quote:

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Originally posted by Pepek:
Expect things to get weird.

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quote:

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Expect things to get weird.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Nighthawk:
That's the only reason I fear Star Trek in his hands; ST is not supposed to be weird!

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It's not like Star Trek ever featured little furry orbs that are "born pregnant", a bipedal sentient tyrannosaurus, a maternal slug that looks like burnt cheese and eats rocks, several dozen random alien worlds that contain an almost exact duplicate of an earlier Earthling culture, a giant screaming barrel that wants to talk to whales, telepathic outer space jellyfish, countless omnipotent races defeated by tricks a five year old could see through, and green-skinned alien strippers or anything!
 

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Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
 
Okay. I just rewatched the finale, just so that it'd be fresh in my mind. I don't buy everything in this post, but I can see how they may have gone back to a parallel universe that isn't the same as the one they came from. I mean, Jack seemed pretty clear that his father was alive, and we know that he died in the world Jack came from.

quote:

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Originally posted by Pepek:
LOST stands for L-something O-something String Theory.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pepek:
The island is probably the closest place inbetween the separate, looping, and slightly different, dimensions.

The Hobbit probably had something to do with the underwater station in another dimension, the creator was a musician.. The code song was 'Good Vibrations'

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Pepek:
String theory is based on the idea that there are tiny tiny little strings of existence that make up the universe, but they are vibrating, and each arch of those strings represents a separate dimension. - Good Vibrations, get it?

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quote:

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Originally posted by Pepek:
Locke probably made the station with the chess game.. Hugo probably made the Swan, cause he's the ugly duckling, and it had his numbers button..

Desmond isn't seeing the future, he's seeing the outcomes that have happened in the other dimensions.. no one can see the future, that's silly..

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Pepek:
Jack and Kate probably left the island into a dimension that wasn't their original one. In this one, Jacks dad is alive still (I know the other argument.. I think they are trying to full us though) - And Kate's old love interest, connected to the old toy plane, is alive in this dimension as well. That's why she doesn't want to go back.

Ben is in the coffin. no doubt.
I have explanations if you desire..

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pepek:
'Jacob' is either Jack, Locke, or Jack's father..

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pepek:
The two dead people they found in the cave are probably Jack and Kate.. maybe it's Locke and someone else though (remember how Jack pulled the black and white stones off that one corpse?)

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pepek:
Charlie will be back.
But it will be a different Charlie.

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Pepek:
Hugo's dead lady friend will be back too. She obviously has more connections to this island than she should.

Eyepatch will be back.
Black lady will be back.
They have been on the island so long they probably have amazing healing abilities or something..

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pepek:
Expect things to get weird.

---

quote:

---

'Jacob' is either Jack, Locke, or Jack's father..
the reason you can only see him for a glimpse is because Jacob is too connected to the island and is split between all the different dimensions.

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quote:

---

So the island has this weird electro-magnetic thing going right? And the shack that Ben takes Locke to was surrounded by some sort of sand or dirt or whatever that was(edit-apparently it's volcanic ash), which acts as some sort of barrier/protection which the power can't pass through. And Ben tells Locke that Jacob hates technology so there is nothing that produces any power(edit-in or around the shack). I think Ben has somehow captured part of the island, some of its essence. And that's why things start to go crazy when Locke flips on the flashlight. Jacob(or whatever) feeds off the energy from the flashlight and is able to use some of his(the island's power). That's why he says help me(edit-because Ben has captured him). At the beginning of all the shaking, before the image of a person is in the chair you see the chair empty rocking slightly. If you look closely there's black smoke in the chair, rocking with it.

---

I think the fact that we see black smoke in the chair *before* it manifests itself as a person is important and would indicate that Jacob is not a real person but the island manifested.

I don't know how likely it is that Ben was the man in the coffin. The odds of him leaving the island willingly are 0. But, *if* he was somehow forced to leave the island I can see him killing himself(the newspaper article seemed to indicate it was suicide) and it would fit with what Jack said about him being neither friend nor family and how Kate reacts about going to the funeral...and why no one came.

I loved Charlie and I was really sad to see him die. I actually yelled at the tv screen when he didn't even try to swim out of room after Michael blew open the window.

I'm not sure about all this alternative dimension talk, but time is obviously a very important aspect of the show. The torture room has that backwards dialog that repeats "only fools are enslaved by time and space". The man guarding room 23 was reading A Brief History of Time. Walt spoke backwards to Shannon. There may be another backwards dialog part but i'm not remembering now. Richard hasn't seemed to age at all in like 30 years. And Desmond is now able to see outside of time. This is all off the top of my head, I'm sure there's more too.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
Lost tonight!

This thing is pretty funny(and informative!):

Lost Season 1-3 recap in 8:15
 

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Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
 
"Mr. Friendly throws like a girl." <snicker>
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
I have always thought Desmond was hot, but now that I am reading the Outlander series, oh my heavens, not sure if I will sleep tonight.

And I am thinking Sawyer would make a great Jamie Fraser.

If he could have Des's accent...
 

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Posted by Puffy Treat (Member # 7210) on :
 
No spoilers, but I thought Season 4's opener was a very strong episode. Certainly more satisfying than Season 2 or Season 3's openers.

The only thing I'm bummed about is that this season will be an abbreviated one.
 

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Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
 
Any theories on who the oceanic six are?

We know that it's at least Jake, Kate, and Hurley.
I suspect Micheal is one as well.

I'm also questioning weather anyone else is still alive in the future, since they haven't really confirmed this yet.
 

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Posted by Puffy Treat (Member # 7210) on :
 
Spoilers!
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*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
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...I'm thinking that there are still some survivors on the Island. Otherwise who is Charlie asking Hurley to help?

Edit: Also, the new "Find815.com" viral site doesn't seem to be working for me.
 

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Posted by stihl1 (Member # 1562) on :
 
SPOILERS!


I'm liking the alternate dimension theory. If the island is a wormhole and they broke through to another world or dimension, that would explain the crashed plane and the claims they were all dead. What if they are rescued by people from a different dimension and when they get back things are different? Jack's dad isn't dead, Kate isn't wanted for murder, etc? And they left people on the island. And the six that got back aren't supposed to be in that world? Great stuff.

I agree, tonight's episode was very good. Answered some stuff, raised more questions.

And I'm thinking it was Michael in the coffin. Not Ben.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
*SPOILERS*
.
.
.

quote:

---

I'm also questioning weather anyone else is still alive in the future, since they haven't really confirmed this yet.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by MEC:
Any theories on who the oceanic six are?

We know that it's at least Jake, Kate, and Hurley.
I suspect Micheal is one as well.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by stihl1:
And I'm thinking it was Michael in the coffin. Not Ben.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Strider:
edit - Lisa, can you put a spoiler warning in the title so we can talk freely?

---

Done.
 

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Posted by anti_maven (Member # 9789) on :
 
Oh Lord, I haven't seen any of this, and boy am I lost... (sorry about that).


Seriously though, thanks for the link to the "series 1-3 in 8 minutes and 15 seconds", it has really sparked my interest to see the lot from scratch.

That and Heroes, My Name is Earl, Eureka, Battlestar Galactica and a wealth of other series which I can't face to watch dubbed into spanish on terrestrial TV... See you in 2020
 

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Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
 
I want someone to make a BSG thing like that 8:15 Lost one.
 

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Posted by Uprooted (Member # 8353) on :
 
Did anyone watch the next show (Eli Stone) which was supposed to have a "commercial" from Oceanic Airlines? Was there anything of interest in that?
 

---

Posted by Puffy Treat (Member # 7210) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Uprooted:
Did anyone watch the next show (Eli Stone) which was supposed to have a "commercial" from Oceanic Airlines? Was there anything of interest in that?

---

quote:

---

I think it's pretty obvious there are people alive. Charlie seemed to imply it strongly. But last season's finale also hinted at it strongly. Why would Jack be a wreck and trying his hardest to get back to the island if everyone else was dead or off? Obviously some crazy stuff happens between now and them getting off the island, i'm sure some people die, and some people stay(and are probably in bad conditions) and Jack blames himself as well as has savior complex. So it makes sense that he wants to go back to make things right.

---

quote:

---

quote:

---

Any theories on who the oceanic six are?

We know that it's at least Jake, Kate, and Hurley.
I suspect Micheal is one as well.

---

Except that the Oceanic Six would be the ones the media covered. Michael isn't likely to have been one of those.

---

quote:

---

Did they ever explain the deal with the stewardess. How was she both on the plane and an Other?

---

quote:

---

Also...did I miss a scene where all the Charlie and not Penny's boat stuff was explained to Jack and Kate? It seemed like they showed up, Jack and Locke fought, and then Hurley gave his speech, with no exposition.

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quote:

---

Originally posted by MEC:
That's assuming that this "Charlie" isn't just a figment of hurley's mind or a manifestation of the island trying to get Hurley back to the island.

---

Another patient at the mental hospital saw Charlie--"That guy is staring at you."
Not exactly iron-clad proof of Charlie's existence outside of Hurley's mind, but let's not slip into solipsism so soon. My guess would be he's an echo or manifestation of Charlie mediated by the island's spooky powers, but not solely the island.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
Or maybe the dude who warned Hurley is ALSO all in Hurley's mind! Maybe the entire show is just a figment of Hurley's imagination!
 

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Posted by Puffy Treat (Member # 7210) on :
 
Didn't they already do that episode?
 

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Posted by Morbo (Member # 5309) on :
 
Dude, maybe we're ALL in Hurley's mind!
 

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Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
 
Actually, Buffy is imagining us watching Lost while she's in the asylum.
 

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Posted by Puffy Treat (Member # 7210) on :
 
Man, I hated that ending!

Almost as bad as that comic book series about a boy whose parents were gunned down before his eyes when he was 10, then forever afterwards hallucinated he was a costumed vigilante beating criminals up!
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
Maybe the people who rescued them were from a world in a different dimension, and the survivors are unhappy because they are out of synch with the world. Maybe the island is the wormhole, or more like a home base.
 

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Posted by stihl1 (Member # 1562) on :
 
I really don't like Jack. I'm rooting against him now.
 

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Posted by JonHecht (Member # 9712) on :
 
Spoiler!!!!!!!


I just saw a sneak preview of the season finale. Everyone dies.


Spoiler over!!!
 

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Posted by Puffy Treat (Member # 7210) on :
 
Did rocks fall on them?
 

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Posted by Tammy (Member # 4119) on :
 
Did anyone else think it was cute/funny when Hurley attempted to out run the cops?

