Rumors are that in a big announcement that Sarah Palin will give soon, she will say that she is not running for reelection of Alaska.
Almost everyone is seeing this as a sign that she will run for the presidency after her term ends at the end of 2010. The speculation swirls around the fact that she still appears to be popular enough to win reelection, and several sources are pegging her for a run for the presidency.
This is still a long way off, but I think it's a sign. It's a pretty ballsy move too, as she's nowhere near the odds on favorite among GOP candidates.
[ July 03, 2009, 03:09 PM: Message edited by: Lyrhawn ]
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
Uh, yeah, she'll never get the presidency.
Posted by Darth_Mauve (Member # 4709) on :
As Hillary Clinton was the preferred Democratic presidential candidate for Republican strategists, Governor Palin is the preferred Republican candidate for Democratic strategists.
Posted by King of Men (Member # 6684) on :
Gah, I hope they don't run her. A candidate who doesn't inspire spitting, frothing hatred in the Democratic base would be a lot better for keeping them honest.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
It would be immensely funny to see a Palin presidency though.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Current polls, which are more or less useless this far out, have her running even with Huckabee and Romney.
Those three have the name recognition, but next generation republicans are going to wait to get involved. I think around the midterms you'll see some of the lesser knowns like Pawlenty start to make a serious drive to get some name recognition so they don't get clobbered by the big three off the bat.
It remains to be seen who of the GOP fold will throw their hat into the ring, but I think a couple of young GOP governors will, in addition to Palin. This announcement just confirms what we all suspected, but I don't really think it matters as far as the nomination goes. We're a year away from knowing who the players are.
And we can still cross our fingers that Obama will drop Biden and get someone else. It might sound unlikely, but Biden won't run in 2016, and having the sitting VP be the candidate is a big advantage. There have been a number of times in history when presidents have traded out VPs in their reelection bid.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
quote:It might sound unlikely, but Biden won't run in 2016
Why is that?
Posted by MightyCow (Member # 9253) on :
If Palin somehow wins I really will move to Canada.
Posted by The Reader (Member # 3636) on :
She's quitting soon. Fox News. Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Hoooly crap, she's actually stepping down.
Hah, she even just made a snarky swipe at climate change.
quote:Originally posted by mr_porteiro_head:
quote:It might sound unlikely, but Biden won't run in 2016
Why is that?
Lots of reasons. Age will be a factor. For a guy who spent a lot of time bashing McCain for being too old, he'll be in his mid 70s by 2016, and really he's a holdover from the last generation of Democrats. Obama is the first president of the next generation. I just think his time is past. Besides, if none of that mattered, he'd likely be up against Hillary Clinton for the nomination, and I really don't see why he'd bother. I wouldn't be surprised to see Obama bring her in as VP if she makes a push for it, but I'd like to see him go with a fresher face.
Posted by James Tiberius Kirk (Member # 2832) on :
Huh.
If she genuinely believes that the country is going down the wrong path, then Romney's biggest advantage in 2012 will be his ability to declare his independence from all of it. After all, he hasn't held a public office for some time now.
Or maybe the ADN has some serious dirt on her. Who knows?
--j_k
Posted by Sterling (Member # 8096) on :
I think after her performance as the GOP VP pick, a lot of experienced political talent isn't going to want to be associated with her. If there's one thing she established a reputation for in 2008, it was running off and doing her own thing in spite of or even against the recommendations of the advisers.
She's also managed, in the short time that she's been in the spotlight, to pick up a remarkable amount of unfortunate baggage. Whoever she runs against won't even have to come up with negative campaign advertising; they can just buy time to give 15- and 30-second clips of her interview with Couric.
Still, I guess she does have name recognition and a certain folksy appeal to a certain set. She sure as heck wouldn't be my choice to run the country, even limited to the current crop of GOP governors, but I think she's probably capable of making a showing. Making a showing and losing with poor grace, most likely, but making a showing.
Posted by Temposs (Member # 6032) on :
Hmm. Obama could make Hillary Clinton the VP candidate in 2012, and she could run in 2016.
Wow, what a train wreck of a resignation speech. Romney has to be the happiest man in America right now, all of his potential adversaries for the GOP nomination in 2012 are self destructing.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lyrhawn: This is still a long way off, but I think it's a sign. It's a pretty ballsy move too, as she's nowhere near the odds on favorite among GOP candidates.
I think she's narcissistic enough to believe she can win. I also hope she gets the nomination, because I think it strains credulity to imagine her besting Obama in any aspect of a Presidential race. Maybe she thinks that doesn't matter, and she can win among her base... but that sure as hell didn't work last time.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by Wowbagger the Infinitely Prolonged: Wow, what a train wreck of a resignation speech. Romney has to be the happiest man in America right now, all of his potential adversaries for the GOP nomination in 2012 are self destructing.
Perhaps I'm being too gleeful about this situation with Palin. On the one hand I really do find her to be, well, lets say "objectionable," but on the other hand this could as well have to do with something more personal. Perhaps she's sick? Perhaps she's depressed or mentally ill, or just exhausted and wanting suddenly to retire from this life?
It's one hell of a statement to make if you're actually planning to run for President, not even finishing the single term of your one statewide office. Perhaps she just doesn't have what it takes, and got swept away in the maelstrom of the election cycle.
But on the other hand again, this whole process has been something of a beautiful disaster.
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
POSTMORTEM
To all those vociferously anti-Palin folk: congratulations. We have just been hand-delivered the coup de grace on a silver platter. This event is a complete vindication, but it's almost unnecessary given how thorough her self-destruction has been throughout her political spotlight.
To all those who have been rooting for Palin, you got suckered bigtime. Sorry, but she's through and along every step of the way she has dug her own grave.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
I know it's passe to criticize Palin's linguistic abilities at this point, but how in the world can she speak so poorly, even in a prepared statement? It's just freaking weird the way she strings words together- am I the only one who finds himself jumping back again and again to try and piece together the sentences in a way that makes sense?
Most of her sentences show verb/object confusion, dangling modifiers, and just plain awkward constructions.
"It's like when you're writing a sentence about proper grammar, and the structure, and also it's important to make it work, too, that other people might be understanding it also."
It's a PREPARED SPEECH- one that she is aware will be broadcast internationally. Does she have so little regard for, or communication with her staff that nobody ever stops her and says, "look, let someone fix this, you sound undereducated."
Ok, this has been done a thousand times, so I'll stop.
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
It is actually fairly simple: She's babbling. She's in Debacle Mode (not to be confused with depeche mode). Sanford is a better speaker than her and he still was reduced to this level. All we're seeing is the purest form of Palin's embarrassing ingenue at work, which is "a political figurehead who is nominally incapable of keeping herself coherent."
Add into the mix that she's utterly blowing the tires off her remaining political credibility, and the fact that there are few logical explanations for her behavior that do not involve an imminent scandal, and I would only be surprised if she were not melting down on-stage.
She may be pulling this off worse than the Sanford debacle, which is saying something, because Sanford's rambling, jejune speech was pretty bad. But not as bad as this!
This is a brutal and total vindication of everyone who knew right from the beginning that Palin was a completely worthless candidate. We have just been hand-delivered the coup de grace on a silver platter. It's more or less here for us to put an ailing, indefensible candidate out of her political misery.
Taking bets that something big is about to explode right on the heels of this.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
I like you Sam, because you force me to look up words when I read your posts. This post it was "ingénue" but I'm a bit confused on your use of it because the OAD says:
quote: Dictionary ingénue |ˈanjəˌnoō; ˈän zh-| noun an innocent or unsophisticated young woman. • a part of this type in a play. • an actress who plays such a part. ORIGIN French, feminine of ingénu ‘ingenuous,’ from Latin ingenuus (see ingenuous ).
You're using it, if I follow, to describe her personality or demeanor. Or are you referring to her daughter?
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by Samprimary: Taking bets that something big is about to explode right on the heels of this.
Yes. My ears are pricked.
...
