My sister and I are extremely tight. She's 19. She constantly shares with me all these stories about the latest boy that she is into. She gets incredibly wrapped up with all the wrong guys - guys who are not interested in commitment, or sometimes who are just no interested in her.
Her mood swings to incredible highs and lows all dependent on whether the guy of the day is smiling at her or ignoring her, and I have to hear about it.
My sister is an amazing person - she will give her heart fully and completely to whomever is lucky enough to accept it form her. However, I think that she is being incredibly immature, and I can't fathom the lack of self-respect that she has in allowing herself to ride this emotional train to nowheresville. My other sister, her twin, plays the game with guys. She gets guys to chase her, plays a little hard to get, etc. It makes for a very difficult dynamic.
My sister looks up to me, and gives me all the respect in the world. But every conversation I have with her, I feel like I end up yelling at her. I know I judge her and I know I shouldn't and I end up coming off as the biggest most condescending jerk in the world - but I am very protective and I feel like she keeps making the same mistakes over and and over again, and it drives me insane!
Any ideas?
Posted by ElJay (Member # 6358) on :
Let her grow up. You can't help, and you can't speed it up. Save your advice for a time when she's about to make a REAL mistake, and she might listen to you.
Posted by Armoth (Member # 4752) on :
:-(
I guess...It's so hard to listen to her be so upset about a buncha guys who don't deserve her...
Posted by Cashew (Member # 6023) on :
How much age difference is there between you?
Agree with ElJay, although that's not very satisfying, I know. Just let her know you love her and want her to be happy. But she has to make her own mistakes, unfortunate as that is. It's very difficult to do that with someone you care about. Good luck though.
Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
So don't yell. Offer your opinion, but then walk away and let her make her own mistakes. It is often the ONLY way people really learn.
Just because someone doesn't use your advice right away doesn't mean they aren't listening, or that they don't value your opinion. It just means that they want to decide for themselves.
I know that in my own past I have sometimes been a little offended when someone asked for my advice, but then doesn't take it. I would sometimes feel like that gave me the right...or even an obligation...to say "See? I was right!" when things fell apart.
It doesn't, not usually. Not unless I have a personal stake in it myself, above and beyond offering advice. Sometimes what worked for me in the past will not work for someone else...their goals may be different, their talents may be, or the situation won't be the same, even if it looks like it is.
I have an obligation to offer good advice to my friends...sometimes even if it isn't asked for....but I also have an obligation to respect my family and my friends enough to accept that they may not believe the same things, or do what I recommend.
So I offer what I have to say, then step back and let them do what is right ...or wrong...for themselves.
I just make sure that is they are doing something I didn't recommend, I am there for them if it falls apart. Not so say " I told you so", but to offer a hand, or a shoulder to cry on.
Sometimes I am right....quite often....but sometimes I am wrong, and then it is I who have learned something. Either way, I am there for them if they need me...
That's what family and friends are for, once you become an adult.
Hope that helps.
Posted by erosomniac (Member # 6834) on :
Think about it this way: odds are, your parents watched you make a thousand mistakes as you were growing up, and odds are, told you about many of them as they saw them, and odds are, you ignored them or were openly hostile about it - so you can, at least, empathize with why she's ignoring you.
In other words: What ElJay Said.
Posted by Sterling (Member # 8096) on :
I've said it before, but... Virtually every woman I've been close to has gone through some really awful relationships in her youth before they found good ones. (Hopefully, without getting beaten up, pregnant, or given an STD.)
If she's as close to you as you say, I think the best you can hope for is to remind her of how overly worthwhile she is and to help her not force down any negative feelings she may be having about her current relationshop (without yourself attacking the other person in the relationship.) It's very easy when you're smitten to let bad things go, and abusive relationships are often marked by the abused person feeling like everything is their fault, that they somehow provoke their loved one into mistreating them. But at the same time, love (or "love") often causes one to treat criticism of the object of affection as an attack, to shut it out or dismiss it.
Growth comes from within. The best you can do is be there and be sure that she still looks to you when she needs the strength to move on.
Posted by Armoth (Member # 4752) on :
I'm only three years older than she is. But we have very different personalities. I like to think I'm quite a bit more mature than she is.
I've swallowed the bitter pill that is watching her make her own mistakes. It's just that if she want's my advice at the same time, I've struggled with how to give it without being arrogant about it. It takes a measure of self-control and sensitivity that is almost herculean.
But I suppose this has helped me vent a bit so that I can rise to the occasion the next time it comes around. Thanks guys.
Posted by Mara (Member # 2232) on :
I've found that piercing questions are far more effective than the best advice. Questions that ask her to think about her relationships/patterns/consequences and invite her to come to her own conclusions about what she should do. That way you can avoid putting a teenager on the defensive about her romantic choices, which is an exercise in futility.
