job?
 

Remember, the recent topic I started regarding voting and winning came out as a 7-0 unanimous decision! You must vote to win!!

If you place but don't vote, your votes will simply be disregarded. No honor for ye scallywags!

P.S. Voting Ends Monday Night at 12 P.M. Central U.S time. If for some reason you cannot vote, email me at any time at justinwtf(at)hotmail(dot)com.

[This message has been edited by JustInProse (edited May 16, 2008).]
 

Crits as follows:

1) The first two sentences are unclear. Where is it ‘scraping’, under his bed, on the roof--he should be able to tell if he can swing a sword so well.The ‘droplets’ I presume are blood, but there is no mention of pain so it could just be a wet sword. He steadied himself (because he was really on boat) or he readied himself? He cut to the bone and the wizard merely went ‘ouch’? Seems a little restrained. The dialogue about being blind seems unnatural. However the prose itself is good. Funny ending.

2) The first paragraph is telling. I am mystified by the ending...who is the narrator talking to?

3) Not really hooked by this. Some telling and slightly confusing.

4) This is good. Hooked by the unnaturally cold stone. Dialog is good.

5) Quite like this...interesting premise.

6) First person, so it could be a powerful POV, yet it feels like an old man telling a story looking back on events—loses some immediacy which could be gained after the 13 lines. Good though.

7) Does Kevin see the flaring light? I thought he was blind? Does he permanently have this elaborate trap set up? Also no explanation, or hint, is given regarding his ability to sense despite being blind—it isn’t obvious he is blind—‘familiar darkness’ isn’t enough. Pretty good.

8) Good. Well written, clear and concise.

9) First paragraph is telling. Writing is clunky...needs cleaning up, e.g,

People say when you lose a sense, (your-cut) others (senses-cut) become heightened.

Use of ‘bullsh*t’ seems out of place. Also reads as somebody remembering (which is implied in 1st person past) events rather than experiencing them—still possible in first person past if you dispense with the ‘I remember...’ and get on with the action. Currently it loses some immediacy.

Votes:

Best Title: Having Heard the Forest Weep

Pick One: Entry #8: Blind Mans Bluff
Pick Two: Entry #4: The Guardians
Pick Three: Entry #6: Having Heard the Forest Weep

[This message has been edited by skadder (edited May 16, 2008).]
 

First: Blind Man's Bluff
Second: Blackmail
Third: The Guardians
Best title: The Obsidian Prism

I picked all three because they had the most ring of truth about them and the least cliche.
 

First Entry #7 See No Evil, Hear No Evil

Second Entry #4 The Guardians

Third Entry #3 Blackmail

Best Title Entry #6 Having Heard the Forest Weep

 

title: Having heard the Forest Weep

#8 --- opens with a scene, and shows the reader stuff about Kevin: his attitude, his job, his fighting style. It tells us about the world: half-giants, werewolves, mages, and witches. The scene has action. The reader gets to know Kevin well enough to care about the rest of his story.
#5 -- Again, opens with an active scene, and has a great image of a living raven-helm of a thing! I'm hooked, and my only complaint is too much too soon -- a fight, a magic potion, an old man, a raven helm, a drawn sword-- in these few sentences. (This may purely be a personal preference)
#3 -- I liked this one because it introduced several important elements about Kevin and gave a hint about the motivation for the attack on the village. I'd suggest making it scene, though -- place the reader in that cabin with Kevin. Also, I think opening the story with intense emotion, as is done here, will make the climax difficult to write (but, we're not doing that, are we?)

Since we have small number of entries , I'll share my thoughts on the rest of the entries after the tally. (to maintain the spirit of de-identified submissions)
 

This I found odd. The prose was good but the change of pace through me for a loop. It had the feeling of a Piers Anthony type of story.

Entry #2 Blind Men Never Lie

This would have been fine if it wasn’t for the ending. It became one of those ‘You chose what happens’ type of stories.

Entry #3 Blackmail

This wasn’t bad. I’m kind of hooked. It isn’t as exciting at first glance but it’s written well enough that I would read on.

Entry #4 The Guardians

I liked the cold stone. I found it intriguing enough to read on.