By the way, I was especially struck by her employment of the "suffer the slings and arrows" idiom, which she placed in the context of public ridicule of her policies. Of course, "sling and arrows" is best known in connection with "outrageous fortune," and on top of that it comes from a monologue about suicide and regicide. I mean, you can't make this stuff up. I'm not claiming she *can't* use that idiom if she wants, but it's a weird one to use in my mind.
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
yeah it's basically me describing her as acting like a typecast ditz who's in over her head.
Posted by Speed (Member # 5162) on :
I wonder if she's going to make a concession call to David Letterman.
Posted by lem (Member # 6914) on :
I agree that she is unimpressive as a potential president or vice president. I agree with how ludicrous so many people find her. I am not a fan in any way! But some points need to be made.
quote:I think after her performance as the GOP VP pick, a lot of experienced political talent isn't going to want to be associated with her. If there's one thing she established a reputation for in 2008, it was running off and doing her own thing in spite of or even against the recommendations of the advisers.
She still draws the biggest crowds for anyone in the GOP. A celebrity in a fractured party with a devoted following for the hard core base, no matter how ludicrous she is, can still make a big splash.
The republican party has no voice right now and she draws a significant portion of the base. She is useless with a national audience, but no one has been vindicated yet.
I see a bright future for Tina Fey.
quote:I know it's passe to criticize Palin's linguistic abilities at this point, but how in the world can she speak so poorly, even in a prepared statement? It's just freaking weird the way she strings words together- am I the only one who finds himself jumping back again and again to try and piece together the sentences in a way that makes sense?
I don't think you are her intended audience. The likes of Hannity and Beck and their rather large audience will be inspired--and that is the purpose of her decision and speech.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
But what I described had nothing to do with whether her speech was inspiring or not (though I found nothing in it to suggest inspiration), but rather it was something anyone could recognize. She doesn't speak well, and not in the way that George Bush is inarticulate. As an English teacher, and granted all my students are foreigners, I would diagnose the problem as stemming from a poor grasp of the register being used. I have students with better English than Palin's, no joke, and the ones who come up with word salad like this are the ones who don't read. Simple- they don't read in English, and so they don't understand the subtlety of our formal register. That's Palin- I honestly think she has a learning disorder. I'm far from an expert, but this is nothing to do with ideology or belief- anyone could recognize that she is an incompetent speaker.
Edit: I'm reading the text of the speach now. I'm sorry, but goddamn she is a terrible speaker. It's not style, it's more than that. It's substance, it's thinking, it's the application of critical thought. She has never showed any. Ever.
It's like this business about her son, an issue that, from where I'm sitting, got no *real* press attention. She concludes the diggs at the media by saying that she's glad she has her son because it makes her a better person, that we "need more trigs, no less." It's catchy, but she's saying in essence that we need more retarded children because it would be good for us as people... I mean as much as I want to be charitable about that thought, there's something macabre about it coming out of her mouth on the heels of a speech about how effective she has been as a Governor who has governed for less than one term (and months out of that having been spent as a national candidate away from her special needs child).
Gah, it's bizarre! Bizarre I say!
[ July 03, 2009, 09:56 PM: Message edited by: Orincoro ]
Posted by Chris Bridges (Member # 1138) on :
While I agree with the rest, I doubt seriously she thinks of her son as retarded. I would take that to mean she believes we need more wonderful children in the world.
And she hasn't quite matched Sanford yet, not till she gets up and resigns three or four more times with increasingly explicit reasons.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
Of course Chris, that's what the statement is meant to convey. The problem for me was that I instantly thought, "wait, we need more retarded people... really?" Not in the spirit of what she was saying, but also off-putting in the way it was stated.
Ok guys, I take no responsibility for this link beyond sharing it with you, because it just showed up over on Ornery:
On the face of it, I don't see this as likely, and it might be an all out hoax. Take that into account.
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
I think the only really bad thing about Palin is the appalling, nasty, dreadful behavior people perform when they talk about her.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
I know that you think that.
Posted by Nighthawk (Member # 4176) on :
quote:Originally posted by katharina: I think the only really bad thing about Palin is the appalling, nasty, dreadful behavior people perform when they talk about her.
I think the only really bad thing about Palin is that people think someone so willfully uninformed and anti-intellectual is qualified for national office.
I feel the same way about George W. Bush, by the way. It's not sexism.
Posted by Sterling (Member # 8096) on :
quote:Originally posted by lem: I agree that she is unimpressive as a potential president or vice president. I agree with how ludicrous so many people find her. I am not a fan in any way! But some points need to be made.
quote:I think after her performance as the GOP VP pick, a lot of experienced political talent isn't going to want to be associated with her. If there's one thing she established a reputation for in 2008, it was running off and doing her own thing in spite of or even against the recommendations of the advisers.
She still draws the biggest crowds for anyone in the GOP. A celebrity in a fractured party with a devoted following for the hard core base, no matter how ludicrous she is, can still make a big splash.
The republican party has no voice right now and she draws a significant portion of the base. She is useless with a national audience, but no one has been vindicated yet.
I see a bright future for Tina Fey.
I would note that I wasn't denying her popularity with some people (heck, a significant number of people) in what I said. My point was more that her history has not been one that would likely attract a Karl Rove or a James Carville (or their ilk) to her side. Who would want to see their wise, considered counsel ignored? Who would want to become the scapegoat if she flamed out again? Or even face the possibility of a cabinet position with someone you know is going to make bad decisions for failing to follow your advice, should they come to office?
Being telegenic and even charming can only get you so far in a campaign. You need people who can run the logistics to make it real; people who can spin your inevitable gaffes and mistakes so they aren't still headlines three days later; people who can pace you so you don't go into a debate after three days of wall-to-wall campaign stops with a headache and an aching neck from trying to sleep on a bus. Palin has projected a persona that is anathema to people who do these kinds of things well: "I make poor decisions, I will not be 'handled' or 'contained', and I will lash out at you if I fail."
No arguments about Tina Fey, though.
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
quote:Originally posted by katharina: I think the only really bad thing about Palin is the appalling, nasty, dreadful behavior people perform when they talk about her.
Oh I believe it was absolutely trumped by the fact that she wasn't even remotely a qualified candidate and became the face of an intransigent minority hellbent on preserving awful social policy, and was also an inept executive, and was about to be Vice President at one point.
Posted by Sterling (Member # 8096) on :
quote:Originally posted by Samprimary:
quote:Originally posted by katharina: I think the only really bad thing about Palin is the appalling, nasty, dreadful behavior people perform when they talk about her.
Oh I believe it was absolutely trumped by the fact that she wasn't even remotely a qualified candidate and became the face of an intransigent minority hellbent on preserving awful social policy, and was also an inept executive, and was about to be Vice President at one point.
I sense that we're meant to feel rebuked... Not feeling it, somehow. You? Posted by MightyCow (Member # 9253) on :
quote:Originally posted by katharina: I think the only really bad thing about Palin is the appalling, nasty, dreadful behavior people perform when they talk about her.
I'd say the only really bad thing about Palin is that she wasn't in the kitchen where women belong.
BAM! Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
quote:Originally posted by katharina: I think the only really bad thing about Palin is the appalling, nasty, dreadful behavior people perform when they talk about her.
Sometimes people earn it.
This is one of those situations, to a degree.
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
I am blanking the attachment to these jokes about sexism. Is it related to katharina's previous stance on the attention Palin garnered?
Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
quote:Originally posted by katharina: I think the only really bad thing about Palin is the appalling, nasty, dreadful behavior people perform when they talk about her.
Kat, She's a raving loon. Seriously. If it wasn't obvious before it should be now. There comes a point where continuing to insist otherwise just makes you look like a loon as well. If its that difficult for you to graceful admit you were dead wrong on this one, it would be more prudent just to say absolutely nothing than to continue repeating something everyone now knows is ridiculous.
Posted by AvidReader (Member # 6007) on :
It's actually pretty readable that way. I think she's saying she's going to go be a lobbyist and get paid. Can't blame her for that.
