posted
I've noticed the some of the critique given to some pieces comes from lack of hook in the first 13 lines. Is this important? 13 lines seems like a very short space to fit a hook and there seems to be a danger of over doing it to get a crazy hook. Nearly all stories that I've read, long or short begin normally (first 13) and present a hook or tension or something similar in the first few paragraphs, if not pages. Maybe I'm not understanding the term hook. Would love to see others thoughts or advice.
Posts: 4 | Registered: Oct 2010
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posted
There are a lot of old historical threads about the reason that the "13-line hook" is talked about here (and elsewhere).
When you are submitting a manuscript to an editor, in standard format, you will have 13 actual lines of story on your first page.
You need something in those thirteen lines to make an overworked editor turn to the second page. You also need to make sure there isnothing there to STOP an editor from turning to the second page.
That is the "hook". It may be an event, it may be a character, it may be your authorial voice, but there has to be SOMETHING to make your work stand out.
Note that this does NOT apply to novels, which can start much more slowly. Nor does it apply to how you hook a READER of a story. It is about how you, as a new writer, can persaude an EDITOR to buy your story. Lots of people say "but I read this Stephen King story and it doesn't have a hook..." to which the answer is "yes it does; it has a two word hook, one word of which is Stephen and the other word of which is King".
It's a sad fact that a beginner has to be BETTER, in some respects, than an established writer in order to sell. It's no good being "just as good", because the editor will tend to go with the known quantity (who might have a fan base of readers) rather than a name no-one will recognise.
posted
I concur, except for the suggestion that a hook is not needed for novels. I believe it is even more important for novels.
The time (and money) required to read (and purchase) a novel is far greater than that for a short story. A novel requires a far greater personal investment. I may chance wasting a few minutes or half-hour on a short story, but not a novel. My free time is limited and too precious.
With seemingly endless novel choices, even in genre fiction, I find a new author needs to hook/snare/trap my interest on their first page, if not in their first sentence, to keep me reading -- or I'll wind up placing their book back on the rack and moving on to another one.
This may be part of our fast-paced media-overwhelmed culture. Anyway, I spent an hour at a local Border's and checked the opening 13 of many sf/fantasy novels. Few had really great hooks, but those that did, particularly the first sentence, held my attention long enought to get me to turn the first page. I find Jim Butcher's Harry Dresden novels and stories are examples of some of the strongest hooks -- even in his later novels when he has already developed a fan base who select his works simply by name recognition alone.
Once hooked, however, I believe a novel has greater lattitude than a short story to world-build and perform character development, as long as the undercurrent plot/conflict is clear and in constant motion.
Just my humble opinion.
Respectfully, Dr. Bob
[This message has been edited by History (edited October 22, 2010).]
posted
I actually thought along similar lines when I arrived here. Thirteen lines doesn't seem like much and I thought it was an unfair way to look at it. However, after reading quite a few first 13s here I realized that there was something to it. After some of the first 13s I wanted more and others I didn't. Just in that tiny sample you end up with a pretty good idea of whether you want to invest more time. Should you judge the whole story based on the first 13? Of course not. There does need to be something there to snare interest though or your target audience just won't ask for more.
Posts: 116 | Registered: Sep 2010
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posted
What tchernabyelo said. In printed format, eight-and-a-half-by-eleven paper pages, it's what's on the first page.
But this only involves a writer trying to impress an editor. As a reader, I've never bought anything based on the first thirteen lines. I don't know whether anyone who's picked up a book in a store has done so---but I doubt it.
As for shorter stuff, well, I buy the magazine, usually by subscription---not because I looked inside and liked the first thirteen.
Ultimately, I see it as a trick, maybe capable of thrilling the hypothetical eventual reader---call him the "customer---but a trick with little or nothing to do with the actual experience of reading.
(I can tell you, definitely, that I have stopped reading a book once I read the first few lines---but that's after purchase.)
posted
Immediately after posting, it occurs to me that the online experience of reading almost certainly is different. I can't think of anything I've read or haven't read 'cause of the first thirteen...but with this being the "wave of the future," as was once said of the Nazis, I suppose the matter must be examined.
Posts: 8809 | Registered: Aug 2005
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posted
Well , History's post above indicates that Robert and I are wrong and that there ARE people who read the first thirteen of a novel. I must admit my novel-purchasing is influenced mostly by the back cover copy - if the story sounds cool or interesting, I might read a short section, just to get a feel of the style of the writing, but I'm certainly not expecting the same kind of hook there as I would for a short story. In general I have found most people seem to do it that way but clearly other approaches are out there.
Why I like back cover copy vs opening lines:
Opening lines:
quote:From between two trees at the crest of a hill a very old man watched, with a nostalgic longing he thought he'd long lost capacity for, as the last group of picnickers packed up their baskets, mounted their horses, and rode away south - they moved a little hastily, for it was a good six miles back to London, and the red sun was already silhouetting the trees along the River Brent, two miles to the west.
Back cover copy:
quote:When scholar Brendan Doyle is flown across the Atlantic to give a lecture on Samuel Taylor Coleridge the last thing he expects is to meet the man himself. Nor does he anticipate being stranded penniless in the teeming, thieving London of 1810. Every effort to return to the present is thwarted - until he hears someone whistling a refrain from Yesterday.
That's from Tim Powers' utterly awesome(IMHO) novel "The Anubis Gates". The opening is pedestrian but I read on because I've been hooked by the back cover copy.
[This message has been edited by tchernabyelo (edited October 22, 2010).]
posted
Of course, in most cases, the back cover copy won't be written by the writer of the book...and for a short story published in a magazine there won't be any.
Of late, my book purchases are mostly non-fiction, and what usually attracts me to the book is the subject matter. My last four book purchases, since I got home from vacation, consist of (1) a Baby Blues comic strip collection, (2) a warts-and-all-and-more-warts biography of Paul McCartney, (3) the selected letters of Pat Moynihan, and (4) what appears to be a defense of Ulysses S. Grant's Civil War strategy (I haven't read that one yet, so I'm not sure of everything it covers.)
None of these purchases involved the First Thirteen or the jacket copy.
posted
I realized I neglected to state the reasons I did buy the abovementioned books. It breaks down to (1) long-standing interest in Baby Blues, (2) long-standing interest in anything involving the Beatles. (3) recommendations from trusted sources, and (4) seeing it on the publisher's website.
Posts: 8809 | Registered: Aug 2005
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posted
You know, along with the reasons of getting editors to turn the page, and of protecting electronic publication rights for authors, there really is another important reason why we have the 13 line arrangement here on the Hatrack River Writers Workshop forum.
We are all essentially strangers here. We can't see each others' expressions when we "talk" nor can we hear each others' tone of voice. All we can go on is the written word.
So how do critiquers decide whether or not they want to spend time and energy giving feedback (which is integral to a workshop, after all) on a complete story?
The 13-line posts allow potential critiquers not only to get a glimpse of how different writers write, but they also allow potential critiquers to see how said writers respond to feedback, without having to invest a lot of time and energy in creating that feedback.
The 13-line posts also allow writers to see how different critiquers give feedback. Some are more helpful to some writers, and others are more helpful to other writers.
No one here is required to send anything they write to anyone. If you feel that only certain critiquers will be of help to you, you can tell the others "thank you, but I think I have enough critiquers now" and that's that.
I hope that helps clarify things, at least a little.
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