Hatrack River Writers Workshop: Beginnings

This is topic Beginnings in forum Open Discussions About Writing at Hatrack River Writers Workshop.

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Posted by Corvus (Member # 2632) on :

This is a question about a specific story, but it's general enough that I think it should go here - partly because it deals with what to put in Fragments. Basically I’m asking how to write a short story about a sequence of events and their effect on a character. What can be left out, what can be described in dialogue, that sort of thing. Is it better to portray character by spending three pages describing the infiltration of a building, or to have another character say “The attack failed and so-and-so was captured” later on? And most of all, where to begin? In my case: in a story that includes action (such as infiltration, yes) but only cares about the stuff in between, how do you write a hook that is still relevant?

Advice? Or should I go straight to the shark pond and toss in whatever?

Posted by mikemunsil (Member # 2109) on :

There's a common saying you might find handy: "Show, don't tell." Now, like anything common, it is good advice as long as you don't stretch it too far.

Posted by Robyn_Hood (Member # 2083) on :

Mike is right about "Show, don't tell." It is better to let the reader see what is happening and why rather than just some it up.

As for where to start, OSC has a great method. I haven't read his books on writing yet, so I'm only vaguely familliar with it, but it is called MICE.

Milieu
Idea
Character
Event

Once you know what type of story you are writing, this will help you determine where to start.

I don't know it well enough to explain it, someone who knows more about MICE should actually do it.

[This message has been edited by Robyn_Hood (edited August 16, 2005).]

Posted by BuffySquirrel (Member # 2780) on :

"Conflict is character". Bring out your characters through their contrasts and conflicts with those around them.

Just as an off-the-top-of-my-head example, such a story could have one character who is always joking around, and another who is very focused on the mission and taking things extremely seriously. If they are partnered on the infiltration, they will inevitably come into conflict with each other. That will bring out their individual characters.

At a later point, such a story might be able to explore how the joking character is using the jokes to--well, you decide . Cover up fear, deal with anxiety, stop himself thinking about...sthing. Lots of possibilities.

The story should start at the point where it MUST start. The point at which its events become inevitable. If the story is about a character being captured in an infiltration, then start at the point where he is committed to that infiltration. The point of no return .

Posted by wbriggs (Member # 2267) on :

Another point of view (mine): what's your story about? What's cool about it? Start there, and show us the interesting & cool bits. Summarize the rest. Your POV character will be present at the interesting bits, I hope, and that's how we'll get his characterization.

Posted by J (Member # 2197) on :

Good questions. Being able to answer them well would make you a master of the craft.

Writing is a practical art. Throw something into the shark pond, and learn from the bites. It doesn't hurt to read good writing, either (Shakespeare, the King James Bible, Twain, Chesterton, and a little Hemingway to learn the iceberg principle).

Posted by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (Member # 59) on :

Quick summary of where to start the different MICE stories:

start a milieu story when the character leaves the familiar setting and enters the unfamiliar setting

start an idea story when the character is presented with the puzzle/crime/gadget and decides to figure it out

start a character story when the character either decides to try to take on a desired and different role or is forced into an undesired and unfamiliar role

start an event story when the character decides to do something about what's wrong with the world

Posted by dpatridge (Member # 2208) on :

My Series In Progress doesn't really fit too well into MICE. I have too much going on.

It is my opinion that the outer story is very strongly a character driven story. The guy, who is a descendant of one of the protagonists of the inner story, listening to the storyteller is going through changes.

It is my opinion that the inner story is mostly an idea story, yet, I start it with the event of my two main protagonists watching their sister get killed. They already knew about the creature that kills their sister, and, we find out later that one of the two protags had been forewarned of this event and told that he would know what to do when it happened.

I wonder if I've mistaken what kind of story my inner story actually is, since I have been having some trouble writing it...

Posted by Paul-girtbooks (Member # 2799) on :

Hi Corvus,

where to begin: well, you're already thinking along the right tracks - remember Fritz Leiber's "The Big Time" which concerns major events but which takes place within a single room! Eveything that happens outside is simply talked about. Concentrate on the characters/dialogue. Personally I don't feel action-based stories work well outside of a novella/novel as all that action results in the characterisation of a short story being pushed to the side.

Posted by djvdakota (Member # 2002) on :

It kinda sounds to me like you're asking us to teach you how to write a short story.

Wow! That's a huge subject to try to address here. That's a college course, not a quick discussion subject.

One thing you can do is work and study. Work by writing daily. Study by reading daily. Read the works of others. Read published short stories and analyze how other writers do it. Read books on writing. I can recommend a few that I've found particularly concise and helpful:

Character and Viewpoint, by OSC
Beginnings, Middles, and Ends, by Nancy Kress
Self-editing for Fiction Writers, by Browne and King

AND, submit to the shark pond.

Posted by Silver3 (Member # 2174) on :

The shark pond being what? The editors, or the people at F&F ?

[This message has been edited by Silver3 (edited August 18, 2005).]

Posted by Christine (Member # 1646) on :

It also sounds to me like you're asking how to write the whole thing, though your topic title infers that you are interested in beginnings.

dpatridge, as an aside, sometimes a story fits into more than one MICE category. My recent novel was also an idea/character story and it took me a long time to figure out where to start for that very reason. Finally, I decided that I wanted it to be MORE of a character story than an idea story, so I started with the point when the character decided to make a change.

I'll get into some more general story-telling advice in a bit...

Posted by djvdakota (Member # 2002) on :

Round here the shark pond is F&F, isn't it?

Submitting to editors is:
Adding to the slush pile;
Trolling for rejections;
Running it through the rejection mill;

Any others?

Posted by Silver3 (Member # 2174) on :

I didn't know the expression. Shame on me, I've hung around this forum for long enough to pick up a few expressions, and I didn't :'(

I loved the "trolling for rejections".

Posted by Corvus (Member # 2632) on :

Thanks, everyone. I guess it did come out sounding like I wanted a class on short-story-writing, although that wasn't my intent. As it turned out, what I really needed was to decide which aspect of my story to focus on: idea/milieu (these are often combined, I think, especially in SF) or character. There is a slight conflict between character and events to decide which drives the other, but in my case I already know the answer.

Yes, F and F is what I meant by the shark pond, from what I've seen - here - so far.

So again: thanks for all responses; they helped. I'll admit it seemed simpler before I knew what I was doing.

Posted by Elan (Member # 2442) on :

quote:
I'll admit it seemed simpler before I knew what I was doing.

Ahh. Words of true wisdom.

Posted by Jon Roberts (Member # 2804) on :

Words of Wisdom indeed.

On "Show Don't Tell" with all the people that seem to have read "characters and viewpoint" I'm surprised no one mentioned this.

OSC says that if you show everything you will be long dead of old age before you finish your story. It just takes way too long. The idea of consistently showing and not telling is a fallacy. People think that is what you should do because it takes so many words to do effectively, so the majority of a story is "showing". However, the majority of the actual action is "telling". He says to only use showing for really important parts.

I thought that this was very interesting, and it cleared up a lot of my problems with trying to "show" as much as possible.

Jon

Posted by Beth (Member # 2192) on :

A lot of people rely almost totally on telling, and it makes for very dull stories. The other extreme, of showing everything, is just as dull. Showing the important bits, as you say, is the key.

[This message has been edited by Beth (edited August 21, 2005).]