From the site:
quote: lemme go back quickly to a comfortable analogy for me and thats sports basketball and i use it because you are naive if you dont see a full court press from the national level picking away right now
I am curious what she's referring to here. I'm not sure what a full court press is, so I don't get the analogy. The Democrats are trying to run off the Republicans, is that what she's alleging? Or just that she's lost everyone's respect and no one will work with her now?
I agree that she's looney, but I'm kind of curious to know what her take on things really is. I hope she keeps a diary or other people keep her letters. Someday, I'd like to see a good biographer explain what she really means by all this.
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
quote:Originally posted by AvidReader: I'd like to see a good biographer explain what she really means by all this.
In the context of what we're probably about to find out, it is likely a transparent gloss-over for "Congratulations, you guys were about to find every single skeleton in my closet."
If she's resigning now over a brewing scandal, then there's three levels to these things.
1. What she says 2. What she'll justify it as later 3. What she's probably thinking
and yes, a good combination of #2 and #3 are the purview of a biographer.
Posted by Rakeesh (Member # 2001) on :
This thread has almost, but not quite enough, sanctimony. It needs more.
Not that I liked Palin as potential city dogcatcher, much less VP, but insisting those who defend her - even if they're not, really - or those who support her must be some sort of mental defectives, well, that's just spiffy.
Posted by Teshi (Member # 5024) on :
I think she is legitimately retiring, at least for a couple of years. At the risk of being tremendously condescending, I don't think Sarah Palin was really prepared to run on the presidential ticket. From day one, she seemed a bit prom queen-ish: the snap decision to accept the nomination, the performance in interviews. I don't think she was prepared, either in the place in her life at the moment or by the Republican Party to take on something quite so big. I think her inexperience was not only a problem when it came to actually governing, but also being prepared and being hard enough (not tough, I believe Sarah Palin is a pretty tough person) to deal with the ensuing onslaught. She's clearly attached to her family and I think the fact that they became so central to her run was probably pretty painful.
I totally see a resignation from politics-- a real one, at least for now-- at this point. The fact that the onslaught on her eldest daughter and her son didn't end after the failed bid I think is pretty key. I don't think she was really prepared to fail (again, by herself or by the party).
I suspect she'll be back in a couple of years, probably as a lobbyist.
***
The thing that I don't get is, outside of personal reasons to resign now, the "lame duck" comment. She says she doesn't want to finish her term because-- why? Because without the promise or possibility of re-election she's just killing time? That seems upsidedown to me. I would have thought that someone who works only because they're going to be re-elected is exactly the kind of person you don't want in Politics (or in any job, really). It shows a very lazy attitude towards work and very poor dedication. That might be forgivable if you're working at McDonalds, but if you're in politics, you should at least pretend you care enough about the people you're representing to finish your term.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
Rakeesh: No it isn't. For my part however, I feel that while most people might draw opposing conclusions like, "I'd vote for her," and "I wouldn't vote for her" and their basis for disagreement is truly a matter of opinion, in Sarah Palin's case, I honestly feel that the statement, "She is not qualified to be a good president" is true beyond any reasonable doubt. I've never heard a good criticism of that statement, maybe it exists, maybe it doesn't.
I just don't see why she would make a good candidate. To me, her positions on issues that matter to me are more often wrong than right. In addition, her understanding of the world is limited to the point that I don't believe she has the ground work necessary to make even basically correct decisions regarding foreign policy and dealing with leaders from other countries.
Posted by Chris Bridges (Member # 1138) on :
A lot of the defense of her that I see can be attributed to the "weak man" argument, where defenders ignore the valid complaints about her and target only the vicious attacks.
Statement #1: Gov. Palin has displayed poor judgment in her ethical dealings. Statement #2: Gov. Palin has repeatedly misstated events and belligerently stuck to those misstatements, even in the face of irrefutable evidence against them. Statement #3: During her campaign Gov. Palin spoke to the worst elements of her party, deliberately evoking connections between Obama and terrorists even after Sen. McCain spoke against such statements. Statement #4: While Gov. Palin undoubtedly has experience in governing and an impressive way of connecting to her base, her responses in interviews reveal her to be largely unaware of, and worse, unconcerned with many issues a VP would have to face. Statement #5: What's with the "family values" lady having a pregnant daughter? And how can she be VP with a retarded kid to care for? Who's kid is that, anyway? She's a total nutjob! Hey, did you see Tina Fey on SNL...
Defense: That sort of sexist, anti-family attack is exactly the sort of thing we've come to expect from etc etc etc...
I believe that for many Palin defenders she has made a real connection. They see a spirited person, someone with values they agree with and energy to burn, someone they'd like to know. And when someone attacks a friend, you defend that friend. That's her gift, and were it backed with a reality-based awareness she'd be unstoppable.
I also realize that for many Palin defenders who believe there are valid refutations of the first 4 statements, this post is going to come off as condescending. I'm afraid I have yet to read such refutations, and nothing I've seen has changed my mind about her abilities. Frankly, most of the pro-Palin press has been varying degrees of "But we just love her."
Posted by Occasional (Member # 5860) on :
I have to agree with what someone else said: This is good news for Romney. In fact, this might even be good news for former Gov. Hunstman (I realize both of these men are Mormon, but they are also the only ones still standing who have been more than mentioned as serious GOP candidates). Yes, no one can read the future and the next Pres. race is years away. Almost no one heard of Obama or Huckabee before the 08 elections. All that is a fact I take into consideration. However, for right now I think he (and possibly with some time Huntsman) is the true front runner of the GOP. The others might have a following, like Palin and Huckabee, but not credibility. Pawlenty is the only other person I have heard of who could compete.
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
Teshi, you wrote out exactly what I was thinking.
quote:Originally posted by Teshi: The thing that I don't get is, outside of personal reasons to resign now, the "lame duck" comment. She says she doesn't want to finish her term because-- why? Because without the promise or possibility of re-election she's just killing time? That seems upsidedown to me.
This is the part I don't understand, either. I don't think anyone expects to elect someone for a particular term of office and for that person to resign before the term is carried out -- that can't be a good thing. There is the chaos of transition to someone who was not elected to that office, and then whomever takes over is also a lame duck, because their time is quite limited, too. It doesn't seem to improve the situation at all, at least not for the citizenry.
That's the part that has me really scratching my head.
Posted by Chris Bridges (Member # 1138) on :
IMHO because she has her own reasons for quitting that she realized might not sound sufficient, especially if she wants to continue her political career, so she added that to foster the impression that she's doing it for the good of the state. My impression is that this is an entirely personal decision -- which is fine, everyone needs to take their personal life into account when making these decisions -- but her rambling explanation sounded to me like after-the-fact rationalization of that decision.
Actually, as I posted elsewhere, her speech sounded to me like a disgruntled forum member loudly announcing that she's tired of the abuse and she's leaving now. If Palin hangs around anyway and keeps bickering with the people making fun of her for leaving, we'll know I was right Posted by dabbler (Member # 6443) on :
The public reason is that apparently the Alaskan treasury had to pay to defend Palin against allegations like the ethics probe. She stated in her column that she doesn't want the taxpayers to continue paying for those kinds of unfounded claims throughout her governorship. Not a bad reason, on the surface. In addition, she mentions that she and her husband also have mounting legal fees due to this process.
My guess is that she's going to pursue her book deal and that it will make millions for her. If I were her I'd stay quiet after that but she'll probably go on to lobby. She'd probably be good at it.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by Occasional: Almost no one heard of Obama or Huckabee before the 08 elections...
What? Really? I heard all about Obama in 2004 when he won his senate seat and gave the keynote address at the Democratic National Convention. I also heard about his books. He was pretty well known before the campaign started- that's why he ran so soon after his senate win. At least that's my perception, because I was fully aware of who Obama was way before the campaign started.
Posted by Teshi (Member # 5024) on :
quote:MHO because she has her own reasons for quitting that she realized might not sound sufficient, especially if she wants to continue her political career, so she added that to foster the impression that she's doing it for the good of the state. My impression is that this is an entirely personal decision -- which is fine, everyone needs to take their personal life into account when making these decisions -- but her rambling explanation sounded to me like after-the-fact rationalization of that decision.