Entry #5 The Obsidian Prism

This was a curious one. Kevin could see through the ravens eyes. I found it to be a novel idea but it didn’t feel like it belong as the opening. I’m thinking this should be the next scene.

Entry #6 Having Heard the Forest Weep

Not bad but a little to poetic for me. I did like that first line though.

Entry #7 See No Evil, Hear No Evil

I liked this action packed opening. Maybe it didn’t belong as a start but it hooked me. I liked the title as well.

Entry #8 Blind Mans Bluff

A fantasy version of a boot camp. The first paragraph looks like it should be two. I think ‘No respect for a blind man’ should have been italicized.

Entry #9 Sound and Fury

The first person didn’t quite work for me. I am not having a lot of sympathy for this MC at this point.

I did like all of these. The prose was quite sound. Good job everybody!

He just said to my mother, which I thought was funny, "Just so you know...by 1 I'll be drinking!"

He's been working all morning

I know he has something he is working on, so I might post it for him. As of know I'm off to help paint one of the other bathrooms

Sorry to everyone about the delay, and it is probably what is slowing down the writing challenge. Have Hope! I don't know why...but it's a good thing to say right?
 

2—What is the scent of left and right? Forward and backward? I didn't get that. Otherwise, I liked the first paragraph.

3—This hooked me. I would like to know what happened next.

4—I felt like we just missed the hook—it probably would have come in the next sentence. The dialogue was great, the characterization was nice.

5—Good hook, nice use of the synopsis

6—A couple of typos, but otherwise a tight first 13. I would like to know more.

7—Interesting plot ideas. I was thrown off by the blinding flash of light—it felt like it was out of Kevin’s POV. Maybe it wasn’t. I guess there are differing shades of blindness, but it still jarred me.

8—Very nicely done. The only thing I didn’t like was the second sentence. It seemed out of place for some reason. The best I could do at an edit was eliminating it completely and changing the next sentence like this: “Kevin followed the heavy footsteps and muffled grumbles of the young half giant.”

9—I like the characterization, but it’s too much telling. You need some kind of action.

Good job everyone! I had a hard time picking, and an even harder time critiquing. It’s intimidating to critique people who obviously know so much more than I do.
My votes:

# 1: (Entry 8) Blind Man’s Bluff
# 2: (Entry 6) Having Heard the Forest Weep
# 3: (Entry 4) The Guardians

BEST TITLE: (Entry 4) The Guardians

[This message has been edited by Unwritten (edited May 18, 2008).]
 

I found this quite effective and was very drawn in (although admittedly somewhat confused as to why Kevin felt the need to cut himself) up until the dialog starts and the story changes to something entirely different.

I have a certain amount of respect and admiration for the writer who scoffs at convention and “rules” of writing to express himself freely and give full range to his talent. Nevertheless, the writer who begins a story in a particular way in essence promises his readers that it will continue in that fashion. Here is a writer who is breaking his promise. He cannot be trusted. Such a writer is not likely to hold a reader long.

Having rather a weakness for the farcical fantasy genre, however, the temptation is here to read further.

Entry #2 Blind Men Never Lie

Very good first paragraph but the entry appears to be following a running theme evident in the last two Challenges of giving a cursory nod to the theme and dismissing it with a flourish in the next. It is as if the writer is saying “Here, I’ll toss in a token bit of writing on the theme, then let me get on with what I want to tell.” Or perhaps he merely wants to prove that he can start with any theme or synopsis and twist it to fit his own objective.

Clearly there is talent shown in the first paragraph and he is obviously capable of better work. I can’t help but wonder what the author is playing at? Is he serious, but in need of guidance or is this a literary “mooning” of the First 13 Challenge?

Entry #3 Blackmail

The first paragraph is confusing. I gather from the second paragraph that Kevin was once a part of the “army” of hounds? Did he sacrifice his sight to become human and live in their community? The men didn’t know how to “make it stop”, but an old blind man could by taking up arms? Hmm… no, I’m sorry. It’s too jumbled for me. Perhaps if it were a little better thought out and ordered it would hold some appeal.