That whole "Jacob's house-face in window" scared the crap out of me. I obviously don't watch to many scary movies. What's up with this jacob???
 

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Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
 
I think it was Locke's face in the window. Locke was hanging out in the cabin, talking to Jacob (or trying to if he still can't see him), and Hurley walked up and saw Jacob, Locke looked out the window, scared Hurley, then went to help him.

Apparently Hurley saw Jack's dad in Jacob's chair.

http://lostpedia.com/wiki/Jacob

[ February 02, 2008, 05:10 PM: Message edited by: MEC ]
 

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Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
 
Looking at the picture of the eye in the window that's on wikipedia I don't think it could be Locke's eye. The eye is clearly brown and I'm pretty sure Locke has blue/grey eyes.
 

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Posted by Rappin' Ronnie Reagan (Member # 5626) on :
 
To me, the eye looks like it could be blue, green, or brown. I think it's too dark to tell.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
I assumed it was Locke as well. But if it isn't, could it have been Jack? And the scene happened in some sort of time warp(i.e.- the scene inside the cabin happens in an episode later in the season).
 

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Posted by Fitz (Member # 4803) on :
 
Geez, no discussion on tonight's episode yet? I thought it was decent, even though introducing all the new characters took up a lot of time.

One thing I was wondering about was that I saw Harold Perrineau's name in the credits and I figured he would be in the episode. Then a little after the episode ended I remembered Ben's "man on their boat" comment and was wondering if that might be Michael.
 

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Posted by MightyCow (Member # 9253) on :
 
I enjoyed the episode, but it's another case of an episode bringing up a dozen new questions and only answering one or two. Kind of frustrating, but it keeps us on our toes.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
I thought the episode was fantastic. I thought having all the flashbacks grouped into one helped introduce us to the characters without having to stretch out 4 or 5 episodes.

And in true Lost fashion, as MightyCow said, every time they answer a question, they bring up 2 more.

more tomorrow. It's late.
 

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Posted by Puffy Treat (Member # 7210) on :
 
My guess is that Mister Abaddon is an agent for the real DHARMA Initiative...the group Ben helped the Others murder all those years ago.
 

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Posted by Uprooted (Member # 8353) on :
 
What was Locke's line about Walt? Something like, "yeah, it was him, but . . . bigger." With some funny line from Sawyer after that. LOL, I wonder if that is the only nod we're going to get to the fact that he's grown IRL when only a few weeks have gone by in the LOST world, or are they going to have some bizarre explanation for it?
 

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Posted by Mig (Member # 9284) on :
 
Entertainment Weekly has a great weekly recap and analysis of each week's episode. This weeks analysis draws some great parallels between the "rescuers" and CS Lewis's Narnia and Marvel's the Fantastic Four.

Example: The blonde woman rescuer's name: Charlotte Staples Lewis bares a striking simularity to Clive Staples Lewis (C.S. Lewis). And in Prince Caspian, "Pevensie kids return to Narnia via a mysterious island marked by ancient ruins and odd creatures. First thing they do: play in the water."

Check it out: http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20177008,00.html
 

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Posted by stihl1 (Member # 1562) on :
 
I caught the CS Lewis thing. I found it fascinating.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by stihl1:
I caught the CS Lewis thing. I found it fascinating.

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I don't.
If it's true, I find it lame as can be, using a movie which is about to be released as a reference.
 

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Posted by The Reader (Member # 3636) on :
 
I don't think it's lame. Using C.S. Lewis isn't out of step of what Lost usually does. Even if the timing is convenient, and I think it is, he is the type of person that Lost regularly references.

Having the backstories for all of the "rescuers" told in one episode was great. I suspect if not for the writers' strike, that would have happened over several episodes.

I think the "rescuers" were involved with DHARMA, before Ben ended it. But then who had the power to put the dummy plane in the ocean?
 

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Posted by Leonide (Member # 4157) on :
 
Considering that most of the primary character have "great philosopher" last names, Lewis isn't too strange

I would swear up and down that I saw Fisher Stevens' name in the credits. But he wasn't any of the "rescuers." Is he slated to make a guest appearance? I just love him!

You know something's going to happen where this little foursome gets torn assunder -- one or two die, and the rest are fractured between wanting to complete their "ben-retrieval" mission, and wanting to exclusively help the Losties.

that Charlotte chick looks cold -- i don't trust her. Daniel is a "head case," hmm? Maybe someone Hurley knows? I'm really interested in the off-the-island supernatural elements in this episode -- polar bear is the desert, Miles' paranormal abilities...too cool!

Even if Ben was privy to all that information because of working for creepy bug-eyed suit-guy, how the heck does he recall that stuff at will? Did I miss the episode where Ben's a super-genius?

[ February 09, 2008, 01:28 AM: Message edited by: Leonide ]
 

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Posted by Elmer's Glue (Member # 9313) on :
 
Ben recalling all that information doesn't seem any harder than the pilot immediately knowing Juliette wasn't from the plane.

I don't trust Charlotte at all, but I like Miles and Daniel.
 

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Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
 
Anyone else think that miles and the narrator of the dharma films are related?
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by MEC:
Anyone else think that miles and the narrator of the dharma films are related?

---

quote:

---

Ben recalling all that information doesn't seem any harder than the pilot immediately knowing Juliette wasn't from the plane.

---

fer shizzle? He doesn't just recognize her, he knows her entire life history, in detail. He has the same sort of info, that he can readily recall at will, on every one of the primary Losties. Regardless of whether or not he Would have that info, to be able to just rattle it off like that? Does he just sit in his bungalow and memorize facts?

[ February 09, 2008, 02:12 PM: Message edited by: Leonide ]
 

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Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
 
What's your Shambahala theory?

Isn't Shambahala a Utopian city in the mountains?
 

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Posted by akhockey (Member # 8394) on :
 
Leo, I think it's pretty reasonable to see that. Ben is a manipulator at heart, and the only way to be a good manipulator is to have as much information as possible. Anybody who can be in "control" of a situation while tied up, beaten senseless, and under threat of death is pretty good at what they do. It's his job to know everything about everyone at the island. It's not all that different when you think about it from...say....someone who knows the life and history of an entire sports team, or comic series.

But yeah, Ben certainly does need to find more positive things to do with his time than memorize the backstories of fifty-odd people in an attempt to rule Fantasy Island.
 

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Posted by Leonide (Member # 4157) on :
 
Maybe the significance of him knowing that information is greater than just manipulation-power.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
"I wasn't commenting on Charlotte's physical appearance."

I didn't say you were commenting on it, I said it might have an effect on how people perceive her. And I meant to generalize. I think they chose someone who appears "cold." That's all I meant. Sorry.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by MEC:
What's your Shambahala theory?

Isn't Shambahala a Utopian city in the mountains?

---

quote:

---

You know something's going to happen where this little foursome gets torn assunder -- one or two die, and the rest are fractured between wanting to complete their "ben-retrieval" mission, and wanting to exclusively help the Losties.

---

This is somehow going to lead the Oceanic Six. One of those four will be forced, by being threated with death at the hand of Jack or Kate, to rescue some of the castaways with the helicopter. They will leave the other three and the rest of the castaways behind.

Could the person in the casket be one of the rescuers? Jack said it was neither a friend or family. If it is one of them, Jack would still feel compelled to visit because of the circumstances involved.
 

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Posted by Tammy (Member # 4119) on :
 
When I was thinking about Atlantis, the only thing I could think of was that statue of the foot with four toes. I don't know why I associated it with Atlantis. I was glad they'd showed it in the flashbacks, I was beginning to think I'd imagined it.

I don't recall any mention of anything that could relate to Atlantis.

I just love the idea of any of those "lost" worlds.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
I do, too.

Unfortunately, because I am the parent of a boy, when I think of Atlantis now, I think of Atlantis Spongepantis.
 

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Posted by Uprooted (Member # 8353) on :
 
One advantage to having no children is that my mind remains mostly unsullied by Sponge Bob imagery.
 

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Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
 
Sponge Bob is banned in my home. As are Junie B. Jones and Captain Underpants.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
Too bad. Spongebob makes me laugh harder than any sitcom, not that that's saying much.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 

quote:

---

I'm not sure about all this alternative dimension talk, but time is obviously a very important aspect of the show. The torture room has that backwards dialog that repeats "only fools are enslaved by time and space". The man guarding room 23 was reading A Brief History of Time. Walt spoke backwards to Shannon. There may be another backwards dialog part but i'm not remembering now. Richard hasn't seemed to age at all in like 30 years. And Desmond is now able to see outside of time. This is all off the top of my head, I'm sure there's more too.

---

One more thing I thought of to add to my list of time related anomlies in the show.

Mittelos(as in Mittelos Bioscience) is an anagram for "lost time".
 

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Posted by Tammy (Member # 4119) on :
 
My daughter's been singing the "pizza song" since she got off the bus today.

"Krusty Kraaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaab Pizza, is
the pizza, yea for you and meeeeeeeeeeeeeee!"


*help me*
 

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Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
 
Did anyone else notice that the grandson on the picture in the woman's home where Miles goes in the flashback is Eko (or is at least the spitting image of Eko as a young boy).

They made a point of focusing on the picture twice so I doubt its a coincidence.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
Rabbit, I knew I was supposed to notice something about the picture. Now I want to go back.

Also, is Miles the same character who is on the show about the couple with 8 kids, or do they just look similar?
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
Nope, coincidence.
However, "Miles" played the grumpy guy who was in the psych ward with Junior Soprano.
 

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Posted by sweetbaboo (Member # 8845) on :
 
I didn't think that the eye/face in the window was Locke because it looked like it had hair.

I didn't get the whole Penny finding the polar bear skeleton in the desert thing. Is that part of the other dimension theory?
 

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Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
 
I thought Charlotte found the polar bear in the desert...
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
MEC has got it right.

Rabbit I noticed that about the picture and then promptly forgot about it right after. Good call. So what does it all mean?
 

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Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
 
Time travel.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
See, here's my problem with time travel theories or theories about the island existing outside of time or in an alternate dimension. If this is true than why is everyone that's on the island from the present day? Why aren't there people from colonial times and from ancient times? There would conceivably be people from all sorts of time periods co-existing in this island outside of time.
 

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Posted by Tammy (Member # 4119) on :
 
What do you think is going on with the hobbit? The guy in the scene where Hurley's chilling outside, mentioned to him that someone was staring at him...so this guy saw Charlie? He's there, and then he's not.
 

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Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Lisa:
Sponge Bob is banned in my home. As are Junie B. Jones and Captain Underpants.

---

quote:

---

I thought Charlotte found the polar bear in the desert...

