).-drahm
[This message has been edited by drahm (edited March 13, 2007).]
"The images came to Obsolonce's mind as he gently touched the desturbed ground..."
I think you should elaborate a little more on the specifics of this ability, as if they were happening to you and you had to describe how they came into your mind. Perhaps perspective is the word I'm looking for, but I could be mistaken.
"When my fingers touched the soil, I felt myself slipping from one reality to another."
Not sure if this is from the narrator or the main character. It seems like the narrator. If so, I am not too fond of an intruding narrator like this. It takes me out of the story too much. I start wondering if I'm going to like the narrator or not, rather than thinking about the character and what is happening.
Otherwise, I do like the opening and the premise, and I would read more, especially if the narrator does not get too involved in the story.
-V
I didn't nessesarily take it that the boy had psy powers, when i see a scene an image comes to mind for me too. I took his touching the ground as insidental information about the scene not that he was getting information from the ground through his fingers. either way I like the writing so far. I saw Aragon (sp?) seeing the hobits escape from the battle, the night before.
the name, Obsolonce, it took me three tries to get past; I kept wanting to fix the spelling error to Obsolete or something. perhaps that wouldn't have been a problem if you hadn't told us your spell check was out, i don't know.
I would read on.
HEY... you guys are so nice, can you do me a favor and read over my friend's writing. She's "I am destiny" and only survivor has commented, leaving her feeling... well, yeah. Thanks.
[This message has been edited by drahm (edited January 09, 2007).]
[This message has been edited by drahm (edited January 09, 2007).]
If you think that "Obsolonce" is out there, you should see some of the other names I've got in this thing...
[This message has been edited by drahm (edited January 09, 2007).]
On a more substantive note:
Tell me up front that he's tracking someone or something and that he has some special abilities.
Also, the language is tough to read:
As an example:
"the moistened ground . . " What does this mean? Isn't it damp?
"cold shadows" - how are they cold? The air can be cold but I've never experienced a cold shadow.
Also, if he's been out tracking all night in the cold, he's going to be feeling it. Odds are that he would have missed the trail during the night. If it rained the night before, unless the tracks are fresh, they are going to have been lost to the rain.
" . . first dim hints of the morning sun . . " - just tell me the sun was rising.
"The boy" = is this O. (Sorry but I can't type that whole thing)? Or someone else?
"the dried layer of brown maple leaves . . " Does the POV actually care enough to notice the leaves are maple? Does he know what they look like versus say an oak leave? Didn't you say the ground was wet? How are these leaves dry?
" . . rehydrated . . " - not dry then. Again, they are damp. You don't need to say this because you already told me the ground is damp.
"now they revealed something else other than the changing seasons. . ."
Just tell me! What! O. knows/ sees and so should I.
"The leaves had been carelessly torn through as a man had stumbled in his escape." - Hu? What man? What escape? The leaves aren't "carelessly torn" they are ripped and trampled. Is Obsey going to think of the "man" by that tag? What is Obsey's relationship to the "man?" Is he looking to hurt or help him?
I want to know up front that O. bent over to look at the ground because he saw that the leaves were disturbed. I want to understand what O. is doing and why. I need to understand his special ability.
All I know in 13 lines is there is a guy with an unpronouncable name, who I assume is the MC, he's tracking someone through a forest, and O may have some special powers. If you cut out most of your descriptions, you can get to the plot and hook me.
The "narrator" comment from Verloren may be that this reads as if you were trying for full Omni. The setting is movie like and not inside O's head.
K... I fixed the whole image coming to his mind thing.
Being that Obsolonce isn't a psychic or anything... he's just a really intelligent guy, so I've re-worded it from
'the images came to Obsolonce's mind'
to... 'the scene played out in Obsolonce's mind..."
better??
More clear??
[This message has been edited by drahm (edited January 09, 2007).]
If someone or, in this case, several people says that in thier opinion the name was difficult, you might want to consider it. All we can give you is our response to the words. You can pick a hard name but realize there is a price to doing it. The oriental names won't bother me though.
quote:
I could be wrong, but it seems that you want me to both EXPOUND on the details and CUT to the chase. Which is it?
Both. In all seriousness, the answer is both.
Trust your readers a bit more. If you tell me it's in a forest and it rained the night before, I will know the ground is wet.
The concept didn't dawn on me until someone pointed out that I'd written that my MC "drew her sword and assumed a fighting stance." The response was "Well, of course she assumed a fighting stance. Why else would she draw the sword?" My response was, "when you put it that way . . " The phrase was cut.
It's like deciding how much of a physical description to give. Does the reader need to know the MC's eyes are blue in my novel? Heck yes. She's the only blue-eyed character for a reason. Do you need to know the King's eyes are green? No, but the POV notices it because she notices details like that and if I didn't mention it, I would violate her POV. Do I reference the blue eyes more than once? Yes. Do I reference the green ones more than once - no.