Entry #4 The Guardians

Jumps right in, doesn’t it? The author is restricted by the length of the entry, I know, so while I would like description of the setting, I can overlook it. The excitement of the children is captured well and calls to the adventurous child in us all. Grandpa manifests effectively as the “wise, old blind man.” But the real point of interest is the odd stone that radiates cold. My compliments to the writer: I would definitely want to read more.

Entry #5 The Obsidian Prism

The main intrigue for me here is the moment that is portrayed: a blind man taking an experimental potion and gaining his sight. It is well done. Unfortunately, the image of a man in mortal combat with a bird on his head is more humorous than interesting. No hook for me.

Entry #6 Having Heard the Forest Weep

An entire town that sees visions? It’s a wonder there aren’t more blind people! Since these visions come from “spectral minions” of the forest, why do the townspeople stay?

I’ll give the author points for a unique imagination. Perhaps he will develop his writing skills and provide a refreshing departure from the pulp fare so copiously served up in the industry.

Entry #7 See No Evil, Hear No Evil

The title is rather trite. I’m impressed by the preparation the main character has taken in receiving his foe. He must have known they were coming for quite some time—or perhaps he keeps a pit handy for unwelcome visitors? He is a resourceful warrior, clearly, but no more than that is suggested in his character.

This lost me when Kevin closed the door “casting all in his familiar darkness” which would seem to deprive the creatures of their sight without having to blind them with some sort of light bomb.

The author’s love of action is evident in his writing. He does it well and it is an enviable skill, but it will take more than action to draw in this reader.

Entry #8 Blind Man’s Bluff

I like this very well. It needs a bit of work, though, as we are given the main character point of view and that character is blind, how does he know the height of the recruit? I would replace “course” with “training” myself. But these are small matters.

The action is described well and easy to follow. . I find a blind warrior who is training and interacting with other characters of far more interest than the lone fighter portrayed in most of these entries. I’d keep reading to find out what our sightless sergeant does find challenging in an opponent—or a recruit, for that matter.

Entry #9 Sound and Fury

Hmm, this one loses me with “lunch” which I (debatably unfairly) read as an anachronism. It conjures up a blind man dejectedly assembling a bologna sandwich. “Bulls-h-i-t” is just jarring. I do like “I heard the urgency in the horn’s wail,” however. Not enough to keep me, and quite enough to put me off.

My votes, then:

Title: Obsidian Prism

1st -- Entry 4 The Guardians

2nd – Entry 8 Blind Man’s Bluff

3rd -- Entry #1 Far Cry for the Blind

It is no good saying you are going to moderate if you are unable to meet the requirements for doing it. People will lose interest if all the dates etc. become confusing from week to week and the competition will fall into ruin--which would be a shame.

I only state the above as that is how I feel regarding entering this week. I am also confused now about when the week ten moderator will post his synopsis. The whole thing has been worked out to give people a weekend to write in and a weekend to vote in. We need to make it easy for entrants to encourage participation not to complicate it.

I would suggest we restart on Friday with the synopsis for week 10 posted on time and dump this weeks competition.

[This message has been edited by skadder (edited May 19, 2008).]

[This message has been edited by skadder (edited May 19, 2008).]
 

1st - #7 - See no evil, hear no evil
2nd - #4 - The Guardians
3rd - #5 - The Obsidian Prism

Best Title - #6 - Having Heard the Forest Weep
 

Entry #2 Blind Men Never Lie
I personally don't like starting with a sumamry, so it didnt work for me.

Entry #3 Blackmail
Interesting. I am a little confused. Might be too much for me to take on in 13 lines.

Entry #4 The Guardians
I liked this one. The last paragraph killed it for me though. Cold was used three times, to reptitive. But loved the beginning, characterization of Kevin.

Entry #5 The Obsidian Prism
Hey, the Beastmaster 13. No just kidding. I liked this one a lot. A different twist.

Entry #6 Having Heard the Forest Weep
I love the title. I like the writing, I just felt too far removed from it.

Entry #7 See No Evil, Hear No Evil
I like the prose and action. Familiar darkness, wasnt sure it was enough of a hint as to Kevin's blindness.

Entry #8 Blind Mans Bluff
One of my favorites. The only true nit, would be Kevin knowing the lad was 7 feet tall. And his though should be in italics.

Entry #9 Sound and Fury
Flash backs! I have a thing against flashbacks.