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sweetbaboo:
For some reason, this bothered me more than the fact that Hurley's fellow psych patient saw Charlie.

---

What makes you think that anyone saw Charlie other than Hurley? What makes you think that the "fellow psych patient" wasn't imaginary as well?

I think the whole TimeLoop theory is too complicated and illogical to be the real solution to what's happening on Lost, but I won't be surprised if some of it turns out to be right.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
OK, this is a teacher analogy, but bear with me.
I think that the writers are making this up as they go, trying to match things from the past episodes, but it is all ne, like a teacher who is teaching a new curriculum that year.

They look for cool things, and use them, but sometimes, the lessons don;t fit.

I think that if the writers themselves could go back in time, they would have had all the theories in place, and been able to build on them.
 

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Posted by The Reader (Member # 3636) on :
 
Charlie really slapped Hurley. If Charlie was a figment of Hurley's imagination, then Hurley would have felt it anyway. If Charlie was really there, then the other psych patient would have seen Charlie as well, and probably would not have recognized him from Drive Shaft, being a psychiatric patient and all. Others in the vicinity (and there appeared to be few people) probably would not recognize him either for the same reason. How Charlie got there?

I propose that Aaron may be the fourth of the Oceanic Six to be revealed. Claire may be forced to make a choice: does she keep Aaron to take care of him, as maternal instinct would require, or does she send him with the other five? If he has "special abilities" as some propose, but I don't believe, then Claire would have good reason to send him off the island away from the danger, as she sees it anyway.

I am aware that Claire was warned that she should be the only person taking care of him, but she received that information from a fake psychic. Aaron seemed to bond well others, especially Charlie, but he's dead now. Kind of.

Of course, who takes care of Aaron when he gets to civilization? Kate, possibly. It's remote, I know. She doesn't seem to be very good mother material, but it may be the simplest explanation (in Lost terms, because nothing is simple on Lost ) for the person she was talking about in "Through the Looking Glass" when she said "He'll be wondering where I am."

And after looking through Lostpedia to make sure I have the quote right, I see that this is a already a theory.
 

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Posted by Elmer's Glue (Member # 9313) on :
 
The psych patient is crazy. He could have seen George Washington staring at Hurley. He tells Hurley a guy is staring at him, and suddenly crazy Hurley thinks Charlie is there.
 

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Posted by Reshpeckobiggle (Member # 8947) on :
 
What? Sayid!
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
Could "The Economist" be Penny's dad?
 

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Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
 
I could watch a show about Sayid off the island. Just Sayid. Damn, but he's amazing.
 

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Posted by Uprooted (Member # 8353) on :
 
I know what you mean, Lisa. In a lot of ways one of the most fascinating characters on the show. And did I mention beautiful?
 

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Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
 
And they also revealed Ben, to which one wonders if Ben still goes to and fro the island.
 

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Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
 
Ahhh Sayid, Why don't we have any drooling emoticons.


 

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Posted by JoeH (Member # 5958) on :
 
Can't say I am as infatuated with Sayid as some of you, but damn that reveal was CRAZY.
 

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Posted by The Pixiest (Member # 1863) on :
 
My hubby pegged the reveal just before.

Ben is the root of everyone's problems. If he hadn't been around from the start it would have been "Hey, plane crash huh? We have a sub. Let's get you all back home. [THE END]"
 

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Posted by kojabu (Member # 8042) on :
 
I'm curious as to what incident Ben referred to when he mentioned what happened the last time Sayid followed his heart and not his gun.
 

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Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
 

quote:

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Ben is the root of everyone's problems. If he hadn't been around from the start it would have been "Hey, plane crash huh? We have a sub. Let's get you all back home. [THE END]"

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quote:

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My hubby pegged the reveal just before.

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The Ben reveal or the Sayid reveal?

I thought the Ben reveal would be the most obvious conclusion without introducing any new characters/questions.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
I was disappointed with the Ben "reveal."

So, who do you think "the economist" is? I think Penny's dad, as I said above. Or rather, as I asked above.
 

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Posted by Launchywiggin (Member # 9116) on :
 
Sweet episode. The biggest reveal is the time discrepancy in the arrival of the rocket! This is the first hint that time doesn't flow the same on the island--but that communications can still occur between the two time periods. WEIRD.

If time moves slower on the island, than maybe we'll be seeing a grown Walt back in the show?
 

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Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
 
I calculated a discrepancy of 31 minutes 20 seconds.

I wonder when the discrepancy started -- when the rocket was launched or when the helicopter entered the island.
 

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Posted by Tresopax (Member # 1063) on :
 
I speculate that the time discrepancy is linked in some way to the Hatch and the pressing of the button - a mystery that hasn't been mentioned in a while.
 

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Posted by Morbo (Member # 5309) on :
 
This was the best episode in a while.
There was Hurley's betrayal: Dude, what happened? You used to be cool.

The Sayid/Ben reveal. Never trust a torturer.

And the jet-lagged rocket. That was spookier than Jacob, to me. How could communications be in real-time while trajectories (or their relative POVs) get a 1/2 hour delay?? Very weird.
 

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Posted by Morbo (Member # 5309) on :
 
Hmmm, according to Lostpedia, the scene with Sayid and Ben (and ancillary scenes) is a flash-forward, after rescue, not a flash-back. Not sure what they base that on.

edit: Sayid says he's one of the Oceanic 6. I missed that part.
2nd edit: I missed the 1st 15 minutes. Now I have to bittorrent it to keep up.

[ February 16, 2008, 08:50 PM: Message edited by: Morbo ]
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
I think even if he hadn't said he was one of the Oceanic 6, it should've been obvious. It really wouldn't have made sense as a flashback with Sayid's history. He also talks about not working because he's living off a large settlement. Him and the woman also talk about the crash towards the end of the episode.

The jet lagged rocket was awesome.
 

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Posted by The Reader (Member # 3636) on :
 
I could watch a show starring just Sayid too. He is one of the best characters. Naveen Andrews really does a great job of playing the tragic man.
 

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Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Morbo:
And the jet-lagged rocket. That was spookier than Jacob, to me. How could communications be in real-time while trajectories (or their relative POVs) get a 1/2 hour delay?? Very weird.

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That's why they have to adjust the phones just right. They talk through time. The TimeLoop thing is getting a little more feasible, though I still think it's a bit whacked out.

Incidentally, they were originally going to have it be off by 31 seconds, rather than 31 minutes.
 

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Posted by The Reader (Member # 3636) on :
 
I don't like time travel. There are way too many physical requirements for it to be used. Magic beans are great when it comes to having intelligent black clouds and exceptional electromagnetic strength because there can still be reasonable explanations for either one within the context of the story. If the island ends up being in a vile vortex I will be disappointed because that's a cop out. Where's the imagination in that old chestnut?

I doubt the show would sink that low because even in it's worst times, Lost has had some wierd things that were still original.

After my prediction about which of the Oceanic Six would be revealed next blew up in my face, I am reluctant to even speculate. But I can still complain.
 

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Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
 
I say the other two members of the Oceanic 6 are Sun and Jin.
 

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Posted by kojabu (Member # 8042) on :
 
I was thinking maybe Claire and Sawyer. Sawyer simply because he doesn't want to leave and perhaps was somehow forced to.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
Also, I want a Sawyer show. He is my favorite. Well, he and Desmond are my favorites.
 

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Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
 
I'm guessing that the other 2 of the 6 and Sawyer and Locke.

I think Locke was the guy in the coffin.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
I don't. I think they would have been sadder if it was Locke.
And I wonder if whoever it was was really even dead. Can;t trust anything anymore on that blasted show, even a death.
 

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Posted by Tammy (Member # 4119) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by The Rabbit:
Ahhh Sayid, Why don't we have any drooling emoticons.

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quote:

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I can tell you who the featured characters are in the next five episodes. If you're willing to be spoiled on that point, look here, at the end of the recap.

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quote:

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Originally posted by The Rabbit:

quote:

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I can tell you who the featured characters are in the next five episodes. If you're willing to be spoiled on that point, look here, at the end of the recap.

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Given the history of this show, there is no reason to believe that they will reveal the identity of the other 2 (or three) of the Oceanic 6 in the next 5 episodes or even this season. In fact, it seems more likely that they won't reveal anything else of significance for the rest of season.

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quote:

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Daniel (the twitchy fellow we met at the end of last episode)

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quote:

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Originally posted by Puppy:
Without looking at Lisa's spoilers, here are a few of my thoughts ...

1. The fact that Kate isn't in jail in the last season finale might indicate that she is NOT one of the Oceanic Six. The Oceanic Six are famous. Hard to imagine her beating a murder rap if she is known to have survived.

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I can think of at least 2 ways that Kate may have beaten the murder rap.

1) She exchanges identities with someone who died in the crash or on the island. This could even be part of what Jack doesn't want Hurly to "tell".

or the more straight forward route.

2) The key witness in the case (Kate's mother) and the FBI agent who headed up the hunt for her are both dead. Without a witness they may simply not have enough evidence to build a case against her. With the key investigator also gone its entirely possible that they might just drop the case.
 

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Posted by The Reader (Member # 3636) on :
 
Or she was rescued using a stolen identity, only to have her real identity discovered later. This might be part of the subject of the next episode. The teaser hints at something like that. But teasers aren't reliable.
 

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Posted by Uprooted (Member # 8353) on :
 
Didn't see that one coming.
 

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Posted by Puffy Treat (Member # 7210) on :
 
So what happened to...oh, man. And she's one of my favorite characters.
 

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Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
 
I saw that coming as soon as her "son" was mentioned.

Did it seem like Aaron is aging faster to anyone else?
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
same here MEC, and i was positive during the scene with Claire and Kate and Aaron.

i enjoyed tonight's episode, but not a lot happened at all. we spent an hour and all we got was the Aaron thing, a semi-cool conversation between Ben and the Asian dude, and a bit more about the story that they tell the rest of the world. I was hoping for a bit more. The preview for next week looks pretty awesome.

Also, in regards to the story, I'm wondering why it involves 8 people originally surviving but two of them dying. How purposeful is that? In that is that the story to explain away two extra bodies?

And why was Kate designated the hero? Was it in preparation for what would be her coming back to face a murder rap and trying to use that to make her a hero, or is there another reason?
 

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Posted by MightyCow (Member # 9253) on :
 
Strider: I had the same thought about the story of 8 survivors. It makes me think we'll see two dead people pretty soon.
 

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Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by MEC:
I saw that coming as soon as her "son" was mentioned.

Did it seem like Aaron is aging faster to anyone else?

