I am nearly done with my first novel. This is my endeavor ever into the literary field. While I do have high hopes for this story, I have realistic expectations in regards to it as well. Odds are it will be hard pressed for me to get an agent, and even harder to get a publisher unless I go the route of e-publishing, or self publishing. I am not doing it for vanity so I do not need to see my name on the cover of a book, even though I have to admit this sounds sexy. I am writing the story because its been forming in my head for a long time, and it has entertained me and friends for a few months now as I have been putting it together. I am learning this query process, and trying to get my idea in the hands of an agent or a publisher. In the mean time I was posting each chapter on my 360 blog to get advice from people, and to check the flow. The more I get into this I see warnings from every writer on the market. Publishers will consider it released and will not touch it, people will steal and plagiarize it. People tell me not to send my manuscript to anyone unless I know them. How the hell did this paranoia develop in the industry? Is it really that bad? How is a new author with no industry connects supposed to get a critique if it is so? How the hell do you get someone to look at your work, your complete work with out this fear over riding you? Hell all I want is a viable honest opinion on if the story is worth chasing after all the publishers or if it doesn't stand a chance? I don't need the advice from some burnt out wanna bes or failed writers. I want it from the fan base, and people that have written stuff I would read. How can you do this with all the paranoia, who the hell can you trust?
Posted by Alethea Kontis (Member # 3748) on :
1.) If you're putting the whole thing up on a public blog, yes, it's technically publishing it.
2.) If you put it up on a public blog, isn't everybody in the universe going to able to comment on it? Why would you want that? You already said you don't need feedback from wanna-bes.
3.) I can't tell you how many well-known authors tell their fans to NOT send them fiction, because they won't read it. Not only won't they read it, but their lawyers advise them not to read it, in case a similar theme pops up in one of their bestselling books one day. (I'm sure you've heard of this lovely book the DaVinci Code, and all the similar books that came before it...and after it.)
Finding wise readers you know and trust is one of the first hard things you have to do as a writer. (There are lots of my peers whom I respect, but only a handful to whom I would give a newly-finished manuscript.)
Find those people, and get their thoughts on your book.
Buck up, soldier -- this publishing biz is a frustrating monster.
Posted by franc li (Member # 3850) on :
When I was writing my first novel I had chapters up on my blog. Fortunately, I've rewritten the crap out of it (well, in the figurative sense, probably not in the metaphorical sense yet) so it doesn't resemble what was blogged all those many months ago.
But I don't think I need writers to read my writing. What I need is good readers. I don't need someone to tell Me what they would do differently. I need someone to tell Me if I are sustaining their interest. Just my 2 cents.
Posted by Hookt_Un_Fonix (Member # 4783) on :
That is exactly what I am looking for, good readers. The trouble I have been encountering lately, in reference to the wanna be's, is the unwanted advice. I know my grammar is not prefect so I like the tips there. Spell check doesn't get it all. So many people look at my work and want to turn it into something its not. I have had a few useful comments on it, but most that I have received where along the lines of "you will never get it published unless you do this". Most of the time it comes from authors that have never been published. I would like people that have been published look at my work because if they said that I would be more inclined to believe them.
Now concerning the blog site, it is technically published so it protects you from plagiarism correct? So would that not be a good thing? I also wonder if it is a negative thing that agents and publishers seem to say about it. As a first time author it can help me build a word of mouth fan base, or am I being naive in this?
Now I would love my book to be a New York Times best seller and make a million on it, and I would love to see it on the big screen, but I am a realist. The odds of that happening with my first work are very slim. And what I mean by first work is just that. I have not written a short story since high school so many years ago, and those where written at gun point to get a passing grade. I am writing this for enjoyment, but when I am approached by an agent and they tell me to take it down for now, and call them when I am done, it gets me thinking. I would still however be happy with just having people read and ENJOY the story for what it is. It does give me that little tingle of pride when a friend puts down a chapter and says one word "damn". Then it makes me feel like I am doing something besides wasting my time listening to music in front of my computer.
What I am looking for I guess is honest critique with out a severe change to the content or message. Is there anywhere out there that you can do this with out ruining your chances of gettign a publishing deal?
Posted by Survivor (Member # 213) on :
If something has already been published, then your chances of selling the publication rights to a traditional publisher are very slim. Usually, they are most interested in first publication rights, which you use up by publishing it on the internet (even in blog form).