Best title: Entry #6 Having Heard the Forest Weep

First entry:Entry #5 The Obsidian Prism

Second entry:Entry #8 Blind Mans Bluff

Third entry:Entry #4 The Guardians

Well done to all, and Justin for the synopsis.
 

I also apologize to everyone in the competition for having my synopsis in late.
 

Sorry to hear about the house. Hang in there.
 

I guess in future if moderators feel that they will be unable to fulfill their role they should email at the earliest opportunity the next mod and ask them to step up.

So who is week ten moderator? Is he/she ready to post on Friday (or earlier given the circumstances)?
 

Grex42 is Justin's dad.
As far as if he will be ready Friday, Justin said he would prod him, so I would leave it there for now.

[This message has been edited by Tiergan (edited May 19, 2008).]
 

In guess what I want is some clarity about who is going to post the synopsis on Friday for definite. I don't really care who it does it--I just want to make sure someone will.

Justin, is your Dad going to do it or do we skip to the next moderator?

[This message has been edited by skadder (edited May 19, 2008).]
 

What say you all?

Jayson Merryfield
 

I am having a hard time voting due to the fact that I have grown too accustommed to the writing styles of the combatants. I am sure I know who posted my two top picks and I want to remain partial.
 

Justin's dad has enough on his plate.

Justin should be congratulated for coming through in spite of all they are struggling with right now.

Grex can moderate some other week, and everyone can take a short break.

Wolfe_boy, go ahead and start week 10 this Friday.

In the meantime, entrants can be making lists of things they've learned from these writing challenges. They are welcome to post their lists in one of the topics for the writing challenges in the Open Discussions about Writing area. Maybe this one.

End of PRONOUNCEMENT.

quote:

---

I am having a hard time voting due to the fact that I have grown too accustommed to the writing styles of the combatants. I am sure I know who posted my two top picks and I want to remain partial.

---

This is always a danger when the group of participants isn't very big. May I suggest that each of you try to write your next entry in the style of some author (other than, say, OSC) that you admire. Or the moderator could pick an author for everyone to try to write in the style of.
 

quote:

---

Or the moderator could pick an author for everyone to try to write in the style of.

---

Don't do that--I am not particularly well read! I will however try a different style--although it will probably still be obvious.

2. Feels a bit sensationalist, a bit overwritten. And I don’t get why we’re being addressed. Is this a choose your own adventure? I guess I’m cool with that. I might turn the page just to see what the deal was with the second person.

3. Wow. A lot packed into the first paragraph. Maybe too much. My head’s awhirlin’. How is Mara related to the hounds? I like that there’s a twist--he sympathizes with the hounds, but I’m not sure I understand enough of what’s going on (despite the intense first para) to fully appreciate it.

4. I actually like this one the best. I like the way Kevin is portrayed. I like the stone that he gets. The dialogue might be a bit cliched. I can’t remember _when_ the story was supposed to be set--this feels like modern times.

5. Cool, but…. Dunno. Personal preference I guess. Not drawn in by the action when I don’t know who the characters are.

6. Nice. It feels a little forced in first person, too distant. It’s all happened in the past, and yet I feel the author isn’t taking full advantage of the first person narrative.

7. It took me three reads to figure out what the deal was with the rug and the bag. I’m still not sure when the bag comes in, when he’s kneading it, etc. His hands seemed pretty well occupied with other things in the previous lines. Not sure how “sight” is coming into the picture. Again, I’m not too compelled to read. The title… not too original. Depending on what resonance it has in the story it could be good.

8. Interesting. I’d probably read on. I’d like some indication of what Kevin’s deal is, though.

9. I like the title. “I remember” stops me cold. I don’t want to remember. I want to be, to feel, to exist.

Votes:
Title: Entry 6 Having Heard the Forest Weep

First: 4 The Guardians
Second: 6 Having Heard the Forest Weep
Third: 8 Blind Man’s Bluff

 

Best Title: Entry #6 Having Heard the Forest Weep

My thoughts as I read...

Entry #1 Far Cry for the Blind
I LOL'd. For real. Mostly decent writing and promises a humorous story.

Entry #2 Blind Men Never Lie
Creative. No hook, but good to see someone having fun with the concept.