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quote:

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Plus, my friend Matt just reminded me that when Sayid and Desmond left the island, it was October...but when they landed on the boat, it was Christmas eve. Crazy.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Elizabeth:
"Desmond's travels are starting to remind me of The Time Traveler's Wife."

I have thought that for a while. In fact, I think they stole it from TTTW.

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The mention in the episode to being "unstuck in time" along with the basic concept of visiting different time periods within one's own life is a blatant reference to Kurt Vonnegut's well-known novel Slaughterhouse-Five, originally published in 1969.

Just sayin'.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
So, what I hear you saying is that TTTW stole from Kurt?
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
well, I think the fact he's not only jumping around in time but also jumping around to various points in his relationship to penelope and affecting the course of his relationship with her through those jumps, is what's reminding me specifically of TTTW.

though it's obvious that there are Slaughterhouse references in there as well(when he gets kidnapped by aliens we'll know for sure).

There's room for both references! Lost is expansive.
 

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Posted by Puffy Treat (Member # 7210) on :
 
I'm saying that the Lost episode was making an obvious reference to Vonnegut's novel.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
So here's a fun little theory I've been thinking about, not specifically related to any of the current episodes, but lent credence by the information revealed recently.

Remember the two skeletons Jack found in the cave during season 1? Well, here's some stuff that the producers have said about that:

*Warning, mild spoilers about the importance of the skeletons

quote:

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In an EW.com article, Damon Lindelof and Carlton Cuse answered the fan question, "What is the meaning or significance of the two skeletons that Jack and Kate found in the cave of season 1?"
CUSE: The answer to that question goes to the nature of the timeline of the Island. We don't want to say too much about it, but there are a couple Easter eggs embedded in "Not in Portland", one of which is an anagram that actually sheds some light on the skeletons and hints at a larger mythological mystery that will start to unfold later in the season.
LINDELOF: There were certain things we knew from the very beginning. Independent of ever knowing when the end was going to be, we knew what it was going to be, and we wanted to start setting it up as early as season 1, or else people would think that we were making it up as we were going along. So the skeletons are the living—or, I guess, slowly decomposing—proof of that. When all is said and done, people are going to point to the skeletons and say, "That is proof that from the very beginning, they always knew that they were going to do this."

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quote:

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Originally posted by Fitz:
Has anyone else mentioned the "friend on board" comment which was made in relation to someone opening the door to the sickbay, thus allowing Desmond, Sayid and the communications officer to escape? I think this reinforces my guess made a couple weeks back that Michael is on board the boat, and is also Ben's contact.

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I kind of assumed that the door was either opened by Frank or Ben's man on the boat. But why would Ben's man on the boat be helping the Losties escape and even worse, make a phone call to someone who is trying to find the island. I guess it could make a little more sense if Michael was Ben's man on the boat, but why the heck would Michael be helping Ben out. Seemed their relationship ended when Michael did what Ben asked, and Ben let him and Walt go.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
Some stuff about this last episode and a throw away theory about the nature of flashbacks and the character connections.

Okay, so up until last night I had sort of been thinking about this past episode in the old standard events happening on the island with a flashback formula. And that the storm had caused Desmond to forget everything that's happened to him and travel back to his past. Hence my question earlier in this thread about what 1996 Desmond experienced. But talking with a friend last night he made the point that he thought it was interesting that this episode broke the flashback formula by sending Desmond's 1996 consciousness into the future and that it wasn't really a flashback OR a flashforward. And I realized he was right. I was looking at it all the wrong way because my head was stuck in the flashback formula. What happened was that 1996 Desmond's consciousness became unstuck in time and traveled to the future. Which is why Desmond doesn't know where he is or who anyone is. The consciousness that is in 2004 never experienced the last 8 years.

So given that, I have some questions. One of the reasons that i looked at it the other way around is because the event that causes it happens in desmond's future. For instance, with the experiment on the rat, Faraday exposes her to the radiation, sends her consciousness into the future, and then it comes back. But desmond gets exposed in 2004, and yet this somehow causes his 1996 consciousness to travel to the future. that doesn't make sense to me.

Also, if this is a Time Traveler's Wife type timeline and everything happens just once, it's all fate and there's no changing it, then the Desmond we're familiar with would have always known about going to the island right? His 1996 self experienced traveling to the future, learning he had been living on an island, and getting Penny's number so later when he's on that island he can call her. But the Desmond we know doesn't know all that. So what's going on? Can the timeline be changed? Is Faraday wrong? And yet, one of the reasons I assume Penny looked for Desmond so hard is because she *knows* that he's there and he's alive. So she always knew right? That event with Desmond getting her number *always* happened...

So all this thought about Desmond and time travel and flashbacks made me think about the nature of flashbacks on the show. We'd had conversations about this before, I think in last years thread when discussing the nomenclature of calling the season finale a "flashforward" or saying that future off island events were really "the present" and the island scenes was the "flashback"(in the end I had said it doesn't make any difference, it's all just events in time, and that our timeline had just widened). But I think a relatively important distinction to make when talking about the flashbacks is whether you think that flashbacks are just the shows' way of giving us backstory about these characters when it's appropriate to understanding their characters better, etc...or whether that characters is actually remembering those events in their lives during those episodes. I've gone back and forth about that myself.

Desmond's experiences would tend to bolster the latter interpretation. And the interaction of the black smoke/island with the characters would as well; jack seeing his dad, kate seeing the horse, hurley seeing his imaginary friend, Echo seeing his brother, etc...

So here's the thought that came to me. What if the reason all the characters have these really unlikely connections in their past, is because the Island has actually created all these connections. Which is not to say the past events didn't happen, but in a weird twist on cause and effect and the nature of time and whether it can be changed, these people all crash here and the island created these intertwining pasts for whatever reason.

I don't know that i buy that at all, but I thought it was worth sharing. It would certainly go a long way towards explaining what is a series of infinitely unlikely events and connections.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
Well, in the Time Traveler's Wife, he can change the future somewhat, or at least use the past, because they play the stock market with info he knows from his various travels.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
but that's not *changing* the future. it's just using information from the future.

to change the future the events would have to transpire like this:

at point A he doesn't know about which stocks will rise. at point B he still doesn't know and doesn't invest. at point C in which he is not rich he finds out which stocks do well. travels back to before point B and informs himself of which stocks to invest in. invests in those at point B and by point C is now rich. this is like the back to the future theory of time travel in which there are now two different time lines.

the way the time traveler's wife explains it is the events ALWAYS transpired like this:

at point A doesn't know which stocks to invest in. before point B is told by his future self which stocks to invest in. invests in them at point B. at point C is rich and goes back to tell himself which stocks to invest in(this isn't how it happens in the book, just using it as an easy example).

the whole point of the time traveler's wife is that events in time can NEVER be changed. they happen once, in one way and that is all. the same way they do in your life. the addition of time travel does not change the nature of cause and effect or the timeline in any way. Kind of like when a future version of his teenage self tells an earlier version to ask out a girl that he's terrified of talking to. and says "trust me". well, he would never have asked her out in the first place if he had never told himself to. but he only tells himself to, because he told himself to, and it ends up working.

now again...this is just one theory of how time travel works, and isn't necessarily how Lost is doing it, though Faraday's comments would lead me to believe that HE at least believes that time works that way, whether he's right or not in the mythology of Lost is still up for debate.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
This is why I said "or at least uses the past."\

But really, it does affect the future, doesn't it, because if he did not know about the stocks in the past, he would not have acted on the knowledge in the present, and his future finances would be dim?

Asking, not being argumentative, because the whole thing makes me head spin.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
it comes down to the difference between "affect" and "change". it obviously affects the future(maybe even effects the future! ), but that doesn't mean the same thing as change the future. it's a question of free will/fate/determinism.

lets say you looked at your life, from birth to death, on a timeline that went from A to Z, after the fact. the sum of your life is contained within that time line. Something you do at point B affects the outcome of your life at point F, but not visa versa because of the direction time flows. you can't change the past. once something is done, it's done. now, assume you can time travel and tell yourself things at different points in your life. You're life still goes on a timeline from A to Z, but now things you do at B can affect yourself at F and things you do at M can affect yourself at C and so on. BUT that doesn't mean you can *change* something that's already happened. if your whole life, including time travel is laid out on this timeline, then it contains everything that happened. all the jumping around in time, all the advice from a future self to do or not do anything. and given that timeline as one complete entity, there's nothing you can do to change anything. it all happened that way.

you can't do something, then go back and warn yourself not to do it, because then you never would've done it and wouldn't have to go back to warn yourself not to do it. that would create alternate realities or timelines or whatever, and the theory espoused in TTTW was that those don't exist, things happen only once and only in one way.

does that make any more sense? I may not be explaining it very well.

edit-the point of using the timeline analogy was because if all the events that happened, happened on one time line, there's no room for change. changing things necessitates multiple timelines where different events occurred in different ways in different timelines. the theory in TTTW wife was that only one timeline exists and could ever exist. that the universe doesn't allow "changing things".

Lost has skirted around these issues from the beginning. Fate/destiny vs. free will. course correcting. we're not "supposed" to leave this island. you're not "supposed" to make that call. we weren't "supposed" to leave, we have to go back.

[ March 02, 2008, 07:44 PM: Message edited by: Strider ]
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
Thanks, that makes sense.
That is how it is in Outlander, too. Claire is worried about one person dying, and then someone else not existing in the future. What they realize is that the thing they thought happened is not really how it happened, and that nothing changed except their perception of the event. (vagueness so as not to give spoilers)
 

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Posted by The Reader (Member # 3636) on :
 

quote:

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But desmond gets exposed in 2004, and yet this somehow causes his 1996 consciousness to travel to the future. that doesn't make sense to me.

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quote:

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What if the reason all the characters have these really unlikely connections in their past, is because the Island has actually created all these connections. Which is not to say the past events didn't happen, but in a weird twist on cause and effect and the nature of time and whether it can be changed, these people all crash here and the island created these intertwining pasts for whatever reason.

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quote:

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Originally posted by The Reader:

quote:

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But desmond gets exposed in 2004, and yet this somehow causes his 1996 consciousness to travel to the future. that doesn't make sense to me.

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Are you assuming that time flows in one direction? I think that because 1996 already happened, then it would be easier for Desmond to go backward to that time.

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quote:

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I like the time theories you have, but I think that this has more to do with Mittelos/Hanso/DHARMA meddling.

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quote:

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When Sayid and Desmond were on the boat, there was a calender that showed that it was Christmas Eve 2004, and Desmond's call to Penny confirms that this isn't just a ploy. I have a question about this: How is it that the time on the island can be so screwy, and yet the same date is still maintained?