So in that sense, less is more. Unless the ground being wet is critical to the plot, you don't need to dwell on it.
But I want you to tell me all the details that ACTUALLY matter. I need to know O. saw that a bunch of leaves were messed up. I need to know he's looking at the physical evidence and trying to peice together what happened so I don't think he's psychic. I need to know why he's out in the cold tracking someone.
See, Keeping Secrets from the Reader - http://www.hatrack.com/forums/writers/forum/Forum1/HTML/002021.html
There's a maxium in theatre- if the play is set in 1820 - the light fixtures you use better come from the time perios because someone in the audience is going to know that they used X type of lamp back then. If O. is tracking someone, people who understand tracking will put down your book if what happens isn't plausible because you haven't done the research to know that you can't find a trail in leaves that was there before a rain came. Tracking is hard. Tracking at night through a rainstorm is nearly impossible.
See, Tracking in Fantasy Novels -
http://www.hatrack.com/forums/writers/forum/Forum1/HTML/003412.html
Yes, we are trying to create and express in words. But who are you trying to create for? If it is for you, use the words you want. If it is for a reader, make sure the words you use convey the necessary information to that person.
I'll need to re-read it a few times to get everything you suggested, but we'll see where it goes.
As previously said, I didn't mean for it to come across so harsh. I can be a bit protective... first time putting anything out and all. To be honest, i wanted to know whether or not my writing was just "crap" and should burn it, or whether it was worth fighting for.
Sorry...
quote:
The "narrator" comment from Verloren may be that this reads as if you were trying for full Omni. The setting is movie like and not inside O's head.
Yes, this is pretty much what I meant. I could have been more clear - sorry.
Don't give up on this story. It may not be perfect yet, but that does not mean the story is bad or not worth telling.
It may be that you need to start somewhere else, or maybe from a different POV, or even using a different voice (I have no idea what would work since I don't know the whole story yet - but you do know it, so you have the answer in you somewhere ).
Good luck!
-V
I'd say that overall this is a good opening. There are some clarity issues, for instance you say that Obsolonce "brushed the moistened ground", yet it seems that there is forest litter. So is he touching soil that has been exposed by the escaping man? That seems likely, as it would be a good way to measure how long ago the disturbance occured, but you don't say any of this and it takes time before I have enough information to figure it out...and by that time you see fit to say "the disturbed ground", making me wonder if earlier he was touching something else. I'm a bit puzzled by "first dim hints of the morning sun", I'm not sure whether this refers to dawn or to sunrise, I'd think dawn on the basis of the situation but you do say "morning sun". You also refer to a "submersed" rock, this implies that the rock was underwater, which is not impossible if there was a puddle or stream (and you do say that it rained), but you don't say for sure whether or not there was. If you only mean that the rock was hidden under the ground cover...well, you use the word "hidden" already.
Anyway, I can see how the clarity issues are hurting some of your readers. I didn't find them terrible, not to the level of being confused about the POV or thinking that Obsolonce had weird powers, at any rate. I only saw a couple that I would really worry about fixing, and I like the overall tenor and structure of this opening. It tells us a lot about Obsolonce. I'd certainly keep reading.
Oh, and I'm sorry about pile-driving the plausibility nits on destiny's post...plausibility issues are so hard to ignore and equally hard to mention tactfully. If her overall POV development hadn't been interesting I wouldn't have commented. I just have a thing for stories about sneaky killer types, that's all. Not that I am one...or really know any, more's the pity 
>Obsolonce knelt on one knee as he brushed the moistened ground with his hand.
Name's a problem for me, and "moistened" makes me wonder who moistened it.
>The cold shadows of the Tyree Forest blanketed him and everything else in silence as the first dim hints of the morning sun allowed the boy to finally see what he was looking for.
The cold shadows of the Tyree Forest blanketed everything in silence as the first dim hints of morning allowed him...
That just cuts some words. I also have a problem with "the boy" because it isn't immediately clear if Obsolence is there with a boy, or if if he *is* a boy.
>The dried layer of brown maple leaves had been rehydrated by the night's rain, and now they revealed something else other than just the changing seasons.
>The leaves had been carelessly torn through as a man had stumbled in his escape.
How about:
The dried layer of brown maple leaves had been rehydrated by the night's rain, and now revealed something else: they had been carelessly torn through as a man had stumbled in his escape.
That is, I don't think you need a paragraph break here, because the revelation is one thought, not 2.