Entry #3 Blackmail
Too many ideas tossed at the reader makes me more confused than hooked.

Entry #4 The Guardians
Interesting. I'd keep reading.

Entry #5 The Obsidian Prism
Frustrated, because it feels like I've missed a lot. This is an excellent middle part of the story, but doesn't work as a beginning.

Entry #6 Having Heard the Forest Weep
It's fine. Doesn't feel like a strong hook, but there's nothing technically wrong and I'd likely keep reading.

Entry #7 See No Evil, Hear No Evil
Too much, too soon. I don't want to be dumped into the middle of all this violence without some idea of character and setting. Build the tension.

Entry #8 Blind Mans Bluff
I dislike the title, but the writing is excellent and clear. Is there a hook here? Maybe not for me, as I'm not intersted in this fantasy training camp. But there's nothing wrong with this.

Entry #9 Sound and Fury
I like the character, but could be tightened up a bit (less laid back).

[This message has been edited by Jeff M (edited May 20, 2008).]
 

----------------------------------

Best Title: Having Heard the Forest Weep

First Place: Entry #8 - Bling Mans Bluff

Second Place: Entry #4 - The Guardians

Third Place: Entry #7 - See No Evil, Hear No Evil
 

1st - #7 - See no evil, hear no evil
2nd - #4 - The Guardians
3rd - #5 - The Obsidian Prism

Best Title - #6 - Having Heard the Forest Weep
 

What do others think--shall we wrap this week up ourselves?

[This message has been edited by skadder (edited May 21, 2008).]
 

Title Vote

First Place

Entry #6: Having Heard the Forest Weep by Bent Tree (8 votes)

Second Place

Entry #5: The Obsidian Prism by Skadder (2 votes)

Third Place

Entry #1: Far Cry for the Blind by Doctor(1 vote)
Entry #4: The Guardians by Kathyton(1 vote)

[This message has been edited by JustInProse (edited May 21, 2008).]

[This message has been edited by JustInProse (edited May 21, 2008).]
 

Captain Hook (First Place)

Entry #4: The Guardians by Kathyton
11 Votes - 23 Points

---------------------------------------

First Mate (Second Place)

Entry #8: Blind Man's Bluff by Snapper
9 Votes - 22 Points

---------------------------------------

Second Mate (Third Place)

Entry #6: Having Heard the Forest Weep by Bent Tree
4 Votes - 6 points

---------------------------------------

The Crew (Honorable Mentions)

Entry #7: See No Evil, Hear No Evil by Tiergan (3 Votes - 7 Points)

Entry #5: The Obsidian Prism by Skadder (3 Votes - 6 Points)

Entry #1: Far Cry for the Blind by Doctor (3 Votes - 4 Points)

Entry #3: Blackmail by Unwritten (3 Votes - 4 Points)

Entry #2: Blind Men Never Lie by Casey (0 Votes - 0 Points)

Entry #9: Sound and Fury by Jeff M (0 Votes - 0 Points)

---------------------------------------------------------------

Congratulations to Kathyon, our new Captain Hook! I greatly enjoyed watching what you did to my synopsis. Great job, everyone.

-Disclaimer-

Points were used to break a popular vote tie.

[This message has been edited by JustInProse (edited May 21, 2008).]
 

Thanks for the work-under-duress, Justin.

Jayson Merryfield
 

I was VERY happy to find that she one either way. Took a load off my mind. (I hate seeming bias).

I judged using number of votes. Points, (3 for first place, 2 for second place, 1 for third place) were used to break ties.

Others can use different methods, as they have varied throughout the competition, but I thought that way worked nicely.

Majority rules.
 

If I like both entry A and B immensely, but decided (by the flip of a coin toss) that I liked entry B more, then my vote (which mathematically equates to A gets 2 points and B gets 3 points) is effectively saying; entry B was 1.5x better than entry A. Or entry A was only 2/3 as good as entry B.

A more ideal system might be giving reviewers an alotment of points, say... 9 points. (or perhaps one point per entry) Which they can distribute however they like. If they thought the best nine separate entries were equally mediocre, they could award them each a point. If they thought a single entry was overwhelmingly spectacular they could give it the lion's share of the 9 points and spread the leftovers to their next, distant favorites. Or if (as I said above) a person is torn between entries A and B, he could award them each 4 points and give the last point to his next, distant favorite. Or even give both A and B 3 points and award the remaining 3 points as he sees fit, etc.

