Hatrack River Writers Workshop: -insert interesting title here-

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Posted by The Fae-Ray (Member # 3084) on :

Okay, this is just the beginning of some story that I was writing a few days ago, when I was really really bored, and I was wondering what kind of rating my ten minute doodles would get. (Yeah, I really have nothing to do during the day. Haha)

The fear of nuclear war had long since passed. The first Civilian Outbreak was drawing to a close, and Keith, who had never felt a particularly large involvement in the war anyways, was beginning to once again feel safe.
Unfortunately, this feeling of peace was to be short lived. The members of the Government Army were planning another attack on the civilians – this one to end the war permanently. Currently in development was a bomb, not unlike the ones that devastated the cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki over 350 years ago. It was to be completed on the 25th of June, 2296, and dropped two days later. If all went well, there would be no survivors.

Okay, that's it.

I was wondering, before you comment can you please give a rating out of 10? And constructive critisism is really helpful too. Thanks!

Posted by TheBishop (Member # 3055) on :

I hate ratings, but if I had to, I'd give this a 6 / 10. The fragment made it over 5 only because it seems like there's some cool background history here. Unfortunately, that's exactly what this feels like, the beginning of that history film we all watched in Grade 8 social studies.

Mostly what bothers me is that you drop Keith's name in there and then do nothing with him. By the end of the passage he's about as important to us as the pile of giblets he may soon become.

I suppose the whole thing (without Keith) might work well as the lead in to a futuristic international political thriller, however.

What is there is fairly well written however. It just seems that it would serve better as a first draft blurb that helps you focus your setting before you sit down to write the real story.

[This message has been edited by TheBishop (edited December 20, 2005).]

Posted by The Fae-Ray (Member # 3084) on :

Sorry if ratings bug you. They just help me out a lot when writing and editing. They're oftentimes just as useful to me as the constructive critisism.

To get back onto the story itself...
Those are some good points.

I guess I'll just do some explaining on the rest of the story (or what I've figured out so far).

It's not really that much of a historical war novel as you said. It will get much different once you read farther into the book.

And Kieth is used in the next paragraph, when I start to use the third person POV. I probably should use him more in the first paragraph, or maybe not even mention it at all...

[This message has been edited by The Fae-Ray (edited December 20, 2005).]

Posted by wbriggs (Member # 2267) on :

I'd give it 2/10. Why so harsh?

You're telling us things Keith doesn't know. You can break POV in paragraph 1 (OSC), but I think that's before you set one. Here, you set it, then you break it, in such a way as to render Keith's actions irrelevant. What will he be struggling for in this story? Either it's preventing the extermination of mankind (in which case he DOES know), or it isn't (in which case, who cares? His goals are about to be moot).

Plausibility problem, too. I'll need some convincing that the military intends to prevent war by exterminating mankind. It seems, well, a little self-defeating.

I just read your last set of comments. If you put Keith off, it might fix it. I'd have to know the story. This might work.

quote:
The fear of nuclear war had long since passed. It shouldn't have. The members of the Government Army were developing a bomb, to be completed on the 25th of June, 2296, and dropped two days later. If all went well, there would be no survivors.
Keith ...

So we get a hook, and we get what we need explained, and then we get Keith's POV.

[This message has been edited by wbriggs (edited December 20, 2005).]

Posted by The Fae-Ray (Member # 3084) on :

As I said in my last post, I'm thinking of deleting my mention of Kieth in the first paragraph.
As well - and I guess I should have mentioned this - the bomb isn't meant to destroy ALL of mankind, because this war is a civil war. The civilians are separated from the government members (I'm not entirely sure how at the moment, but I'll find that out eventually) and the bomb that's sent isn't powerful enough to destroy the planet, only the patch of land the civilians inhabit (which is quite large, larger than the area of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. In this future world, atom bombs were last used in the Second World War, and the technology has only advanced somewhat since then, as they hadn't even been considered in the other wars that have happened since then.)

And now I've just gone back and read your edit, and that's pretty much how it goes now.

Yes. Thanks for the help.

Posted by x__sockeh__x (Member # 3069) on :

Hm. I agree with the others...the mention of Keith should wait until further on. Sounds good though. ^-^

Posted by eclectic skeptic (Member # 3046) on :

I know it has been said already, but either drop Keith, one solution, or drop the rest of the narrative point of view, and do everything from Keith's exclusive point of view, my suggestion would be the latter. I don't really enjoy stories with a lot of narrative POV, just my preference, I like things couched inside a characters mind, to me it gives the events some meaning, some sort of depth. Events which happen outside of a characters perspective is like a hamburger without a bun, all meat and no fluffy stuff to make it go down easier.

Edited for the forgotten rating: about a 4 or a 5. Interesting possibilities for your setting, if there was a character their to experience it.

[This message has been edited by eclectic skeptic (edited December 20, 2005).]

Posted by x__sockeh__x (Member # 3069) on :

"Events which happen outside of a characters perspective is like a hamburger without a bun, all meat and no fluffy stuff to make it go down easier."
Nice comparison, lol. =D

Posted by The Fae-Ray (Member # 3084) on :

Don't worry,that's the only paragraph with that style. The rest is in third person, which is my personal preference for writing.
I'm going to keep the way I've written the first paragraph. I like the style for a beginning. That whole Keith thing is out of that paragraph, but I'm not going to post the revised one as it's really the only change that's been made. Once I get some more suggestions I'll put the revised version up.

Posted by The Fae-Ray (Member # 3084) on :

Alright, here's my revised version. I know it took a while and not much has been changed, but that's just too bad for you.