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quote:

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My speculation is that in one of the coming few episodes Daniel will explain to us what "pushing the button" was all about, and that it will have something to do with keeping the island's time in sync with the outside world.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Strider:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by The Reader:
[qb] Because the call was made on the boat, outside of the range of the island's influence(which is two days behind the time on the boat).

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quote:

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Originally posted by Strider:

Rabbit, are you sure about this 6 day difference?

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quote:

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I assumed it was Locke as well. But if it isn't, could it have been Jack? And the scene happened in some sort of time warp(i.e.- the scene inside the cabin happens in an episode later in the season).

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quote:

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But having side effects when leaving doesn't necessitate not being able to leave. Desmond fixes himself through the use of a constant. Anyone else having side effects upon leaving would also be able to use a constant to right themselves I'd think.

Also, I would argue that the only people exposed to the EM radiation were Desmond, Charlie, Echo and Locke. Half of which are dead now.

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quote:

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Originally posted by The Rabbit:
Here's another odd thought. Daniel indicates that prior exposure to EM radiation was the cause of Desmond's "side effect when leaving the island.

So far all the Losties (except Aaron) who've made it off the Island weren't near the hatch when it blew. Jack, Kate and Hurley were prisoners of Ben et al. Sayid was on the sail boat. The others who weren't present near the hatch include Sawyer, Jin, Sun, Michael and Walt.

At this point it seems that ones location during the massive EM explosion may be the determining factor for who is able to leave the island. Aaron could be an exception because his age or the fact that he was born on the island.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Strider:
Why does Whidmore give Desmond Penny's address?

And why does he leave the water running?

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quote:

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I think, "Because he's a D.B." answers both those questions.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Strider:
And who is the woman that Juliet looks just like?

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quote:

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so what's the significance of the therapist showing up admit the whispers, and then disappearing along with them as well?

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quote:

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Ben was awesome in this last episode. "see you guys at dinner!"

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quote:

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Originally posted by docmagik:
She's married.

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If she was married, she probably would have had a wedding ring on. I looked, and they very clearly showed that she had one ring, on her right hand, and none on her left.

She isn't married.
 

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Posted by Leonide (Member # 4157) on :
 
i'm glad i haven't got so wrapped up in the mysteries of Lost that I can't appreciate how dark and tragic the whole Juliette/Goodwin/Ben thing was. And not one person on this thread was even like "whoa, surprise, they were in lurve!" i keep thinking i must've missed some mention of their affair earlier in the show...
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
I think that's because I was sort of indifferent to it. Really, the whole flashback in general didn't do anything for me. I didn't care that she had an affair with Goodwin. Or that his wife was her therapist. Or that Ben was jealous. It *was* interesting to see new light shed on those events though. The most interesting of which was Ben's sending Goodwin out to die("What's Ben gonna do?" immediately followed by the plane crash. what a fantastic juxtaposition). His little speech to her at the end was so evil too.

"after everything i've done to get you here. after everything i've done to keep you here. How can you possibly not understand....that YOUR MINE."

F'ing chilling.
 

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Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
 
Check this out someone on LJ did an analysis of Faraday's blackboard.

Some crazy Physics mumbo jumbo
 

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Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Leonide:
i'm glad i haven't got so wrapped up in the mysteries of Lost that I can't appreciate how dark and tragic the whole Juliette/Goodwin/Ben thing was. And not one person on this thread was even like "whoa, surprise, they were in lurve!" i keep thinking i must've missed some mention of their affair earlier in the show...

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quote:

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Originally posted by Strider:
Yeah, I'd assume Jack's episode is the furthest along in the time line. All the others seem up in the air to me, though I'm sure the information is embedded in the episodes somewhere.

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quote:

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You did. We knew that Goodwin and Juliette were lovers

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quote:

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Originally posted by The Reader:
Sun had an affair with her english teacher. Her baby may not even be Jin's.

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quote:

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Originally posted by The Rabbit:
Well we do know that she told Sun and Ben the same date, so if she is lying it would have to be for some completely obscure reason.

Beside that, they've now been on the Island for over 100 days. If Sun had been pregnant before she left Korea, she'd be showing by now.

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I don't trust a single thing Juliette does. I do wonder if her name has significance. I hope it is because she will have the same fate as her namesake in Shakespeare. (sorry, I really don;t like her character. If she were a real person, I promise I would not want her to die a miserable, Lost-style death)

Would the time anomaly business affect the timing of her pregnancy?
 

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Posted by The Reader (Member # 3636) on :
 
I don't trust Juliette either. I think I mentioned in the Season 3 thread that she is only out for herself. All she wants is to leave the island. What she has done is align herself with the most powerful group, and that is currently the castaways. There is a big betrayal coming from her in the future.

I thought Sun was beginning to show. Wasn't that mentioned by someone in the show?
 

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Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
 
Lost is breaking my heart!

And glad to see Michael back even if it wasn't a surprise.

I'm excited for next week. Someone is going to die and I'm just hoping it'll be Juliet!!
 

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Posted by kanelock (Member # 10982) on :
 
Wouldn't it be funny if they brought Michael back just to kill him off!?
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
Shanna, my sistah!
Go Juliet! and by that we mean, "Juliet, go. Forever."

I don't get the Jin thing. The panda clip happened before the birth?

Is the captain a good guy or a bad guy?

Is Ben good or bad?

I am more confused than ever, except for these facts:

Sawyer is hot.
Desmond is hot. (3/4 of hotness=accent)
Jack is a whiner.
Juliet must die.
All Losties must wash their hair.
 

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Posted by theCrowsWife (Member # 8302) on :
 
I think the panda stuff was supposed to be a flashback, not a flash-forward. They were just trying to throw us off (although I suspected from the very beginning that he wasn't going to visit Sun.) My husband swears that he saw Jin in the delivery room, but I didn't think it was him.

--Mel
 

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Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
 
I lost a lot of respect for Juliet when she ratted out Sun to Jin. Even if she was trying to help, there's no logical reason to think doing that would help get Sun off the island, she's just being a b****.
 

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Posted by msquared (Member # 4484) on :
 
I don't know if that was a flash back. So far they have been fairly consistent in not mixing flash fowards with flash backs in the same episode.

I thought that maybe Jin made it off but listed as officially dead and Sun does not know.

Juliet ratted Sun out because she really does not want Sun to go to Locke's and stay on the island. She knew that Jin would not go and that Sun would stay. It was a dirty trick but effective.

msquared
 

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Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
 
I think it was a flashback.

Either that or the show is playing silly games again. Like, Sun only thinks Jin is dead but he made it off the island but with amnesia and he remarried or he suffers from some variation of that time-displacment-thingy.

But that's just crazy. Though, this is Lost we're talking about.

I lean towards flashback because the phone he was using looked alittle out of place. And what year is the show set it in? Is it the year of the Dragon?
 

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Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
 
May or may not be important but according to screencaps, the death date listed on the tombstone is the day of the plane crash.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
It was definitely a flashback. And not to brag(actually...just to brag) i called it from the very beginning of the episode when we first saw Jin. It just seemed like the kind of thing Lost would do. Then the rest of the flashes just confirmed it. When he actually goes in to buy the panda but isn't excited about his baby being born. When Sun is in the hospital she reacts really negatively to having the wedding ring removed and only mentions his name after she's been drugged. He doesn't seem like he's talking to Sun on the phone in his phone calls given his tone of voice, but then who would he be talking to? Who knows she's in labor? Then obviously the reveal at the end, that he's only been married two months, and his being dead in the future. Still, knowing it didn't lessen the impact, i kept hoping that he wouldn't be dead but would still be on the Island, as soon as Hurley said we should go see him my heart dropped.

This fits perfectly with the story Jack tells at the trial. He says 8 survived but 2 couldn't be saved. We had posited that the reason to add this seemingly unnecessary detail was because there were 2 bodies to explain when the 6 make it back to civilization. Well, we now know Jin is one of those bodies. Which at least means he won't die next week.
 

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Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
 
I hated last night's episode.

I mean, HATE.

Thus sayeth the Lord...
 

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Posted by Uprooted (Member # 8353) on :
 
The Jin flashback was just a cheap gimmick to throw us off track. (ETA: or, what Scott just said much more eloquently in his link above. I'm such a slow poster!)

Juliet's comment to Sun afterwards, that she had to do what she did to help Sun get off the island, really rankled. "You are my patient." What, so that makes you God? Puh-leeze. I'm starting to join the "death to Juliet" ranks. There are a couple of expressions on her face that make me want to slap her. I'm afraid I might never be able to watch that actress in another role!
 

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Posted by Xaposert (Member # 1612) on :
 
Note: Just because Michael was on the boat, doesn't mean Michael is Ben's man on the boat. We are supposed to assume it is, but it could be a trick...

Where is Walt?
 

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Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
 
I really like Juliet. I don't think the writers did a good job with her last night, though.
 

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Posted by SenojRetep (Member # 8614) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Scott R:
I hated last night's episode.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Xaposert:
Note: Just because Michael was on the boat, doesn't mean Michael is Ben's man on the boat. We are supposed to assume it is, but it could be a trick...

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quote:

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There's a clip on Kristin's page from next week that has Ben saying, straight out, who his spy on the boat is.

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quote:

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Originally posted by The Reader:
If the island ends up being in a vile vortex I will be disappointed because that's a cop out. Where's the imagination in that old chestnut?

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Strider:
It was definitely a flashback. And not to brag(actually...just to brag) i called it from the very beginning of the episode when we first saw Jin. It just seemed like the kind of thing Lost would do. Then the rest of the flashes just confirmed it. When he actually goes in to buy the panda but isn't excited about his baby being born. When Sun is in the hospital she reacts really negatively to having the wedding ring removed and only mentions his name after she's been drugged. He doesn't seem like he's talking to Sun on the phone in his phone calls given his tone of voice, but then who would he be talking to? Who knows she's in labor? Then obviously the reveal at the end, that he's only been married two months, and his being dead in the future. Still, knowing it didn't lessen the impact, i kept hoping that he wouldn't be dead but would still be on the Island, as soon as Hurley said we should go see him my heart dropped.

This fits perfectly with the story Jack tells at the trial. He says 8 survived but 2 couldn't be saved. We had posited that the reason to add this seemingly unnecessary detail was because there were 2 bodies to explain when the 6 make it back to civilization. Well, we now know Jin is one of those bodies. Which at least means he won't die next week.