A mechanism like this might begin to account for how much a piece is enjoyed relative to the other pieces, and could probably generate much more meaningful and accurate results. Although with so few people it might not be at all necessary to determine who wins and who doesn't, but it might better demonstrate by how much.

Anyway, that's how an economist might try to structure it.

[This message has been edited by Zero (edited May 21, 2008).]
 

instead of picking 1st 2nd and 3rd when you vote maybe list all entries in order from best to not so best. The top story gets the top points (eg. 9 entries, #1 would get 9, #2 8, etc) peeps could just comment on the entries they want.

I think the 3 points for 1st, 2 for 2nd, and 1 for 3rd works well enough and is the simplist.

Any point system you try to put into place will fail when the number of voters each week is variable. points awarded will be skewed from month the month. It would be better to have 2 point systems in place. the first used to determine placement in the weekly challenge, and the second to determine a continuing standing that is not dependant on # of points per week, but on placement each week. (eg. 1st place for the week gets 3 points, 2nd 2 points, 3rd 1 point). But you would have to determine a legitimate cut off point on scoring points for the running total. I would say up to 5th place would be good,(1st gets 5, 2nd gets.. oh your guys understand!) but it could be determined by the average number of entrants a week (if someone wants to go over back data and figure it out).
 

The example you gave is a good one, but slightly flawed.

Using math to say that Entry B is 1.5x better than entry A is flawed logic. Does that mean that entry B is infinitely better than Entry P.

Don't think that the point system is a grade scale. The point system, as I used it, was simply to determine a tie.

Say 11 people (completely hypothetical) voted for Entry A. 10 People voted for Entry B. Entry A is the winner, by majority. Simple. Entry with the most votes wins.

In this manner, your votes (When you love both A and B) are equal.

BUT!

In a tie breaker, the points are used. This is because if Entry A got 11 votes, but they were all 2nd place, and Entry B got 11 votes, and they were all 1st place, Entry B is the winner.

If you decide by the flip of a coin toss then you, not the system, are adding chance to who wins. This is no different then if at the very end, you were last to vote, and we said, who should win, Entry A, or Entry B. If you could not decide which you liked better, you could flip a coin.

My guess is that if this were to happen, someone would find which of the entrys they really liked the best. Flipping a coin is a flaw in the system, it is a lazy voter.

(Yes, I just insulted every voter who flips a coin to decide. I stand by that insult. You are lazy - or you don't care.)

Now, if the person doesn't care, the system, once again, cannot be blamed. Any system would seemed flawed with voters who did not care.

So...that is my defense for using the voting system I used.
 

I almost didn't enter; I was quite stuck for an idea. Then my daughter made some inspirational comment about the movie "The Village" , and -- eureka!
 

Entry 2: The first line confused me. "end of the world" implies Kevin is in no position to remember anything; the world has ended. The next paragraph implies he's been removed from the world, but . . .

Entry 6: This opens strong, I like the first person and a world that includes humans and Mintaurs. It did seem to start too fast, too many plot elements, too soon.

Entry 7: Again, I feel we're too far into the action too soon. This is exciting and well written for the rising action part of the story.

Entry 9: I like this one more everytime I read it. I felt some anachronism and change in voice in paragraph 2, and I guess that took me out of it.
 

Congratulations to Cap'n Kathyton.

I'm okay with the 3 pt for gold, 2 for silver, 1 for bronze.

Oh, and a note to Void... oddly enough, I was totally thinking of a bologna sandwich. That "bologna vibe" must've come through (I picked up a contemporary magic-realism feel from the synopsis more than classical fantasy).
 

I went back through all of the votes. Kathy, I used your method because it sounded the smartest....or something.

It turns out, after your 4.45 on the Likert scale, something about bologna sandwiches, and some Chi, you lose.

Somehow IB became the new winner...which was odd, because he didn't even participate.

Sorry...I don't know how this could have happened...every time its the same...always says IB or 92.