Most people were centering around that whole Keith thing, so that's really all I've changed. I couldn't find much else that I needed to fix, but I'm sure there was more, so if you find some please point it out (not like you weren't going to anyways, haha)

The fear of nuclear war had long since passed. The first Civilian Outbreak was drawing to a close, and the many citizens of the city of Miralia were finally beginning to feel safe.
Unfortunately, this feeling of peace was to be short lived. The members of the Government Army were planning another attack on the civilians – this one to end the war permanently. Currently in development was a bomb, not unlike the ones that devastated the cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki over 350 years ago. It was to be completed on the 25th of June, 2296, and dropped two days later. If all went well, there would be no survivors.

There we go. Hope that one works out better.

Posted by rustafarianblackpolarbear (Member # 2638) on :

"Currently in development was a bomb, not unlike the ones that devastated the cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki over 350 years ago."

No. Just... No.

Before I start writing a story I try to fill up an entire pocket notebook (mine hold an average of 10,000 words) with all the ideas for that story that come into my head. I'm not suggesting you do anything similiar, but what's posted in your first 13 belong in note form. In just your first thirteen you have nothing happen, and nothing but exposition and backstory. I'm guessing you do not know your Story Universe well enough yet to write it.

[This message has been edited by rustafarianblackpolarbear (edited December 25, 2005).]

Posted by The Fae-Ray (Member # 3084) on :

Can I ask what is wrong with that? I will change it, if I can see the problem, but you haven't told me what that is.

Posted by rustafarianblackpolarbear (Member # 2638) on :

People, with the possible exception of the Japanese, today would not compare a large explosion to the atom/hydrogen/whatever bombs dropped in World War 2, because it's just not that interesting. This sotry is set a further 300 years in the future. A narrator must sound as if they are telling the story to the people of their own time, not to the readers.

Posted by rustafarianblackpolarbear (Member # 2638) on :

To delete the copy post, click on the pencil and paper icon at the top of your post and, inside, tick the delete box up the top and click "Submit Now". If it tells you only administrators can do that, that's not the case on your own posts, just come back in (by clicking refresh or whatever) and the post will be deleted.

[This message has been edited by rustafarianblackpolarbear (edited December 25, 2005).]

Posted by The Fae-Ray (Member # 3084) on :

"People, with the possible exception of the Japanese, today would not compare a large explosion to the atom/hydrogen/whatever bombs dropped in World War 2, because it's just not that interesting."

I do agree with what you have said there, but the problem is that it's not just a large explosion. It [i]is[/] an atomic bomb, so it [i]is[/] the same (well, close to the same) as the bombings of Japan. I guess I can't compare it as well as I want to though. I personally find the bombings fascinating. I'll try to accomodate your suggestions, however.

Posted by The Fae-Ray (Member # 3084) on :

~sighs~

Thanks for the deleting tip. It doesn't seem to want to work on my computer. Maybe it's just me. Most likely it's just me. I'll try again a little later I guess.

Posted by rustafarianblackpolarbear (Member # 2638) on :

It's absolutely wonderful for writers to know as much as possible about the characters, cities, cultures, echelons, religions, etc of their story world, so it's good that you know what size this bomb is. But there are details, like eye colour and fashion trends, that the reader just doesn't remember, or doesn't care about (or in the case of fashion trends in futuristic stories, will just find absurd, like we do of some of the fashions of Elizabethan England: http://images.google.com.au/images?hl=en&q=elizabethan%20england&sa=N&tab=wi )

I'd suggest using the long term telling of the story to describe the scope of the city the bomb is to be dropped on, by having the protagonists actually move about inside of it. Hope that helps. I know I'm a bit too blunt in my critiques but I can't help it, so I'm sorry if I offended you.

[This message has been edited by rustafarianblackpolarbear (edited December 25, 2005).]

Posted by rustafarianblackpolarbear (Member # 2638) on :

This is to see if my deletion suggestion actually works, or if I'm speaking from experience in the other forum here at Hatrack. Okay, it's not your computer, it's just this forum.

[This message has been edited by rustafarianblackpolarbear (edited December 25, 2005).]

Posted by The Fae-Ray (Member # 3084) on :

Alright, I'll try out some of those suggestions. And don't worry, you didn't offend me.

And as to the deletion post...

That's good to know.

Posted by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (Member # 59) on :

Sorry I wasn't around to catch the double post--I delete them when I find them.

I don't know why this forum has different software, but I really don't mind doing the deleting for you. Just email me, in case I don't see it on my own.

Posted by The Fae-Ray (Member # 3084) on :

Okay, thanks Kathleen.

Posted by Nevyan (Member # 3093) on :

quote:
The fear of nuclear war had long since passed. The first Civilian Outbreak was drawing to a close, and Keith, who had never felt a particularly large involvement in the war anyways, was beginning to once again feel safe.

'first Civilian Outbreak'? This implies that the narrator or MC lives to see the second Civilian Outbreak (akin to saying First World War and Second World War) and throws me off the stories opening a little bit.

quote:

Unfortunately, this feeling of peace was to be short lived. The members of the Government Army were planning another attack on the civilians – this one to end the war permanently.

The first part says the war is drawing to a close which makes me believe either stalemate or a peace treaty. If it's a stalemate maybe a line or two explaining? If a peace treaty let us know.

quote:
Currently in development was a bomb, not unlike the ones that devastated the cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki over 350 years ago. It was to be completed on the 25th of June, 2296, and dropped two days later. If all went well, there would be no survivors.

Is the exact dates of completion and release relevant to the story? Is the MC's birthday on the 27th of June or something? This just seems to be a nagging detail that could be done away with in order for you to expand a small bit in the opening on the status of the War.

Best,

Nevyan