>The scene played out in Obsolonce's mind as he gently touched the disturbed ground with his fingertips... the man's toe had caught hold of a submersed rock hidden in the black shadows and he had fallen forward, striking his head on the course and frigid trunk of a tree. (etc)
I'd replace the ... with .
Course? What do you mean?
--
AFter all that:
I would read further, hoping to find out why Obsolence cares, but I'd rather know *now* why Obsolence is investigating. I'm not exactly hooked, but I've got enough of a hook I'd give it a little more time.
to Survivor's question/comments
I liked the name Obsolonce because of its connection with the word Obsolescence (condition of being nearly obsolete or going out of use)
Obsolonce is (in the first book) my main antagonist (sp?) In the first chapter he is young and soon finds himself sitting at the feet of the big corrupted leadership whatever in his land. Then, chapter two comes around and my MC takes over and you don't see Obsolonce for a while... However, by the time my MC comes along, Obsolonce's quest for dominance (or whatever he calls it) is crumbling in his hands, just out of reach sort of thing. The big honcho is finding Obsolonce's "uniqueness" ie: intelligence and ability to scheme ect... of dying use, and-in a sense- Obsolete. So, the book takes place as he, Obsolonce, "uses" my MC (or tries to) to get what he wants. ect...
Sorry, I'm really bad at short summeries... even if it's only a character summery. But yes, to make a long thing even longer, there was total purpose in his unusual name.
Oh, I just had a thought.
Question:
His full name is actually, David Obsolonce... (use of last name as reference has significance in his land) However, for the FIRST chapter, being written previous to where the book actually begins, should I refer to him as DAVID Obsolonce to help prevent confusion for the new reader??? It's just discouraging to loose readers right off the bat because of his name... perhaps further in the book they would be okay with it... ???
Suggestions? I'm trying!! (brain smoking all night!)
BTW... I did correct the whole submersed word. I about hit my head on the desk when i realized what i had typed. Ooops. Um, as for "moistened"... too many complaints to ignore, anyone got any suggested replacements other than merely "wet"? Perhaps it will take care of itself once i get a better explanation/re-write on what's going on... you know, specifics. What's he touching, what's he seeing (etc)
wbriggs-
thanks for the sentence suggestion. I had actually come to the same conclusion last night at combining the two... I just didn't have the internet at home to do anything about it. Getting on today and seing that you came up with the same thing made me feel good about the choice though... thankx!!!
Thanks everyone
-drahm
[This message has been edited by drahm (edited January 10, 2007).]
[This message has been edited by drahm (edited January 10, 2007).]
"they had been carelessly torn through as a man had stumbled in his escape."
The next paragraph already indicates to me that Obsolonce is hunting someone. I don't think it's necessary to tell me that a man tore up some leaves while he was escaping and didn't care. I'm sure you can find better wording to indicate there are some tracks that drew your character's attention.
Anyway, I think that his name as it is had all the connotations you want and none that you really don't. He's past his usefulness, hard-hearted, and rather fixated, so it works. But it doesn't work well with "David". That's a bit too prosaic. Also, it works better if he doesn't think of himself as David, even if it's his name.
Thanks Survivor...
Every time i put Dave's name up with it, it just ruined the scene for me, so i guess i agree with you. I'll just have to deal with most people not gelling with it, for now.
I had just posted yet another revision after you had read, but i'm glad that "touched" works better. I'm trying it as a single paragraph... i think it actually helps me follow it better. Maybe?
*sigh*
I'd just hate to see how much more work i have to do on the other 999 pages!
drahm
-drahm
Could you maybe find a different name?
Cheers!
-Donelle
Oh, and Survivor
...you'r mocking me, aren't you =)
really though, very funny on the name suggestion.
Actually, in the bible, there IS a guy named "Absalom" and he just happens to be King David's son... so yah, that would screw some people up i think, at least some bible people. Course, i didn't know that until someone pointed it out to me this morning. The real guy, Absalom, interestingly enough, has a funny mirrored character to my current "Obsolonce."
Well everyone, I can say one thing for sure. At the end of the day when you get off this computer, you may not remember all the names from everyone's 13-lines, but you'll remember mine... even if you think its wrong, and even if its miss-spelled in your head; or it plain annoys you... (cringe)
To be honest, i wasn't listening until arriki mentioned that it may be TOO close to real english word(s). Perhaps he/she's right? Everything else just sounds like "it's not a normal name" thing to me. I read through the "naming characters" lessons provided by OSC and i couldn't really find anything that may have been wrong with "Obsolonce". It's easy to pronounce (to me...) and it has meaning (reflection to character). But where's the line between creative and just bad? Is it merely if people don't "like" it? I have arguments on THIS side of the screen to keep it... but they can hear it.
?????????
...least its not 'Bob', right?
drahm
[This message has been edited by drahm (edited January 15, 2007).]