Yeah, I think this too. I'm just surprised that this (the lame duck thing) is regarded as a good excuse.
Posted by Teshi (Member # 5024) on :
quote:What? Really? I heard all about Obama in 2004 when he won his senate seat and gave the keynote address at the Democratic National Convention.
Me too. Someone linked to his website saying, "this guy looks good for 2008".
Posted by Amanecer (Member # 4068) on :
To elaborate on Dabbler's point:
quote: The state says it has spent nearly $300,000 to investigate the complaints, and Palin says she has racked up more than $500,000 in legal fees fighting them.
I agree with those who've said they think the resignation is sincere. Being so in the public eye has clearly been awful for her and her family. I think the investigations allow her to feel that it's also bad for Alaska. I have never been a fan of Palin, but I hope that the media takes this desire for a private life seriously and allows the family a bit of privacy.
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
quote:Originally posted by dabbler: The public reason is that apparently the Alaskan treasury had to pay to defend Palin against allegations like the ethics probe.
Honest question: does the Alaskan treasury have to pay, or [could she have insisted] on paying the legal fees herself? Because that is what she'll be doing now anyway, right?
---
Edited to add: Or is the idea that the allegations will be prosecuted less vigorously if she is not in office?
Regardless, I hope she and her family have what time and space they need to be a private family again.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
quote:Originally posted by katharina: I think the only really bad thing about Palin is the appalling, nasty, dreadful behavior people perform when they talk about her.
I can't believe you can say that with a straight face.
Yo Orin, are my posts at least more coherent then hers?
Posted by FlyingCow (Member # 2150) on :
If she really is gearing up for a presidential run, I don't see how this can look good.
She felt it was too much pressure on her family, that the media was out to get her, that investigations into her conduct were piling up and preventing her from getting anything done, that she wanted to do things in the state but the legislature was opposing her, etc... and her answer is to resign from office and not seek another term.
Does she somehow feel any of these things will be lessened as president?
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
I'm not sure what you're really asking. I usually disagree with her, but she's also usually coherent. On the other hand I more often agree with you, and you are less often coherent... But it doesn't really matter, because this is just about whether you agree or disagree.
I'm a little more interested in how OSC is going to spin this. He's become something of a wildcard when it comes to interpreting political news, you really never know which way he's going to bounce these days. I'll put my money on either a) he completely and utterly ignored it, or b) a sanctimonious and scathing finger wagging at the "leftaliban."
Posted by MrSquicky (Member # 1802) on :
One thing that I think may be missing that I'm just going to through out is that Sarah Palin was the one who released the unexpected information that her daughter was pregnant. She was the one who put her daughter's situation out there. And while it got play in the blogs and late night comedy shows, the way it made it to mainstream media was because Sarah Palin kept bringing it up in what seemed like a political ploy.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by FlyingCow: She felt it was too much pressure on her family, that the media was out to get her, that investigations into her conduct were piling up and preventing her from getting anything done, that she wanted to do things in the state but the legislature was opposing her, etc... and her answer is to resign from office and not seek another term.
Does she somehow feel any of these things will be lessened as president?
No, she is incapable of handling the political spotlight, unequivocally. I think every Republican strategist and his mother knows this, and she wouldn't have had a chance in hell of getting party support for a run with the stink of failure and pathos all over her. As Sam put it, this is the coup de grace.
It's written all over her at this point. "I can't handle this." And we really shouldn't be shocked by this. This is a person who bounced around to six different colleges in the six years after her graduation from high school. Doesn't make her dumb, but it also doesn't speak well of her as a poised, equipped and persevering person.
Posted by hobsen (Member # 11808) on :
So far as I noticed, there have been no comments on the timing of Palin's resignation announcement. The choice of late afternoon on the day before the Fourth of July, in the remote location of Wasilla and with no TV network representatives present, looks as if she and her handlers wanted her speech to attract as little attention as possible. That does not seem to me to be the way she would kick off a political crusade, like turning the government of Alaska over to a subordinate so she can concentrate on steering the United States as a whole toward a better future.
On the whole I hope the problem is not the one with her home. Todd Palin claims he paid for the materials for that 3400? sq. ft. Wasilla home and built it himself with the help of friends. The allegation is that the materials were donated by the corporation that secured the contract to construct the Wasilla sports complex, and the "friends" paid by them. It seems certain federal investigators have in fact been trying to prove that by seizing records from the contractor and interviewing its employees. But they may have come up empty, because the Palin's home was built just the way Todd Palin says it was. But if those allegations are true, Sarah Palin accepted a very large bribe during her time as mayor of Wasilla. And both she and her husband knowingly filed false income taxes for that period, meaning the IRS may be pursuing them on criminal charges. And while they strike me as marginal parents, I do not think their children would benefit if they were both languishing in federal prisons. So I hope this is a case where the smoke comes from someone's cigarette, and not from a real fire. Or can someone here maybe point out where my analysis is at fault?
[ July 04, 2009, 12:30 PM: Message edited by: hobsen ]
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
quote:Let's stipulate that if there is some heretofore unknown personal, medical or family crisis, this was the right move. But Gov. Palin didn't say anything like that. Her statement was incoherent, bizarre and juvenile. The text, as posted on Gov. Palin's official website (here), uses 2,549 words and 18 exclamation points. Lincoln freed the slaves with 719 words and nary an exclamation; Mr. Jefferson declared our independence in 1,322 words and, again, no exclamation points. Nixon resigned the presidency in 1,796 words -- still no exclamation points. Gov. Palin capitalized words at random - whole words, like "TO," "HELP," and "AND," and the first letter of "Troops."
Gov. Palin's official announcement that she is resigning as chief executive of the great state of Alaska had all the depth and gravitas of a 13-year-old's review of the Jonas Brothers' album on Facebook. She even quoted her parents' refrigerator magnet. (Note to self: if one of my kids becomes governor, throw away the refrigerator magnet that says: "Murray's Oyster Bar: We Shuck Em, You Suck Em!") She put her son's name in quotations marks. Why? Who knows. She writes, "I promised efficiencies and effectiveness!?" Was she exclaiming or questioning? I get it: both! And I don't even know what to make of a sentence that reads:
He he he he.
Posted by Occasional (Member # 5860) on :
I know your all proud of yourselves for dogging on how Palin talks and writes. What you don't understand is bad grammar, exclamation marks, refrigerator magnet (i.e. bumper sticker) sayings represent "Middle and Western America" just as much as "Ebonics" represents black culture. Its all muddled and incoherent to you, but crystal clear to her constituents. Have I read it? I haven't because I respect her, but am not a follower enough to care.
quote:I also realize that for many Palin defenders who believe there are valid refutations [of reasons she shouldn't be President], this post is going to come off as condescending. I'm afraid I have yet to read such refutations, and nothing I've seen has changed my mind about her abilities. Frankly, most of the pro-Palin press has been varying degrees of "But we just love her."
This is EXACTLY how I feel Obama got elected. He was nothing more than a made in Hollywood President who continues to prove he is way over his head. Of course, the defenders will continue the mantra, "but he's popular" as if that wipes away his deficiencies. He is also Black and can read a teleprompter . . . umm, umm . . . real good. His "refrigerator magnet" sayings included "Hope and Change," mixed with "Yes we can!" rhetoric with no real answer of what those mean. If Palin wasn't ready to be VP, I don't see why Obama was ready to be President. He has far more power now than Palin would have unless McCain had died.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by Occasional: What you don't understand is bad grammar, exclamation marks, refrigerator magnet (i.e. bumper sticker) sayings represent "Middle and Western America" just as much as "Ebonics" represents black culture.
:facepalm:
Yeah. We're the ones in the dark here- we're out of touch.
"You guys are making fun because you just don't get it, but I do, but I haven't read it, because I respect her, but I don't care..."
What??
quote: Of course, the defenders will continue the mantra, "but he's popular" as if that wipes away his deficiencies. He is also Black and can read a teleprompter . . . umm, umm . . . real good. His "refrigerator magnet" sayings included "Hope and Change," mixed with "Yes we can!" rhetoric with no real answer of what those mean
:snirfle:
"you guys shouldn't make fun of the midwestern candidate because you don't get it."