*Shrug*
 

OK Justln that's a pretty interesting point that any particular vote (using my system) when compared to an entry that received no vote is, mathematically, infinitely superior. But that's true for any point system where not all entries are awarded at least one point. So... what's your point?

As you even said, the purpose of the point system is to compare the top tier, the bottom tier loses outright. But why not take it a step further and adopt a system that can measure the top tier with even greater accuracy, and make a more meaningful comparison. One that demonstrates even more clearly how similarly, or distantly liked each winning entry was.

Should we ever have a 1st place with 30 points and a 2nd place with 29 using my system we are confident that they are genuinely very close. Using the existing system the margin of error is much greater because we're depending on an arbitrarily decided 1st choice = 3points, 2nd place = 2 points, etc, basis.

Now, if we don't like my stsem because it's unnecessarily complex, or we adjust don't have a need to improve what we've got--I understand that.

But it is a more accurate system.

[This message has been edited by Zero (edited May 22, 2008).]
 

At least, I think I learned something like that in Psych 104.

When I tally points, I have always used the 3-points for First, 2-points for second, 1-point for third rule, and allowed the points to dictate who has won a particular challenge, as opposed to strictly using points as a tiebreaker between voting totals. Not that I've been moderator yet, but that's how I monitored my own points totals, and how I think everyone else did as well. I would suggest we leave the voting system this way, rather than tinker with it in an attempt to add complexity.

Jayson Merryfield
 

I think the scoring needs to be established and used before we actually try and make changes to it.
 

quote:

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Psychologically, allowing an individual multiple shades of grey creates a more ambiguous answer, not a more accurate answer. The most accurate answer is achieved using a binary or single choice result - choose the best thirteen, for example, as opposed to ranking them. Allowing people to hedge their bets between a multitude of options can create issues when individuals aren't confident in their decision.

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I see your point. But had you taken econ 110 you might have expanded on that, because there is an entire vector that is basically going unaccounted for. How much more did you like entry A compared to entry B? With the current system there is no way to distinguish between liking it several times better, and liking it only slightly better. Hence a less accurate result, by far.

 

quote:

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How much more did you like entry A compared to entry B? With the current system there is no way to distinguish between liking it several times better, and liking it only slightly better. Hence a less accurate result, by far.

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In a contest, why do degrees matter? If A is better than B, then A wins. The quality of B in relation to A is only important to those with a vested interest in B (in this case, the author). It doesn't matter if B was 99% as good as A, it is still inferior and therefore not the winner.

Devnal, no one is specifically in charge of this contest, it's kind of run by group acclamation. Given that there has been no debate or disagreement about the scoring system until Zero brought it up, I figure we'll be sticking with the original 3-2-1 system.

Jayson Merryfield
 

Are 2 B's (4points) really better than 1 A (3 points).

ahh ha ha ha.
 

quote:

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In a contest, why do degrees matter? If A is better than B, then A wins. The quality of B in relation to A is only important to those with a vested interest in B (in this case, the author). It doesn't matter if B was 99% as good as A, it is still inferior and therefore not the winner.

---

In the first case we'll use the traditional method. Person 1 chooses (in order of likeability) A, B and C. Person 2 chooses A, C, and B. Person 3 chooses B, A and C. Person 4 chooses B, A, and C.

Let's say: Person 1 thinks A and B are exactly equal, but when pressed decides A is slightly better, with C is far behind. Person 2 thinks A is the best, but C and B are roughly equal, with C edging out B only narrowly. Person 3 thinks B is by far the best, with A and C distantly behind and about even. Person 4 thinks B is handedly better than A, which is much better than C.

The points end up as A: 3+3+2+2=10, B:2+1+3+3=9, C:1+2+1+1=5
With A as the winner.

But a system that is designed to take depth into account, giving them each 7 points, would end up like so.

Person 1 awards the points as follows: A: 3, B:3, C:1 Person 2 A:3 B:2 C:2, Person 3 A:1 B:5 C:1, Person 4 A:2 B:4 C:1

The tally ends up: A = 9 points, C = 5 points, and B wins with 14 points.

B is the obvious favorite in the truest sense, people liked it best. But it doesn't win with the top system because that system has no way to account for depth.