Chasing after publishers is pretty cheap compared to self-publishing something seriously. But if you gain confidence (through exposure on the internet) that something does have a market and you can sell out a printing run (on-demand publishing is pretty expensive per unit), then you can go that route. Many web-comics follow this business model, some quite successfully. It's a real business that requires real work and real savvy (in addition to the creative side of things, I mean), but it's doable.
Plagerization isn't very dangerous to you, except when you post something online. If a specific entity steals the actual wording, then you can get them in court. On the other hand, wannabe's and fannabe's are far more likely to "steal" and distribute your work than a publisher, particularly online. That's part of why publishers won't look at stuff that's been on the internet, they figure that if it's good enough for anyone to be willing to pay for it, it's good enough that millions of copies of it are floating around in cyberspace, copied from your website and distributed shamelessly, with our without crediting you as the author.
Wise readers will tell you if the message or story just isn't working for them. It's really the only reason that you need wise readers, if you want to work on your grammar...read a book on the subject.
Posted by Robert Nowall (Member # 2764) on :
I can't say I've heard of a whole novel posted online then being picked up by a professional publisher...there have been experiments with chapters by the likes of Stephen King, and I know of a couple of amateurs who had their posted books printed, but that's all. There are also some blogger books that, I guess, went up on websites before being bound between covers, but nonfiction's hardly the same thing as a novel. I wouldn't swear to its having been done, though.
Posted by spcpthook (Member # 3246) on :
Try some groups like critters ( www.critters.org )critters is a good place to start. They are controlled by password access. As long as the site is not open to the public it is not considered publishing. Critters offers a RFDR (request for dedicated readers) where you send the novel to people who are interested after viewing a sampling on the critters site. The RFDR respondent then crits the novel.
Another excelellent site with a lot of knowledgeable skilled critters is the OWW http://sff.onlinewritingworkshop.com they offer a free month and then there is a $49.00 a year charge. Critters is free and has the RFDR option but I have personally learned far more from OWW and found it to be well worth the cost.
Sandra
Posted by Hookt_Un_Fonix (Member # 4783) on :
Thank you I will try them. I also agree survivor that if I need help with grammar read a book, or take a class. Hookt un Fonix wrukt fer mee afterall. That is is actually my point to. The grammar and spelling can be corrected, my concerns of course would be if the story is viable. Does the story capture your attention? Can you follow it. If these things do not hit so well for them then suggestions on how to fix it would be great.
Posted by Hookt_Un_Fonix (Member # 4783) on :
Thank you I will try them. I also agree survivor that if I need help with grammar read a book, or take a class. Hookt un Fonix wrukt fer mee afterall. That is is actually my point to. The grammar and spelling can be corrected, my concerns of course would be if the story is viable. Does the story capture your attention? Can you follow it. If these things do not hit so well for them then suggestions on how to fix it would be great. Right now I am going critter hunting lol.
Posted by Elan (Member # 2442) on :
Keep your mind open to the fact that a good critique should highlight more than mere technical errors in grammar and spelling. A good critique should point out problems in the plot, or in the writing style. While you may interpret these comments as a desire to "change the story", in fact issues with believability, cliche, logic, etc. will be a huge factor in whether your story is publishable or not.
You have to get over YOUR paranoia about the "paranoia" in the industry. It isn't paranoia, buck-o. It's how the industry works. You would be wise to research how the industry works from professionals who work in the industry. The advice you get on writer's forums like this--from people who are unpublished-- may come because we, too, have been researching the industry. If you want to know how agents think, do a GOOGLE search and come up with the URL for the blogs of agents and editors. Read Miss Snark, Literary Agent X Rachel Vater, Evil Editor, and follow all the links on their blogs to other editors and agents. It will teach you a lot about how agents think and WHY some stories are unpublishable even though the grammar and spelling are exact.
Posted by Hookt_Un_Fonix (Member # 4783) on :
Thank you Elan for another useful tip. I am off to google and discover.
Posted by Hookt_Un_Fonix (Member # 4783) on :
Man oh man I am glad I am not an agent. I think politics may be an easier field. I see a lot of networking, and disgruntled "talent". I have worked in sales so dealing with rejection is second hat to me, but their are people that don't seem to deal with it well and they have to deal with them. I will keep reading on, and I tell you some of the threads I am reading have more intrigue then a Tom Clancy novel. I think I might have found myself a new source for education, and entertainment. Entourage has nothing on this. Thank you again for pointing some of the sites out.
Posted by Hookt_Un_Fonix (Member # 4783) on :
Winter of Humanity thus far has been sent to critters. Thanks spcpthook
