Hatrack River Writers Workshop: What's wrong with #9?

This is topic What's wrong with #9? in forum Open Discussions About Writing at Hatrack River Writers Workshop.

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Posted by Novice (Member # 3379) on :

Here's the silly question of the month. Why do so many magazines/journals specify a #10 SASE? What's wrong with #9?

Posted by pantros (Member # 3237) on :

a # 9 envelope is 3 7/8" x 8 7/8" - this is very difficult to put a single trifolded 8 1/2 x 11 sheet of paper into. Its much easier to deal with the extra room provided by the the # 10 at 4 1/8" x 9 1/2".

Good luck finding the # 9 envelopes too. Due to it's perfect size for easily dealing with multiple pages of folded 8 1/2 by 11 sheets of paper the #10 envelope is dominant as the main conveyer of documents via mail.

So, we basically have the two main Birthday card sizes, the #10 and a few full document size envelopes to choose from. Of those choices, the editors prefer the #10.

Posted by tchernabyelo (Member # 2651) on :

Thanks for that.

Not living in the US, I have never actually had the slightest idea what the &*@# a #10 envelope was.

Now, should I need to, I can try and supply some sort of appropriate equivalent (I did bring back a wodge of 8.5 x 11 paper from my most recent visit, with the intention of being able to submit to magazines that don't accept electronic submissions, but I didn't get any envelopes).

Posted by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (Member # 59) on :

If you have 9"x12" or 10"x13" manila envelopes, those are actually better than the #10 because you don't have to fold your manuscript to put it in the manila envelopes, and an unfolded manuscript looks just a tiny bit better than a folded one.

If you're sending to a P O Box, though, the #10 envelope has a better chance of fitting into the box than a big manila envelope (which may be one reason guidelines might specify the #10 envelope).

Posted by pantros (Member # 3237) on :

I always send out in the 9x12 manuscript envelopes.
If I want the whole manuscript back, I send a folded SASE 9x12.
If I just want the cover letter/acknowledgment/rejection back, I send a SASE #10.

Anything more than 5 pages should not be sent in a #10 envelope. A single stamp won't always cover the postage on more than 5 pages either.

Posted by Elan (Member # 2442) on :

Pantros' description of a #9 and a #10 envelope are correct. A #9 is smaller than #10. It is not correct, however, that #9s are hard to find... go to any office supply store or standard print shop. A #9 is standard for businesses who include a self-addressed return envelope, for instance, your local bill collector who provides you a return envelope, or a charity who includes an envelope for you to remit a check. A 9 is perfect to fit inside a 10.

On the other hand, a #10 envelope fits perfectly inside a #11, but #11s ARE hard to find. You won't generally find them in every office supply store. Normally you would want to call a print shop and have the envelope special ordered. It IS a standard size for most paper wholesalers, so the special order isn't a big deal... it's just that most print shops don't stock them in inventory.

as always, there ARE exceptions. When I was the Purchaser at a local office supply store, I always kept a box of #11s on the shelf so that people who wanted to include a #10 with a letter, could do so without folding it in half.

I have an envelope size chart on my website:
http://a2zgorge.info/marketing/printing/envelope.htm

Posted by Novice (Member # 3379) on :

So, since most rejection slips are just that...slips, is there any reason to think that an editor will see the #9 envelope, start cussing, and head directly for the shredder?

I ask because I have a HUGE box of #9 envelopes, and they're pretty. Nice, heavy stock and bright white. They fit perfectly, as previously noted, into the #10 envelopes. I've been using them for inquiries. (As in, "Dear Editor, I'm writing to inquire about the status of my submission...I've included a new SASE for your convenience...") It only just occured to me that there might be some glaring reason editors hate the #9s.

pantros's point about fitting the paper into the envelopes is well stated. I always make sure I fold my letter so it will fit in the #9, in case the editor just wants to scribble "we have no record of this submission" on the letter and return it.

Posted by pantros (Member # 3237) on :

I doubt many will complain, but one might. The risk must be one you are willing to accept.

Keep in mind that all editors are failed writers and therefore severely bitter and looking for any chance to dash the dreams of aspiring writers.

That last paragraph was a joke. That describes very few editors and none of the ones that ever read this board. But, if you do not adhere to requested standards, you risk quite a bit if you happen accross one of these type of editors.

I'd stick to using the #9s for other business. Start a pyramid scheme chain letter. Send one out to every state's tourism agency and see how much junk gets into your mailbox.

Posted by Elan (Member # 2442) on :

#9s are intended to mail checks. If you want to easily mail a standard size sheet of paper (8-1/2" x 11" here in the states), you should send a #10.

Use the #9s to remit your payment to the utility companies who are mailing you bills on postcards to save on their own expenses.

Posted by Robert Nowall (Member # 2764) on :

Of course, don't forget to buy stamps and stick them on the envelope if you want your manuscript returned through the mail. (Don't send the stamps separately, it only encourages them to send it back at a cheap rate and pocket the rest. (Yes, it's happened to me.))

On fitting in a P. O. Box...depends on the size of the box. There are various box sizes available...but these sizes vary from office to office.