"Besides, that other midwestern candidate, who IS BLACK MAY I ADD, sucks for all those same reasons OMG LOLZ he is dumb rofl!"
"But seriously, I respect Palin, she is folksy and in touch"
Occ, if you don't see where the two parts of your brain have disconnected here, well I can't say I'm going to be shocked. I didn't realize you harbored such racial animosity though. That did surprise me.
Posted by Occasional (Member # 5860) on :
I hold racial animosity so long as race is used to mean "whites are evil." With Obama I believe he was voted in not as President of the U.S., but as reparation and quota filler for the White House job. Besides that, I believe his comments about race, such as about his white grandmother, have been subtle racism as I defined above.
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
Wow. Even for the internet, that's racist.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
So your saying that the writing and speaking skills a 3rd grader would be ashamed is a valid reason for voting for Palin?
And what El JT de Spang said to.
Posted by King of Men (Member # 6684) on :
Having read the speech, it doesn't seem so bad as all that. I don't see the vast grammar mistakes or the bad quotation marks. It's not great rhetoric by any means, and it meanders about for miles before getting to the point, to the extent that it does get to the point. Not to mention repeating itself. But I don't see where this venom is coming from. Looks like a pretty ordinary speech for a woman of average intelligence.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by Occasional: I hold racial animosity so long as race is used to mean "whites are evil." With Obama I believe he was voted in not as President of the U.S., but as reparation and quota filler for the White House job. Besides that, I believe his comments about race, such as about his white grandmother, have been subtle racism as I defined above.
I am thankful that Obama has managed to be much more thoughtful on the subject than you have been.
I'm sorry for you.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
quote:Originally posted by King of Men: Having read the speech, it doesn't seem so bad as all that. I don't see the vast grammar mistakes or the bad quotation marks. It's not great rhetoric by any means, and it meanders about for miles before getting to the point, to the extent that it does get to the point. Not to mention repeating itself. But I don't see where this venom is coming from. Looks like a pretty ordinary speech for a woman of average intelligence.
That I think she needed help writing.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by King of Men: Looks like a pretty ordinary speech for a woman of average intelligence.
Perhaps so, but are you aware of your vastly superior skills at prose construction? English isn't even your first language, although you're most obviously an "L1" speaker.
The point is not that she can't write- my mother can't write an email without making hash of it, and she's an executive. The point is that she's giving public speeches that are grossly above her actual ability to give. That's bad.
Posted by Sharpie (Member # 482) on :
I think it's a ridiculously bad speech, but her delivery really was a factor in my read of it now. She came off as nearly hysterical in parts.
Reading all the exclamation points does NOT help .
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
quote:Have I read it? I haven't because I respect her...
I submit that you are only capable of respecting her because you haven't read it.
Posted by Tuukka (Member # 12124) on :
quote:Originally posted by King of Men: Looks like a pretty ordinary speech for a woman of average intelligence.
If you mean an ordinary speech from a woman of average intelligence, who isn't used to doing analytical thinking, and isn't used to communicating her thoughts concisely... I can agree with that.
Most women - and most men - are like that. And there is nothing bad about it.
But Palin is a governor and a lot of people even wanted her to be a vice-president. Some even still want her to be a president. We have to hold that kind of person to a higher standard than your average American housewife.
The real issue isn't even in the form of her writing. It's in the content, or the lack of.
Hell, I can accept someone in a leading position, who isn't used to writing, or even reading. But it's a lot harder to accept someone who isn't used to thinking. And that's how Sarah Palin seems to be most of the time: Lacking in logical reasoning, analytical thinking, or even old-fashioned common sense. Her latest speech is just the cherry on the top.
It all seems even worse when you consider the fact that she could let more competent people check her speeches before she gives them.
But she doesn't. Which implies that either she doesn't care to be professional, or she actually believes herself to be so professional that her speeches don't need to be checked.
Either way, it shows bad judgement. And I prefer people in leading positions to show good judgement instead of bad.
Posted by King of Men (Member # 6684) on :
quote:Originally posted by Orincoro:
quote:Originally posted by King of Men: Looks like a pretty ordinary speech for a woman of average intelligence.
Perhaps so, but are you aware of your vastly superior skills at prose construction?
Yes, I am. "Average intelligence" is not a compliment. Even so, it seems to me that the speech is calling forth venom where calm dismissal would be more reasonable. What can you expect from this woman, after all? Perhaps it's to do with the delivery, as was suggested; I don't watch speeches as a rule, it takes too long, so I can't speak to that. If the delivery was more than usually execrable, perhaps that accounts for the contempt.
As a side note, I suspect that people on Hatrack are used to interacting with others who are a sigma or two above average, and therefore tend to overestimate the intelligence of the general population. Comrade Palin really is 'folksy', in the sense of being representative of average people. That is unusual in a politician, and makes her look particularly bad compared to the usual lot. Most average people don't come to our attention on national television, and therefore do not expose their lack of intelligence.
Posted by Sterling (Member # 8096) on :
You know... I don't hate Sarah Palin. I don't feel a need to suggest that one can't be the parent of a high-needs child and still be the leader of a state, or a nation, for that matter. If she had just served out her time in Alaska, I wouldn't have thought much of her at all; probably gotten the occasional grousing e-mail from my friends fighting the good fight in Juneau and Anchorage, but that would be the end of it.
But out on the national stage, her weaknesses are very, very prominant, and you have to put on blinders to ignore them. She's the kind of politician who can say what the loudest people in the crowd want to hear, but that's a damn poor qualification for leadership that demands serious consideration, hard choices, and calls that come from the head rather than the gut (for all the good ol' American fondness for the latter.)
Worse, she's shown a real petulance with both the media and her former associates, a quality we absolutely cannot afford right now. We don't need someone who remembers recent grudges and forgets old alliances. We need someone who can state our case without falling back on truisms that are anything but true to the target audience. Someone who recognizes the limitations of sports metaphors.
If Palin fades from the spotlight, it would be best for everyone. Everyone. This is not what we need from our leadership. This is not what the Republican party needs to present as its ideal. This is not what we need anyone suggesting is a portrait of the "Real America". This is a former beauty queen with a (not atypically) slightly screwed-up family who is a fine candidate for Mayor of a little place like Wasilla without too many hard choices or big responsibilities.
Go in peace, Sarah Palin, but for the love of Pete, GO! Posted by Synesthesia (Member # 4774) on :
I am not fond of her. It's mostly her point of view on wolves and predators in general.
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
quote:Originally posted by Occasional: I know your all proud of yourselves for dogging on how Palin talks and writes. What you don't understand is bad grammar, exclamation marks, refrigerator magnet (i.e. bumper sticker) sayings represent "Middle and Western America" just as much as "Ebonics" represents black culture.
Occasional, anytime — and I mean absolutely anytime — I read you try to dissect culture for the sake of appropriating an understanding of it or present a theory about sociopolitical realities, you reveal that you have no such understanding and are, in fact, remarkably detached from anything other than a pastiche of reinforced stereotypes. This is no exception.
I, for one, cannot wait for our affirmative action president to deliver his weekly addresses, wearing fugu, speaking crystal-clear ebonics to represent black culture. I cannot wait to not listen to it because I respect him.
Its all muddled and incoherent to you, but crystal clear to his constituents. Have I rapped along with him or even given him a beat-box backup? I haven't because I respect him, but am not a follower enough to care.
Posted by Chris Bridges (Member # 1138) on :
quote:This is EXACTLY how I feel Obama got elected. He was nothing more than a made in Hollywood President who continues to prove he is way over his head. Of course, the defenders will continue the mantra, "but he's popular" as if that wipes away his deficiencies. He is also Black and can read a teleprompter . . . umm, umm . . . real good. His "refrigerator magnet" sayings included "Hope and Change," mixed with "Yes we can!" rhetoric with no real answer of what those mean. If Palin wasn't ready to be VP, I don't see why Obama was ready to be President. He has far more power now than Palin would have unless McCain had died.