Sort of like a situation where you have a community of say 10 people, and they are voting for whether or not to outlaw religion. Four people are fervently religious, the other six are slightly annoyed by religion. They vote, the majority wins, religion is banned. Except that it inconveniences the four zealots more than it conveniences the majority, so in this case "the market has failed." A sub-optimal, inefficient outsome has been generated. Because data hasn't been taken into account (in this case the votes should not have been weighted equally.) But you get the point.

If you don't want to adopt a system like I described because it is complex, and we simply don't need it for our purposes, I accept that. That's probably wise.

But it is more accurate.

[This message has been edited by Zero (edited May 22, 2008).]
 

I agree the current system doesn't reflect any depth.

What about each judge scoring the top four rather than the top three?

1. =4
2. =3
3. =2
4. =1

It would mean the difference between the tow top scores shrinks to a mere 33.3% more, and keeps it relatively simple still.
 

quote:

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Now, take a few days off before I start my outline up.

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Outlines are meant to be posted on Fridays, giving everyone the weekend to think and write.
 

quote:

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Outlines are meant to be posted on Fridays, giving everyone the weekend to think and write.

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Or, apparently, to give the moderator the weekend to think and write ... the synopsis.

Can't say I blame him, though.

[This message has been edited by Zero (edited May 22, 2008).]
 

quote:

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Or, apparently, to give the moderator the weekend to think and write ... the synopsis.

Can't say I blame him, though.

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Pardon me, Zero? Blame me for what, exactly?

The synopsis is finished and will be posted Thursday night. Voting remains the same, for simplicities sake.

Jayson Merryfield

[This message has been edited by Wolfe_boy (edited May 22, 2008).]
 

quote:

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This is getting way too complicated for me. It was a pleasant diversion (keeping me writing), but now, it looks as if there is suddenly more math than thirteen lines and tallying votes involved. Not my forte

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Seconded. We made it through 8 weeks with few kinks.
 

Seeing as you are pulling up random examples of hypothetical outcomes to support your system, I'll do the same.

Say we have your same situation, with A winning.

You yourself used an optimal situation with an easy showing. Say we took reality, that when Person 2 thinks that A is the best, he could give A all 7 points. Person 3, thinking B is the best, could give B all 7 points. Person 4 could easily give B 4 points, and A 3 points.

This leaves C with only 1 point. Does that sound more accurate to C having 5 points?

I do not believe your system is MORE accurate, only because the accuracies of both or undeterminable. The situation you described could be used to support ANY system, if the creator of that system was the one acting as both Person 1, 2, 3 and 4.

This is not the place to argue whether your system is more accurate. That can't be determined through examples. This is to decide which we SHOULD use.

And as far as your remark about writing the synopsis over the weekends, I was the only one, as far as I remember, that botched that. I had some stuff to deal with, but mostly I just messed up. I'm sorry for that, but please don't attack the moderators. They have done excellent jobs so far.

To summarize the main point, a complicated system of voting would deter many voters, therefore slimming down the amount of voters, which would make the votes inaccurate.

Simplicity...simplicity
 

You forgot to 'Arghhhh'. It's tradition.

Jayson,

I must make a public apology. I have had one of those days where you are a day ahead--I have been thinking it is Friday (curses it isn't the weekend tomorrow!). I really thought you should have posted it today. I t was only when I saw your post saying you were going to post Thursday night and I thought that's in a weeks time--then it struck me. It is Thursday now!

So my humblest apologies.

*slinks away*

Never fear, and never mind. Just put yourself in a noir frame of mind and prepare for a fresh outline in a few short hours time.

Jayson Merryfield
 

Pirates go "Arrrr!"

(edited to struggle with the durn smilie!)

[This message has been edited by annepin (edited May 23, 2008).]

[This message has been edited by annepin (edited May 23, 2008).]
 

If I am ever Captain Hook, I will be of the ninja variety.

*sneaks out of the shadows* "Shhh--aaahh. Hold that course." *chucks a throwing star and sneaks away*
 

That is like combining nuclear fusion with potato salad. It's gonna smell funny, taste ok, but kill you four hours later.
 

Arrrr!!

*morphs in the moonlight*

Arrrrgghh!!