---

quote:

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Originally posted by Strider:
yeah, sorry if i was unclear Reader, I was specifically talking about Jin's portion. Sun was a flashforward and Jin was a flashback. that was the big reveal at the end. why would they go visit his grave otherwise?

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quote:

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Jin's flashback did NOTHING for the story but attempt to throw the audience off. That's a cheap hack. If his flashback was somehow relevant, then it would have been forgiven. It wasn't though, and so was just lame.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Strider:
I tend to think the others are right, Jin's flashback wasn't really relevant and it's main purpose was just to throw the viewer off. The only argument for relevancy that can be made is that Jin talks to Sun about the man he used to be and that he's not that man anymore. So the flashback in a way reminds us of the man he left behind. But I agree that's stretching.

---

agreed. it reminds us of who he worked for, but really did little towards reminding us of who he WAS. Granted, one could argue that who you work for can say a lot about who you are, but even so, that's an awful lot of screen time devoted to saying "Hey! Don't forget that Jin used to work for an unscrupulous character!"
 

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Posted by Shawshank (Member # 8453) on :
 
Even thought it's not canon- what happens at the end of Via Domus?
 

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Posted by EmpSquared (Member # 10890) on :
 
*SPOILERS FOR THE GAME*

You play an as yet unknown 815 survivor who has amnesia. You play the game to survive, and to regain your memory. You remember that you ratted out your journalist girlfriend who was trying to get the scoop on a dangerous guy connected to Thomas Mittelwerk and the Hanso Foundation. You did it so you could get the scoop. Anyway, this dangerous guy's bodyguard kills her, and you flee Australia to get away from this dangerous guy's lackeys because they saw you take a picture of him doing something shady. At the end of the game, you get a boat to get away from the island and Ben and Juliet tell you to use the bearing 325... the same bearing they told Michael to use. You sail away, and then suddenly you see Flight 815 break up over you, you knock out, you wake up on the beach, and your girlfriend, who is supposed to be dead, wakes you up in the middle of the initial time of the crash.
 

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Posted by anitablake (Member # 11526) on :
 
I'm excited about tonight's episode, but it's sad it won't be back for three weeks.
 

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Posted by EmpSquared (Member # 10890) on :
 
What, no one cares about that episode?

Who shot Karl and Rousseau is the next Who shot JR.

Realistically, what do you think happened? I don't think anybody from the boat shot them. An evil part of me thinks Ben either did it or knew it would happen, but I don't think even he could do it. Of course, it could tie into that little speech he gave Michael over the radio about not killing innocents in a war (ironically). And he's killed family before.

Or Jacob could be involved somehow. I think I'd like that better, since I'm positive the parts with Libby were orchestrated by the Island/Jacob. Now, why the Libby apparition didn't want Michael to blow up the boat is beyond me at the moment. I would assume that the last five episodes of this season are going to involve Jacob in a big way.
 

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Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
 
My suspicion was that Ben arranged the shooting. After all, he's the one who convinced the three of them to head off into the jungle. We know he despises Karl and Delenn, and we already know that he is capable of arranging things like that.

But, since this is LOST we're talking about, there's probably some other, far more surprising explanation!
 

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Posted by kanelock (Member # 10982) on :
 
Am I the only one who is upset about Rouseeu(not sure on the spelling) getting killed. She was a good character.
 

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Posted by Shawshank (Member # 8453) on :
 
We don't know if she's dead yet.

My guess is that Karl died and and Rousseau didn't.

What was with Sayid? I really dislike Michael but that was just stupid- telling Captain Gault that he was undercover. I lost a lot of respect for Sayid then.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
Yeah, there's no way Rousseau is dead. I was also upset with Sayid. Oh the irony.

What was with Karl before he was shot? Did he subconsciously know something? Or was the power of the Island giving him a glimpse of his death? And did he really say "i've got a bad feeling about this?" Holy Star Wars reference Batman!
 

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Posted by Shawshank (Member # 8453) on :
 
Didn't they make several references to Alex's stomach/midsection last night? Like it might have implied she was pregnant- which is of course one of Ben's great fears.

I think Ben would have Rousseau and Karl killed off in order to be in control of Alex, I think to ultimately save her life. I think he knows that war is about to break out and Rousseau would definitely join and Karl probably would to- just to defend the Losties even, whereas Ben wants Alex to simply survive he has those two around her killed so that she won't enter the frey.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
Did anyone hear the tv program when Michael was trying to kill himself? It was a game show with a Vonnegut question, but I could not hear the question. (the answer was Kurt Vonnegut.)
Then, the next question was, "Who was the protagonist?" I did not hear that either! I have been trying to hear it on the computer.

Also, I think Ben arranged the killings, and Alex was never in danger.

I think Sayid made a good move, based on his history with Michael. If he cannot trust him, then he must trust his enemy more and is taking his chances.
 

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Posted by akhockey (Member # 8394) on :
 
I think Ben orchestrated the killings. I wouldn't be surprised if he just told the Others who went to the temple to kill anybody who showed up with Alex.

I have no idea why Sayid did that, but he's usually right, so I'm sure we'll find something out.

Personally, I think that Creepy Skeletal Guy is on a separate team from Whidmore, and he put Naomi/Miles/Charlotte/Faraday/Pilot on Whidmore's boat for his own reasons.
 

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Posted by anitablake (Member # 11526) on :
 
Did anyone see the preview for lost returning? It said now we know the oceanic 6 and it showed Kate, Jack, Sayid, Sun, Hurley, and Aaron. How could Aaron possibly be one of the six? He wasn't on the manifest for the plane because he wasn't born yet.
 

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Posted by Shawshank (Member # 8453) on :
 
I don't think it's unreasonable for them to just say- he was born on the island. Maybe they're telling everyone that Kate bore him.
 

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Posted by anitablake (Member # 11526) on :
 
I'm not sure the time adds up for Kate having a child, due to the fact Sun hadn't had her child till they got back, there doesn't seem to be enough time even if Kate was pregnant before she got to the island.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
Game show, anyone? What was the novel? Who was the protaganist?
 

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Posted by anitablake (Member # 11526) on :
 
Novel: Slaughterhouse 5 protagonist:Billy Pilgrim
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
how long was Kate in Australia? she could've said she was like 6 months pregnant at time of plane crash.
 

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Posted by Shawshank (Member # 8453) on :
 
What are your guys' theories on Charles Whidmore? I'm curious.
 

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Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
 
the question about the timeline of the pregnancy may be a moot question, as we know that timelines between the island and the outside world aren't 100% consistent.

Hmmm...I wonder if that's why Charlotte is C.S. Lewis...to make a parallel to the confusing timelines in Narnia.

I'm also rooting for Rousseau not being dead.
 

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Posted by anitablake (Member # 11526) on :
 
I so hope Rousseau is not dead. I think she is one of the best characters.

As for the timeline, I think its shorter if you are off the island than on, so no time to have a baby for Kate. So even if there is a time difference I do not think the losties can explain that to the public once they return.
 

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Posted by EmpSquared (Member # 10890) on :
 
All the stuff they had with the Lost Experience is starting to come around. My theories on Charles Widmore could be intensely spoilerific, so I'll refrain. If any of you wish, though, wikipedia has a ton of info on it.
 

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Posted by Shawshank (Member # 8453) on :
 
I don't know though. Michael's mother said he had been gone for about two months. That seems about right to me.
 

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Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
 
I'm not sure it's safe to assume there's any consistency to the flow of time.
 

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Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
 
Well, we found out that Tom was gay.

When they showed Rousseau, Alex, and Karl, my first thought was "Oh crap, they're going to kill Karl and Rousseau. Won't someone just F***ing kill Ben already?"
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by anitablake:
Novel: Slaughterhouse 5 protagonist:Billy Pilgrim

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Shawshank:
I don't know though. Michael's mother said he had been gone for about two months. That seems about right to me.

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I thought she was referring to time after he left Walt with her, after their return to mainland.
 

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Posted by The Reader (Member # 3636) on :
 
I also hope that Rousseau is alive.

I think Charles Widmore must have had an experience early in his life involving the island. Ever since then he has spent his life ammassing a fortune big enough to search for it. Desmond, being an aquaintance of his daughter, ending up there may be a very happy accident.

Kate could end up with Aaron by saying that he had not yet been born after the crash, but his mother was very injured, too much so to tell her name or anything. Aaron's survival would almost be a miracle, but believable. On a plane with more than 300 people, the chances of Claire being the only pregnant woman on board are very low. The chance of her being the only one close to full-term is high, but it is possible that she wasn't the only one.

Wow, That's a grim hypothesis.

In any case, I suspect that the issue of DNA testing will come up in the future.

Sayid's exposure of Michael may get Michael killed. When Sayid realizes that Michael was telling the truth about Widmore, he'll have to take up Michael's mission of protecting the people on the island. I have more respect for Michael now. At least he recognizes his treachery and is trying to do something about it.
 

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Posted by Bokonon (Member # 480) on :
 
Re: Odysseus, Penelope

It's the cyclops' island. We've already met him. I wonder who the sheep are?

-Bok
 

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Posted by Shawshank (Member # 8453) on :
 

quote:

---

When they showed Rousseau, Alex, and Karl, my first thought was "Oh crap, they're going to kill Karl and Rousseau. Won't someone just F***ing kill Ben already?"

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quote:

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Originally posted by Bokonon:
Re: Odysseus, Penelope

It's the cyclops' island. We've already met him. I wonder who the sheep are?

-Bok

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quote:

---

Originally posted by EmpSquared:
It's not going to get Michael killed. Sayid has not damned him. I think the island has big plans for Michael; why bring him back just to die? He's also too much of a fan favorite character to die.

---

He is? He's not one of my favorites, that's for sure.
 

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Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
 
I know a lot of people are puzzled over Sayid's "betrayal", but I thought it was very much in keeping with the kind of person Sayid is.

Sayid is suspicious of the freighter people, but he knows for sure that he distrusts Ben.

If the freighter people really are the "good guys", then turning over Michael is a smart move.

If Ben turned out to be the "good guy", then Sayid's actions might interfere with Ben's plans, but since Michael has already given Ben all the info he has about the crew, and has done his sabotage, Sayid might conclude that it's not irepararable damage.

And at the same time, by declaring Michael a "traitor", he has essentially declared himself to be on the freighter peoples' side, and positions himself to get that much closer to finding out what's really going on.

To me it seems like that sort of intelligence/chess move thinking is just the sort of reasoning Sayid would come up with.

On the other hand, it could just be Sayid thinking with his heart instead of his head.
 