He is indeed black. And yes, he can read a teleprompter, although why in the world that's become an issue I can't fathom, other than right-wing commentators decided it should be. (I don't recall seeing a teleprompter at any of the debates, or in any of his interviews, or in his press conferences, and other politicians and presidents have used them for public speaking. Seriously, why even bring it up?)
But as I recall, I voted for him because he planned to:
Close Gitmo. End the Iraq war. Restore the checks and balances to government. Bring transparency to government. Bring us public health care. End "don't ask, don't tell." Stop the tax cuts for the rich. Respect science again. Govern from reality, common sense and expert opinion over ideology. Address global warming. Respect the other people of the world, and talk with their leaders. Reach across the aisle to work together with both sides.
Now, he's fallen short on several of these, and some I believe are on his list but aren't coming about as quickly as I'd like, and some have been watered down by the realities of the situations or to get them past the legislature. But there were definite reasons I voted for him that had nothing to do with his skin color.
Offhand, I can't think of a single thing Sarah Palin ever said in public that would cause me to vote for her. Not one. McCain did; I respected him highly in the beginning of the campaign, before he lost his mind, and I liked many of his positions. But Palin never struck me as anything other than a gimmick.
Posted by King of Men (Member # 6684) on :
quote:If you mean an ordinary speech from a woman of average intelligence, who isn't used to doing analytical thinking, and isn't used to communicating her thoughts concisely... I can agree with that.
That's what average intelligence implies, as a general rule.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
KoM, I respect you too much to read that last post.
Posted by Teshi (Member # 5024) on :
quote:Sarah Palin has hinted she might take on a wider political role in the US, one day after abruptly announcing she was resigning as governor of Alaska.
"I am now looking ahead and how we can advance this country together," she wrote on her Facebook page.
Here is the note in question. Ugh, political leaders using Facebook for announcements-- not even clear announcements, just vague hints. Ugh, ugh.
Secondly, that's not even a good sentence. She meant "to", not "and".
Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
More likely she meant "at" rather than "and" or "to". Its a relatively common error when typing. It's an error that should have been caught in editing but not really evidence of poor writing ability or an inability to construct a proper sentence.
[ July 05, 2009, 09:54 AM: Message edited by: The Rabbit ]
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
No, there's plenty of other evidence of abysmal writing ability.
Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
I would have had more respect for Palin if she had simply said that that here VP campaign and national exposure had taken a heavy toll on her family. If she had said that when she ran for Governor, she had not expected she would give birth to a disabled son or that her teenage daughter would get pregnant. She had not expected to be invited to run for VP or the media scrutiny that accompanied that venture but that all these things had taken a serious toll on her ability to govern Alaska. If she had simply said that under the circumstance, should could not do justice to the job of governor and fill her family and personal responsibilities so she was resigning -- that would have been respectable.
But if it had been in her nature to make that kind of choice, should would never have accepted the VP nomination when she had a new baby and pregnant daughter and was only 1.5 years into her first term as Alaska governor. Which made me a cynical right off.
From my point of view, however, It was throwing in the part about not wanting to be a lame duck that made her look like a lunatic. You are not a lame duck when you are barely past the half way mark on your elected term. The idea that the only thing she could accomplish in the next two years was to spend the tax payers money on junkets is just silly. Its insulting to the myriad of politicians who after choosing not to run for re-election, use that time to try to finish their most important goals or make hard choices that have long term benefits to the public. It was like she was trying desperately to maintain the image of being a maverick fighting business as usual and saying I'm leaving to because my family needs me had been used too many times to seem anything but business as usual.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
Yeah, I was struck by the silliness of those "business as usual" comments. Like, yes, I'm quitting my term only half finished for no stated reason- BET YOU DIDN'T SEE THAT COMING! I'm a Maverick!
Posted by Juxtapose (Member # 8837) on :
quote:I know your all proud of yourselves for dogging on how Palin talks and writes. What you don't understand is bad grammar, exclamation marks, refrigerator magnet (i.e. bumper sticker) sayings represent "Middle and Western America" just as much as "Ebonics" represents black culture. Its all muddled and incoherent to you, but crystal clear to her constituents.
If you live in a part of the country that uses a significantly different dialect of English, then you ought to be learning both the form used in your community, and the standardized form.
If she is unable to communicate effectively using standard English, that would indicate a serious professional lack. I believe we had a thread some time ago where we talked about phone support staff that have thick accents. This is no different.
If she is able to communicate effectively using standard English, and deliberately chose not to, that would indicate that she's only interested in speaking to a subset of the population of Alaska. Considering we're talking about her last official statement as Governor, and that her resignation impacts the entire citizenry there, I think that would be a pretty telling choice.
It could also be a combination of both, which I find most likely.
Posted by Juxtapose (Member # 8837) on :
The worst part is that it took me a couple of paragraphs to see that it had been jumbled.
quote: And Lieutenant General Craig Campbell will assume the role of Lieutenant Governor. It would be apathetic to just hunker down and "go with the flow". I want Alaskans to grasp what can be in store for our state.
The fact that these three sentences are pulled at random from the text of the speech says something interesting. I'd like to see this method applied to other politicians and speakers, and see if the results would be different.
quote: I've explained why... though I think of the saying on my parents' refrigerator that says "Don't explain: your friends don't need it and your enemies won't believe you anyway." We need those who will respect our Constitution where government's supposed to serve from the BOTTOM UP, not move toward this TOP DOWN big government take-over... but rather, will be protectors of individual rights - who also have enough common sense to acknowledge when conditions have drastically changed and are willing to call an audible and pass the ball when it's time so the team can win! Life is too short to compromise time and resources..., it may be tempting and more comfortable to just keep your head down, plod along, and appease those who demand: "Sit down and shut up", but that's the worthless, easy path; that's a quitter's way out.
This paragraph actually reads like it is part of the original speech. Oh the platitudes!
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
The ever-odious dowd started an article essentially accusing Palin of being certifiably narcissist to the point of having a personality disorder, yammered on in that direction for a while, but at the end she centered in on a finally reasonable point about those platitudes.
She words it in a way that really does offer something of an explanation about the mentality and unwitting rationale behind the inanity of her speech. The platitudes are the result of classic casuistry on her part.
quote:After girlish burbling about how “progressing our state” and serving Alaska “is the greatest honor that I could imagine,” and raving about how much she loves her job, she abruptly announced that she was making the ultimate sacrifice: dumping the state on her lieutenant.
Why “milk it,” as she put it, when you can quit it? “Only dead fish go with the flow,” she said, while cold fish can blow out of town. Leaving Alaska in the lurch is best for Alaska. She can better “effect change” in government from outside government. She can fulfill her promise of “efficiencies and effectiveness” by deserting Juneau midway through her term — and taking her tanning bed with her.
“We need those who will respect our Constitution,” said Palin, who swore on the Bible to uphold the Constitution. She said she can’t fulfill that silly old oath of office in the usual way because she’s not “wired to operate under the same old politics as usual.”
Naturally, she dragged the troops in, saying that her trip to see wounded soldiers overseas “fortified” her decision to give up because “they don’t give up.”
She refuses to succumb to the “politics of personal destruction.” It’s no fun unless she’s the one aiming those poison darts, as she did when she accused Barack Obama of associating “with terrorists who targeted their own country.”
Sometimes, she explained, if you’re the star, you have to “call an audible and pass the ball” and leave at halftime, “so the team can win” somehow without you.
The maverick must run free when greener pastures beckon. The musher must jump out of the dogsled when warmer climes call. As Palin’s spokeswoman, Meg Stapleton, says, “The world is literally her oyster.”
But just remember, beloved Alaska, it’s all about you.
Posted by Darth_Mauve (Member # 4709) on :
Occasional, you almost slipped the old Double Reverse right by me.
The double reverse is when you attack your opponents for having your own failings.
Hence you call President Obama a Token black person in the White House, when in actuality it was Sarah Palin who was selected as a token woman by the Republicans.
The only reason she was pushed forward as a VP candidate was in the hopes that she would capture disaffected women upset about Hillary Clinton's loss and lack of VP Candidate status.