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
Why don't you just decline to give her advice next time she asks for it. She'll want to know why, and you can (calmly) explain to her that's it too painful to continually watch her ignore your advice and end up getting stomped on. You love her, and all that, and you will be there to support her, but you find it too frustrating to offer advice that you know she's going to ignore. To her detriment.
Posted by Armoth (Member # 4752) on :
quote:Originally posted by El JT de Spang: Why don't you just decline to give her advice next time she asks for it. She'll want to know why, and you can (calmly) explain to her that's it too painful to continually watch her ignore your advice and end up getting stomped on. You love her, and all that, and you will be there to support her, but you find it too frustrating to offer advice that you know she's going to ignore. To her detriment.
Already did that. She threatened that if i don't want to hear about this, then i won't know ANYTHING about her life and years later when our conversation is superficial and based on the tv shows we mutually enjoy - ill have this conversation to blame.
Fiery...
I kinda got upset and was all - fine, if that's how you see things...
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
Well, it's been my experience that when someone starts making ultimatums that all useful communication has ended.
She sounds like a child.
Posted by Armoth (Member # 4752) on :
Yup. And there is my dilemma.
Posted by Corwin (Member # 5705) on :
I could safely consider myself a child with regard to relationships up to around 23. Give her a break, she's 19. As long as she's safe from physical harm and learns to toughen her mind and emotions a bit she'll be fine. Sometimes it's hard to ignore even the faintest glimmer of hope, despite having X examples of the opposite of what your hoping for; you just need to get to larger values of X. Posted by Corwin (Member # 5705) on :
As for ways to give advice, I guess I like Mara's take best. Just ask her why she wants to do something and what she thinks it will lead to. And do that with the intent of listening to her answers, not of saying "gotcha".
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
Just listen to her and then let her grow up. She will. She is acting very age-appropriately.
Posted by Starsnuffer (Member # 8116) on :
Err, I find it slightly offensive that "doing bad things" as we seem to have concluded is the topic here is age appropriate for me, as I am of a similar age. Age-common perhaps, but just because lots of people do something doesn't mean it's appropriate.
*stalks to a corner and grumbles about drinking, parties, skipping class, difficult social situations and general college-y problems.
Posted by Corwin (Member # 5705) on :
I doubt that kat meant she approved the way Armoth's sister behaves. "Age-common" is most probably what she meant too.
Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
Yeah, that is what I got out of it myself. Age appropriate doesn't mean correct. Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
If someone comes to you for advice, it implies they think you are wiser than they on the subject. If they then complain that you are condescending (i.e. treating them like you know more than they do), it suggests they weren't actually seeking your advice in the first place, they were likely just looking for affirmation.
I think your assessment that your sister is insecure hit the nail on the head. Its sort of interesting that you note the contrast between her and her twin sister. That is a very common pattern in twins, one very confident, extroverted and self assured while the other is more reserved and insecure. I suspect it creates kind of a positive feed back loop, the insecure twin will naturally compare herself to her confident extroverted sister and feel even more insecure.
The best thing you can do for your sister is to help build her self esteem. That can be hard to do when some one is acting like a twit, but it is what needs to be done. Giving in to your frustration and telling her she's a twit is going to make things worse so try to patient and loving especially when she doesn't deserve it.
Posted by Armoth (Member # 4752) on :
Rabbit,
That is a very good assessment. I realized the feedback loop a long time ago, and it put me in a very strange position. My parents aren't exactly extremely supportive and encouraging - they are the type of people that stress results as opposed to the process. As such, I've tried to encourage her and support her wherever I could. My sister recognizes this and lives off of the encouragement i give her. That's why she is constantly reporting all of her activities to me.
But when something so stupid can tamper with her self esteem - the grin or frown of a guy - I feel like he is messing up her progress. I often lose control by telling her that she is the one causing herself this pain - not some guy.
Posted by Traceria (Member # 11820) on :
Just going to add this on top of all the good advice shared above. As mentioned, it can be terribly hard to see someone you love take the hard route while bypassing your advice to use a better one. I had a friend/roommate once who jumped into a relationship and marriage despite all the good (at least I thought it was) sense I threw at her to the contrary. She even verbally agreed that the advice I had for her was wise. A year later, after craziness that actually put her person as well as emotional well-being at risk, she's separated from him. As one of those people who doesn't agree with divorce except under very particular circumstances, I can still say I'm glad she's out of that relationship and think it was right to end it.
The point of all that is: You can't make others' decisions for them and need to remember that. You can offer advice and you can be there for them at the end of the day. My friend has matured and gained a lot of wisdom from taking the hard route, and perhaps that's what she needed to gain it. Who knows. I just made sure I was there for and assured her I loved her just the same despite it all.
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