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Posted by Shawshank (Member # 8453) on :
 

quote:

---

It's not going to get Michael killed. Sayid has not damned him. I think the island has big plans for Michael; why bring him back just to die? He's also too much of a fan favorite character to die.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Jeorge:
I know a lot of people are puzzled over Sayid's "betrayal", but I thought it was very much in keeping with the kind of person Sayid is.

Sayid is suspicious of the freighter people, but he knows for sure that he distrusts Ben.

If the freighter people really are the "good guys", then turning over Michael is a smart move.

If Ben turned out to be the "good guy", then Sayid's actions might interfere with Ben's plans, but since Michael has already given Ben all the info he has about the crew, and has done his sabotage, Sayid might conclude that it's not irepararable damage.

And at the same time, by declaring Michael a "traitor", he has essentially declared himself to be on the freighter peoples' side, and positions himself to get that much closer to finding out what's really going on.

To me it seems like that sort of intelligence/chess move thinking is just the sort of reasoning Sayid would come up with.

On the other hand, it could just be Sayid thinking with his heart instead of his head.

---

quote:

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Originally posted by Elizabeth:
From Wikipedia(sorry, Von. fans):

Slaughterhouse-Five spans the life of a man who has "come unstuck in time." It is the story of Billy Pilgrim experiencing different time periods of his life, most notably his experience in World War II and his relationship with his family. The book is a series of seemingly random happenings that, in combination, present the thematic elements of the novel in an unraveling order.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Lisa:
Slaughterhouse Five is a total rip-off of The Time-Traveler's Wife.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Jeorge:
Every time I look at the casket scene I think: "that casket is too short for a 'normal' height adult", which makes me think Ben is a possibility because he's short.

On the subject of Sayid and the "betrayal", I may be remembering this wrong (it's so confusing to try to remember who knows what), but

1. Ben announced that he had a spy in Charlotte's presence.

2. Charlotte is no longer with Locke's company, which means she's been free to contact the freighter and let them know.

3. Sayid knows both 1 & 2? And therefore could reasonably assume that the freighter is more or less in lock-down mode because they already KNOW (and if they don't, they likely soon will know) there's a spy on board, and therefore Michael's usefulness was already shot.

Yes? No?

---

Ben announced he had a spy twice: the first time was only to Locke, but no name was mentioned on camera. The second time it was to Sawyer, Hurley, Miles, Alex, Danielle, and Karl. This was after Charlotte was released to Jack and co. As far as I know, Charlotte wasn't present for the first one, but that doesn't mean that nobody told her. However; she was a prisoner, and Locke doesn't allow access to his prisoners.

Edit to add: As for the casket, I think that the short length may be a production error. It could be holding a child, I.E. Walt, But I think the storyline supports Michael.
 

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Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
 
I think you missed the first time. After Ben recited Charlotte's life history to everyone, they asked how he knew all that, and he said he had a spy on Ben's boat. Wasn't Charlotte present then?

I understand why Ben did it - Locke had a gun to his head, and giving up a secret was the only way he could convince Locke not to shoot him. But when he did that, he had to know that he was seriously compromising his spy.
 

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Posted by The Reader (Member # 3636) on :
 
I forgot about that part. Charlotte had ample time to contact the freighter after Locke released her. Man, this show is getting to be like a soap opera.
 

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Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
 
With all the shifting allegiances and all the secrets, my biggest fear for the show is that they will back themselves into a plot corner that they can't get out of because of some little detail they've forgotten.

So far I think they've done quite well at managing all the characters and their stories.
 

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Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
 
Was the guy in the hospital bed next to Michael Locke's father?
 

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Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Jeorge:
With all the shifting allegiances and all the secrets, my biggest fear for the show is that they will back themselves into a plot corner that they can't get out of because of some little detail they've forgotten.

So far I think they've done quite well at managing all the characters and their stories.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Jeorge:
It was funny when Twain did it, but I won't be impressed if LOST takes that route.

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quote:

---

So why does he have to ask the hotel receptionist the year?

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To establish the current date with the audience.


 

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Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
 

quote:

---

So why does he have to ask the hotel receptionist the year?

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quote:

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To establish the current date with the audience.

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quote:

---

but JUST to establish the current date with the audience? Would Lost do something so obvious, and unnecessary for the character, just for our sake?

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quote:

---

Originally posted by theCrowsWife:
I think Ben was way too surprised by Alex's death for the rules to simply be agreements between the sides. He was sure that they wouldn't kill her. There's already precedent for island rules working even off of the island (like Michael not being able to kill himself). Perhaps it's a similar rule that doesn't allow Ben to kill Whidmore. Whether there's a connection between Whidmore and Jacob or not, I do not believe that the "rules" are merely agreements the two sides have made.

--Mel

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quote:

---

I wonder why Ben was dressed for arctic weather when he woke up in the Saharan desert. I think there is some sort of connection here with the dharma polar bear that was found in the desert.

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The dharma polar bear in the desert was definitely this season, I believe it was the second episode. It was episode where they introduced the rescue team. Penny was not there, it was Charlotte.
 

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Posted by Tammy (Member # 4119) on :
 
I missed it.

Does anyone know where I can watch it online, without having to download anything?
 

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Posted by Puffy Treat (Member # 7210) on :
 
Last year ABC's "Lost" page still allowed one to watch new episodes on the old player. Does it still?

I'm so highly amused that Widmore finally blurted out what everyone's been thinking: Ben has the creepiest peepers in the universe.
 

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Posted by Shawshank (Member # 8453) on :
 
You can watch all of Lost on ABC.com with their nice HD-streaming.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by The Rabbit:
Please note that I said this

quote:

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I wonder why Ben was dressed for arctic weather when he woke up in the Saharan desert. I think there is some sort of connection here with the dharma polar bear that was found in the desert.

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The dharma polar bear in the desert was definitely this season, I believe it was the second episode. It was episode where they introduced the rescue team. Penny was not there, it was Charlotte.

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quote:

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Also, where Ben first landed in the Sahara...that's where the polar bear remains were found right?

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I might not have spelled it out as well as you did, but I was going for the same thing.

What Uprooted is talking about is, I think, the two men at the end of season 2 in the monitoring station that call Penny after the failsafe went off.
 

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Posted by The Reader (Member # 3636) on :
 
I think the two men in the listening station were in Antarctica.
 

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Posted by Uprooted (Member # 8353) on :
 
Yeah, that's what I was talking about Strider, thanks -- and I was careful to say "polar regions" because I had no idea which pole. And the Reader, I'm not sure if you thought I missed your comment when you said "please note that I said this." I was actually trying to make another connection to what both you and Strider had mentioned. Clumsily, obviously.
 

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Posted by The Reader (Member # 3636) on :
 
I'm the one being clumsy. I should have noted the connection you were trying to make.

I just looked over Lostpedia to make sure that the Listening Station was in Antarctica, and apparently the exact location was never established in the show. It could be the Arctic.

Though I swear I remember a screen caption in that episode that said "Antarctica" when showing the station.
 

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Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
 
When Jack says "Bernard, got a minute?" are we supposed to assume that Jack knows that Bernard knows morse code, and Jack is telling him, "Be sure you're around when the message is sent."

Or is this part of some larger plot that hasn't yet been revealed?
 

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Posted by EmpSquared (Member # 10890) on :
 
A lot of questions have been answered, it seems. Actually, to be more specific, we've been given way more material to answer questions ourselves.

Charles Widmore was involved with the Dharma Initiative, and when Ben had the camp gassed, he started a war. Thinking back to the first season when Ethan Rom was this eerie, almost supernatural guy who was the only sentient being who didn't crash on the island, the scope has grown considerably.

That being said, the four-toed statue, Jacob, the nature of the island and the smoke monster are all mysteries that I care more about being solved. The supernatural elements intrigue me more than a flesh and blood power struggle.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
i was just rewatching the episode and when Ben wakes up in the Sahara, it seems like there's either steam rising from his body, or that he's surrounded by it or some sort of vapor.
 

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Posted by Sterling (Member # 8096) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by MEC:
Well, we found out that Tom was gay.

When they showed Rousseau, Alex, and Karl, my first thought was "Oh crap, they're going to kill Karl and Rousseau. Won't someone just F***ing kill Ben already?"

---

quote:

---

That being said, the four-toed statue, Jacob, the nature of the island and the smoke monster are all mysteries that I care more about being solved. The supernatural elements intrigue me more than a flesh and blood power struggle.

---

Not to be snarky, but there would be no power struggle without the supernatural. It's just as important to Lost. I happen to be enjoying the struggle, but we all get our fun from Lost in our own way.

Originally posted by Evie3217:

quote:

---

I think that Ben is going to get Sayid to kill Penny. Whether Sayid ends up doing this or not, I don't know, because I'm positive he's seen Desmond's picture of her and knows who she is. But, knowing that Sayid ends up working for Ben, he must have fulfilled some kind of job for him, so there is a distinct possibility that Ben convinces Sayid to kill Penny. I mean, if we know one thing about Ben, we know that he's good at manipulating people.

---

quote:

---

quote:

---

I think that Ben is going to get Sayid to kill Penny. Whether Sayid ends up doing this or not, I don't know, because I'm positive he's seen Desmond's picture of her and knows who she is. But, knowing that Sayid ends up working for Ben, he must have fulfilled some kind of job for him, so there is a distinct possibility that Ben convinces Sayid to kill Penny. I mean, if we know one thing about Ben, we know that he's good at manipulating people.

---

I think that really hits it. We know that Sayid's motivation is vengeance for the murder of Nadia. If Charles Widmore really did have her murdered, as Ben claims, then Sayid could easily be manipulated to kill anyone. After all, if Nadia is dead, then Sayid would think he has nothing left to live for.

---

quote:

---

One of my friends just pointed this out to me. When Jack sees his father in the lobby of the hospital, he's fixing a smoke alarm. Could that possibly have anything to do with the smoke monster on the island? Also, is that what is appearing to Hurley as Charlie? And if so, does that mean that the smoke monster is sentient?

---

That's subtlety. Are there other indicators that the Monster is hiding nearby?

After seeing the Mobisode with Christian, I think that Vincent is very important. He seems to act as a channel for something the Island wants to communicate. Christian couldn't wake up Jack, so he had to have Vincent do it.
 

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Posted by Sterling (Member # 8096) on :
 
Does anyone else think "you're not supposed to raise him" might not refer to Ethan, but to, well, the dead?...
 

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Posted by Evie3217 (Member # 5426) on :
 
The only thing I can think about the "you're not supposed to raise him comment," and something that's been bugging me since we learned that Kate is raising Aaron, is what the psychic told Claire about the baby. He told her that only she could raise the baby or things would go wrong. What happened to that? Kate is raising Aaron, so does that mean that he is somewhat corrupted?