You are right, that people should not be chosen to fill a quota based on gender, or race, but only on competence.
It seems that most of President Obama's decisions have been competent. Governor Palin's, not so much.
Posted by King of Men (Member # 6684) on :
Further to the subject of average people being not very bright: Overcoming Bias (link is to a specific post on this subject). Example:
quote:For example, in 1992 out of a random sample of US adults, 7% could not do item SCOR300, which is to find the expiration date on a driver’s license.
I admit to feeling a bit ambivalent about this evidence of stupidity, since just the other year I tried travelling to Scotland on an expired passport. Admittedly it wasn't a question of being unable to find the date; I just hadn't thought to look. But still. And in fact, that reminds me, I need a new driver's license. And I'll likely have to take the test over again, sigh. Maybe they'll give me a renewable one this time.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
I think Palin was chosen for the MILF quota.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
Seeing as you've got the green card now, I don't see why not- I took the test at 16 and don't have to take it again for some time- I don't even remember how long.
Posted by King of Men (Member # 6684) on :
quote:Originally posted by Blayne Bradley: I think Palin was chosen for the MILF quota.
A bad move on McCain's part, if so, since she became a GILF-to-be during the campaign.
Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
quote:it may be tempting and more comfortable to just keep your head down, plod along, and appease those who demand: "Sit down and shut up", but that's the worthless, easy path; that's a quitter's way out.
Ummm, ummm, Do I understand this correctly? She's quitting because she's not a quitter.
Ummm, ahhh. It's really embarrassing that this woman holds any political office in my country more important than city council.
[ July 06, 2009, 05:35 AM: Message edited by: The Rabbit ]
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
more embarrassing then George W. Bush getting elected twice?
Posted by Jamio (Member # 12053) on :
Yes, more embarrassing than GW Bush because I did not vote for Bush, but I did spend a lot of personal capital defending Sarah Palin to my friends before voting for her ticket.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jamio: Yes, more embarrassing than GW Bush because I did not vote for Bush, but I did spend a lot of personal capital defending Sarah Palin to my friends before voting for her ticket.
Do you now regret that decision?
I for one find it embarrassing for all of us. She still represents a US state- not my state, but still part of America.
Posted by Jamio (Member # 12053) on :
I regret that she was McCain's VP pick (not as much as I hope he regrets it), and I regret the second, third....eightieth chance I gave her to prove herself a suitable candidate before I gave in the the obvious, but I do not regret voting for McCain.
But I do not see that I should be emotionally involved where I am not personally involved. I am embarrassed by some aspects of Bush's legacy because he was the president of my country, and embarrassed by Palin because she was a candidate on a national ticket that I voted for, and if Romney ever does something ridiculous I will be embarrassed by him, too, as a fellow mormon. By I'm not embarrassed at all by, say, the fiasco that has been the Minnesota senate race. I am not a Minnasotan nor a member of Coleman's or Franken's political parties. That'd be like being embarrassed because my neighbor likes to dress up her porch goose. Not my porch goose.
Posted by ricree101 (Member # 7749) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jamio: That'd be like being embarrassed because my neighbor likes to dress up her porch goose. Not my porch goose.
I'd be careful if I were you. You never know what those sorts of shifty people are up to with your porch goose.
Posted by FlyingCow (Member # 2150) on :
I just read that Karl Rove's response was "It's a risky strategy."
I couldn't help but think of Dodgeball:
"Unbelievable. It looks like Average Joe's is forfeiting the game." "That's a bold move, Cotton, we'll see if it pays off."
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
The spin that's getting filtered into every report on this is ridiculous. This is one of the worst moves possible if she really wants to run for President. I'm glad- that's it for her.
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
quote:I just read that Karl Rove's response was "It's a risky strategy."
look at this.
honestly, just look at this.
this is the best that Karl Rove can spin this.
Karl Rove. Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jamio: Not my porch goose.
If Hatrack had signature lines ... Posted by Jhai (Member # 5633) on :
Disclaimer: I'm just sharing because this gave me a much-needed laugh today, not because I think it proves anything other than Palin's poor choice for a spokeswoman.
Money quote: "The world is literally her oyster." youtube Posted by scifibum (Member # 7625) on :
Literally.
Posted by scifibum (Member # 7625) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jhai: Disclaimer: I'm just sharing because this gave me a much-needed laugh today, not because I think it proves anything other than Palin's poor choice for a spokeswoman.
Money quote: "The world is literally her oyster." youtube
Honestly the most tortured attempt at spin I've ever witnessed.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
Poor Anderson. He's like a 4th grade teacher trying to get his students to do a little performance on parent's night.
"don't you have something to show the audience, don't you? Common! Common! Let's show the audience your spin! Let's show them! There ya go! Go for it!"
What's funny is that Palin spin treats "issues" like something other than problems to be worked on, and more like goals on a 2-d platformer: "She's free now to find that energy independence." It's like "energy independence" is a power-up that Palin is going to collect to win the game.
When they treat problems and goals like this, it makes you wonder what they actually understand about the challenges a real leader faces. Palin buckled under the simple stuff.
Posted by Rappin' Ronnie Reagan (Member # 5626) on :
Maybe he'd do better if he didn't call the students common.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
Har Har. I wrote it that way to reflect the rhythm of the word. I do it all the time. Eat your hat why don't you.
Posted by Rappin' Ronnie Reagan (Member # 5626) on :
quote:Originally posted by Orincoro: I do it all the time.
I've noticed.
Do you actually pronounce come on/c'mon the same as the word common? I've never heard anyone pronounce it that way.
Posted by Jon Boy (Member # 4284) on :
quote:Originally posted by Orincoro: I wrote it that way to reflect the rhythm of the word. I do it all the time.
But the double consonant makes the first syllable look like it should be stressed (like the word common). Comon would make more sense to me, but c'mon is what I've always seen.
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jhai: Disclaimer: I'm just sharing because this gave me a much-needed laugh today, not because I think it proves anything other than Palin's poor choice for a spokeswoman.
Money quote: "The world is literally her oyster." youtube
Posted by Tarrsk (Member # 332) on :
quote:Originally posted by CNN.com: On Monday, her personal lawyer also spoke about her resignation.
No legal "bombshell" or personal scandal lies behind Palin's resignation, but off-color jokes by talk-show host David Letterman contributed to her decision to step down, Thomas Van Flein said.
The governor needed a break after being "on duty now for two and a half years solid," he said.
quote:Originally posted by Orincoro: I wrote it that way to reflect the rhythm of the word. I do it all the time.
But the double consonant makes the first syllable look like it should be stressed (like the word common). Comon would make more sense to me, but c'mon is what I've always seen.
Perhaps your solution is more elegant- I'm going for an equal stress on both syllables. Com'on is another alternative, but a cludgy one. Hmmm.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by Samprimary:
quote:The governor needed a break after being "on duty now for two and a half years solid," he said.
quote:Originally posted by Orincoro: I wrote it that way to reflect the rhythm of the word. I do it all the time.
But the double consonant makes the first syllable look like it should be stressed (like the word common). Comon would make more sense to me, but c'mon is what I've always seen.
Perhaps your solution is more elegant- I'm going for an equal stress on both syllables. Com'on is another alternative, but a cludgy one. Hmmm.
You could go for maximum communication. "C'mon" is by far the most common contraction of "come on", and is the most likely to get your point across without spelling out "come on." "Common", already being a word, is inherently confusing.
"Com'on" only saves one character over "come on" (and a whitespace character at that, so zero ink/toner if you go to print), and is not common, so you sacrifice easy readability via recognition all for the sake of one keystroke. Not a worthwhile trade off in my opinion.
[One might be tempted to note that devoting several paragraphs of analysis to the question of whether one should use "c'mon" or "com'on" is perhaps more wasteful than 1000 uses of the deprecated alternative, but one would have to take into account that the 'bum is getting some entertainment out of the activity.]
Posted by Jamio (Member # 12053) on :
quote:Originally posted by scifibum:
quote:Originally posted by Orincoro:
quote:Originally posted by Jon Boy:
quote:Originally posted by Orincoro: I wrote it that way to reflect the rhythm of the word. I do it all the time.
But the double consonant makes the first syllable look like it should be stressed (like the word common). Comon would make more sense to me, but c'mon is what I've always seen.
Perhaps your solution is more elegant- I'm going for an equal stress on both syllables. Com'on is another alternative, but a cludgy one. Hmmm.
You could go for maximum communication. "C'mon" is by far the most common contraction of "come on", and is the most likely to get your point across without spelling out "come on." "Common", already being a word, is inherently confusing.
But, considering the context, was it actually very confusing?
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
Which is why I originally told RRR to eat his hat.
Posted by scifibum (Member # 7625) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jamio:
quote:Originally posted by scifibum:
quote:Originally posted by Orincoro:
quote:Originally posted by Jon Boy:
quote:Originally posted by Orincoro: I wrote it that way to reflect the rhythm of the word. I do it all the time.
But the double consonant makes the first syllable look like it should be stressed (like the word common). Comon would make more sense to me, but c'mon is what I've always seen.
Perhaps your solution is more elegant- I'm going for an equal stress on both syllables. Com'on is another alternative, but a cludgy one. Hmmm.
You could go for maximum communication. "C'mon" is by far the most common contraction of "come on", and is the most likely to get your point across without spelling out "come on." "Common", already being a word, is inherently confusing.
But, considering the context, was it actually very confusing?
Not very. Posted by Jon Boy (Member # 4284) on :
Confusing? No. Distracting? Yes.
Anyway, Orincoro, if you're going for equal stress, I don't see what's wrong with just plain "come on". I think that as an interjection rather than an actual command, it's typically stressed pretty equally on both elements. Just my two cents.
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jon Boy: Confusing? No. Distracting? Yes.
Yeah--pretty much every time you use that construction, Orincoro, it jerks my mind away from whatever point you were making.
Posted by sarcasticmuppet (Member # 5035) on :
RRR's a girl.
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
Your mom's a girl.
Posted by Jon Boy (Member # 4284) on :
Noemon, I think that was hurtful and uncalled for.
Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
That's what SHE said!
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
Posted by breyerchic04 (Member # 6423) on :
Does Sarah Palin have a tv witch obsession? Willow and Piper.
Posted by Jon Boy (Member # 4284) on :
quote:Originally posted by Strider: That's what SHE said!
Ow! My pride! Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
It pinches.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
It binds!
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
It fights crime!
Posted by kmbboots (Member # 8576) on :
As long as it isn't a TSA agent.
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
Ah, but you forget--it also oversteps its bounds!
Posted by Jamio (Member # 12053) on :
It touched Christine on the--!?
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
That's what she said, at least.
Posted by AchillesHeel (Member # 11736) on :
quote:Originally posted by MightyCow: If Palin somehow wins I really will move to Canada.
Nah, England, cuter accents than all that "Eh" stuff. I dont respect Palin for so many reasons, but one stands out as for her career in politics. During the Clinton years, SNL (back when it was good) had a running skit making fun of Janet Reno, going as far as having Will Farrel don a blue dress and speak in an extremly low octave. She never cared, she had a job to do and that was far too important to spend time worrying about some comedians (who have and will always make fun of everyone), but once she had resigned her office and her job was done she busted through a wall to surprise Farrel and intimidate all who laughed at her. Now they laughed with her.
My point is this, Reno ignored SNL while she had responsibilitys and the diginity of an office to uphold, and when that was done she was willing to let some folk laugh at her manly shoulders and salt and pepper bob haircut. Meanwhile SNL hadnt even dug thier claws into the comedic meat that is Sarah Palin, and while trying to gain the second most important office in America she ran to them screaming "please like me, we can be best friends" without having a more distingiushed career and proof of professional validity she was flailing about wanting us to accept her. Bush never worried about our opinion of him, and thats one reason why she will never be president.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
Oh man, that appearance on SNL was the epitome of square-wants-to-be-cool-but-is-instead-sad. I think though that the obvious difference was that SNL was very clearly out to discredit her, not just make fun of her, and the entire cast was perfectly happy to let her be as unfunny and awkward as possible. They make fun of everyone, yes, but we all know that with Palin, they had an easy target that they very much wanted to embarrass. The fact that she actually approached them to appear on the show was just pathos on the cake.
And I know some people will always say that in that situation, she was "laughing at herself" or being generous with her time, or whatever. No. She wasn't laughing, she wasn't funny, she wasn't intended to be funny or allowed to be, and didn't know how to be- and that's her fault.
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
quote:If Palin somehow wins I really will move to Canada.
Canada is very sad to hear you will never be moving to their fine nation Posted by MightyCow (Member # 9253) on :
quote:Originally posted by Samprimary:
quote:If Palin somehow wins I really will move to Canada.
Canada is very sad to hear you will never be moving to their fine nation
Don't be sad Canada, I'll still visit!
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
Been to every country in western and central Europe, includign the mini-nations, and I've still never set foot in Canada.
Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
They have snow. And Blayne.
Posted by MightyCow (Member # 9253) on :
quote:Originally posted by Kwea: They have snow. And Blayne.
I may have to reconsider my offer to visit Posted by Teshi (Member # 5024) on :
quote:Been to every country in western and central Europe, including the mini-nations, and I've still never set foot in Canada.
That's sad. We're maybe not as exciting as Europe, but we're pretty nice all the same.
Posted by Darth_Mauve (Member # 4709) on :
quote:We're maybe not as exciting as Europe, but we're pretty nice all the same.
This inspiring message was brought to you by the Canadian Tourism Center.
Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
Canada: We're not as bad as Greenland!
Posted by Xavier (Member # 405) on :
I've only been about 3 miles into Canada, but I've gone several times (Niagra Falls).
I wouldn't mind moving to Canada, if the citizenship requirements weren't so darn strict.
Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
I grew up in the Adirondacks. Canada came to us each summer.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
They really gotta let us do something about that. I wonder how Peking Geese would taste.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by Teshi:
quote:Been to every country in western and central Europe, including the mini-nations, and I've still never set foot in Canada.
That's sad. We're maybe not as exciting as Europe, but we're pretty nice all the same.
My parents love Vancouver- they've been there twice on holidays. I've just never had occasion to go. What American college student, or recent grad gets a hankering to tour Canada? Maybe they do, just not me.
Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
Some of my best friends are Canadian.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
I've met some really nice cool people from Canada, mainly the west, and I've met some arrogant jerks from Canada, mainly the eastern part.
Number one most annoying thing some Canadians do, in my opinion: tell you they know more about X facet of America than "most Americans." That's just one of those things that only Canadians seem to be willing to say with a straight face- you don't hear it coming from people who aren't both English speaking, and actually from the same continent. That leaves Canadians. Now I'm not even saying it can't be true- it's just an annoying and pointless thing to say, and unfortunately I've heard it one to many times.
That is all. Viva la Canada.
Posted by Teshi (Member # 5024) on :
quote:mainly the eastern part.
Like the Maritimes or Quebec and the Maritimes or Ontario, Quebec and the Maritimes?
Anyway, shockingly, Canada is not full of super-nice zombies but real people! Some of them are jerks.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
I have to admit that a northern neighbor populated entirely with super-nice zombies would be kind of cool.
"Eh, neighbors! We've come down to borrow some cups of sugar. And any brains you've got, um, lying around, you know."
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by Teshi:
quote:mainly the eastern part.
Like the Maritimes or Quebec and the Maritimes or Ontario, Quebec and the Maritimes?
Not that I can recall all of them individually, but the nastier types of Canadians I've met have all been from Quebec or Ontario, or other places, just not from the west. Maybe that's just because we pacific northwestern people sometimes consider ourselves one continuous nation stretching from San Francisco to Vancouver. Alaska can't come though.
Posted by Jon Boy (Member # 4284) on :
quote:Originally posted by Teshi: Anyway, shockingly, Canada is not full of super-nice zombies but real people! Some of them are jerks.
I feel so disillusioned. Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
You thought your wife was a zombie?
Isn't the little one was sleeping through the night now?
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