I like the idea of Vincent playing a role on the island. He does seem to be more aware of things than everyone else. It's like the island speaks to him. If only we could figure out what's going on there. But sadly, unless the island becomes ridiculous, dog's can't talk. Well, not yet.
 

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Posted by Uprooted (Member # 8353) on :
 
Remind me when they are supposed to wrap up the series again -- is it one or two more seasons?
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
2 more seasons after this one.

and Sterling, that's a neat idea. Even the way Hurley asks it, "do you think that means Aaron?"

So maybe it's not just Jack's dad appearing to him, but that he has a more active role in bringing his father back because of all the problems he's going through.

I still think it's probably more likely that that line refers to Aaron, but I like the idea.
 

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Posted by Sterling (Member # 8096) on :
 
I think it's also worth remembering that in the original "flash forward", at one point Jack refers to his father as if he were alive (something like "if he's less intoxicated than I am...") Admittedly Jack is pretty messed up at that point, and they were playing with our minds (not letting us know that we were flashing forward, not back), but still...

Aaron, right. I don't know why the name Ethan stuck in my mind.
 

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Posted by Shawshank (Member # 8453) on :
 
The discussion on Christian Shepherd seems even more salient now doesn't it. I still can't figure out the connection between Alpert and Jacob- Alpert seems to be involved in the raising of new leaders (like when he met Ben in the woods) and until this episode I thought Abbaddon was the most evil guy in the show (even more than Whidmore) but now I'm not sure.

I think the move of the island could explain the Arctic/Tunisia connection. And they don't specify if they move through time or space (my best guess is both- explaining things like the Black Rock, maybe even Adam and Eve). Maybe the Black Rock was a recent addition to the island- during its last move through time, the ship crashed and that's how Whidmore knew to buy the log of the ship.

I loved the moment between Hurley and Ben about sharing the candy bar. And Ben (who's probably my favorite character) saying that his time of leadership was over- made me quite sad.

One last thing- I don't think Claire is dead, maybe she will die later on but we don't know that yet. Maybe she just stays on the island in the cabin with her father, I don't know. That's why Jack can't look at Aaron maybe- because he thinks of Claire and how she's with her/his dad whom Jack hates. The only reason she seems different was just her sort of dazed happy look.

Great episode. I feel like we're really getting a LOT of new material lately.
 

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Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
 
Considering Abbaddon means either "The Abyss" or "The King of the Abyss", I think the writers intend for us to view him as a bad guy. Whether he is or not, that's an interesting new wrinkle from last night!

I had this very bad moment last night when Ben and Hurley were sitting there at the end, and I thought to myself, "Oh no! The island is going to tell John that the only way to save the island is to sacrifice Hurley! That's why Hurley came along!"

I can't tell you how how happy I was to be wrong about that!
 

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Posted by msquared (Member # 4484) on :
 
I thought Claire being in the shack with Jack's dad proved that she was dead.

msquared
 

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Posted by JoeH (Member # 5958) on :
 
My brain almost exploded trying to process everything in that last episode. I think Christian and Claire are both dead, but have been "resurrected" by the island.
 

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Posted by msquared (Member # 4484) on :
 
I think people get "resurrected" by the island to help it communicate with living people. They don't stay alive.

msquared
 

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Posted by kanelock (Member # 10982) on :
 
I don't think Claire is dead. She was most likely shown the truth about the island, or that was not really her and she is really somewhere else. What about the reveal that the others were after Locke from the time he was born!!!
I find, after shows like last night, that Ben is becoming one of my favorite characters on the show. He is so complex.
I also believe that the "Charlie" and "Christian" that we see off the island is really the Black Cloud. I think jacob is using it to try to get the people to return to the island. we shall see.
 

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Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by kanelock:
I also believe that the "Charlie" and "Christian" that we see off the island is really the Black Cloud.

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Why didn't Locke recognize Richard? Remember when he faced down Ben in front of the Others, and they listened to him, rather than to Ben? Richard was there then.

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Locke only saw Alpert once, as far as we know, and because he was a little boy, he may not remember what Alpert looks like. He should recognize the name, but I don't know if his name was ever mentioned in Locke's presence during the scene you mention.

I agree with kanelock. The others' being after Locke his whole life is a big reveal. He really has been a lost soul, avoiding his destiny.

Whatever Christian's state is (resurrected, in my opinion), Claire doesn't share it. I think she's alive and well, and still bruised from her house explosion. In between when the house was attacked and when she left Sawyer's group, she still cared for Aaron and interacted normally with other people. Christian couldn't, or didn't want to, interact normally. His interactions with people on the Island were cryptic, until he was in Jacob's cabin. That probably has something to do with the cabin.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
As for Richard.
Could it be possible that only we see Richard as he appears? Perhaps he looks like other people to the Losties, and that is why they don't seem surprised to see him?
 

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Posted by Uprooted (Member # 8353) on :
 
Are Richard Alpert and Abbadon on the same team? I can't remember much about Abbadon, just that he was in some scene where he appeared rather menacing, as I recall interacting with one of the women who was on the crew of Whidmore's ship -- am I wrong?

Why was it wrong for Locke as a child to choose the knife? Alpert didn't want him to choose violence? He certainly showed up on the island with a set of knives and the island wanted him anyway, apparently. And he couldn't become the "chosen one" until he killed his father, or had Sawyer do it at Richard's suggestion.

What's the significance of the marks on Hurley's shirt? They're similar to the mark on Locke's face.

Like many others have said previously, I can't help thinking about the psychic's admonition to Claire to be sure no one else raised her child.

That's a good point about Christian setting off the smoke detector.
 

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Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
 
One of the things that puzzles me is, though the psychic said that Claire needed to raise her own child, in another episode, he freely admitted that he's a fraud. So which do we believe?

Maybe the knife didn't "already" belong to Locke - it was something he wasn't ready for yet, and by taking it before it was already his he was showing that he was not ready.

Abbadon shows up at the mental ward in the future, and he also gives instructions to Naomi. I have no theories about whether he's with or against any particular person or group.

Giving instructions to Naomi suggests he's on Whidmore's team, but sending Locke onto his walkabout quest seems to contradict that, since Locke is definitely against Whidmore.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
Maybe he had ulterior motives for getting Locke to the island. Maybe Locke wasn't actually right or meant for the Island and by helping to bring him there it will hurt the Island and help Whidmore.

Having said that, I don't really believe it, I DO think Locke was meant for the Island.

So why did Locke pick the knife instead of the magazine? Was it for the same reason he went against the guidance counselor?

Uprooted, the magazine was some sort of mystery tale about a hidden island, seemed like an obvious thing(from our standpoint) to belong to Locke.

This may or may not be an obvious question, but is Cooper really Locke's father or not? If not, could it be Richard?

I don't think Richard is dead, and I don't think Claire is dead either, but I do wonder what happened to her after she woke up and saw Christian.

I agree the Locke reveal is a huge reveal. That was pretty unexpected.
 

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Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
 
The question about Cooper being Locke's father, I always had doubts about that, because I thought the two were far too close in age. The actors are actually only 8 years apart. Now that we know Locke's father is much older than his mother (I think something along those lines was said?) it simply strains at believability to think he really is Locke's father - unless he's got the Richard Syndrome.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
The father was roughly twice the age of the mother, which I guess would put him in his early to mid thirties at the time of Locke's birth.

If it is Richard it would explain why he helps him out against Ben on the Island, and why he tries again when Locke is a teenager.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
Oh, also, I completely forgot to mention another important connection/reveal. Locke was born in his mother's sixth month of pregnancy. She lived though.
 

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Posted by Uprooted (Member # 8353) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Strider:
Uprooted, the magazine was some sort of mystery tale about a hidden island, seemed like an obvious thing(from our standpoint) to belong to Locke.

This may or may not be an obvious question, but is Cooper really Locke's father or not? If not, could it be Richard?

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quote:

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The other thing I keep thinking about . . . in one of the flash forwards Jack tells Kate that they'd made a mistake, that they never should have left the island (she tells him he's wrong). And I don't remember whether it was before or after that in time that Hurley told Jack that he was wrong to have gone with Locke on the island, that he should have stayed with Jack.

I wonder if any of them know what they're talking about?

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quote:

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The test given to young Locke by Richard Alpert strongly resembles the Tibetan Buddhist ritual used to confirm a reincarnated tulku (the Dalai Lama being the most widely known).

* The Book in the test is the Ba'hai Book of Law

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quote:

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Abbadon was encouraging Locke to go back on the path he had abandoned. A walkabout can't be accomplished without violent self-reliance. That was apparently the path that Alpert was disappointed to see him take. Abbadon and Alpert represent opposing forces trying to control Locke's destiny.

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quote:

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Originally posted by kanelock:
I had a thought about the first flash forward. It seems to me that they told us why, even though Jack was repeatedly flying the same route to and from Australia, he could not get back to the island. It's because the island was moved. Therefore the island is not in the same place. That also could explain why Widmore is looking for it, because it has been moved over the years.

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quote:

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But if Richard is working in the best interest of the Island, why is it important to groom a leader who can manipulate? Why would whatever force that is behind the Island want a manipulative personality in control? And wasn't there a reason many of The Others(Richard included) weren't happy with Ben and his leadership anymore? Shouldn't they want someone who will lead differently?

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quote:

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I like to think that Richard is a "good" character. Does this automatically make Abbadon a bad character? Who is he connected with? What does he want with the Island? Does he help Locke solely so next time Locke sees him he'll "owe him one". Maybe he's something like a shunned Other who's trying to get back to the Island.

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quote:

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And I very, very much disagree with those who think the island is a benevolent entity. It seems both ruthless and capricious in many of its "actions". Ben Linus may have been exactly the leader the island had in mind, up to a point. His failure may have been nothing more than failing to step out of the way when the island decided Locke should take the position. And it may have killed Alex, or at least allowed her to have been killed, in revenge. If someone takes a greater role in the island's plan, I don't think it will be because of their benevolence.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Elizabeth:
What is a simulcrum?

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quote:

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Originally posted by EmpSquared:
So, I can't back this up at all, but I heard from my girlfriend that Emilie de Ravin (Claire) wants to do movies and such... so she might be disappearing for a little while.

So, when Jacob adopts the form of dead people, since he has to have them is there any part of them left in these images? Are they simply Jacob/Smoke monster looking like them, or have they been assimilated into Jacob/The Island/Smoke Monster2:Electric Boogaloo?

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quote:

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Originally posted by Lisa:

quote:

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Originally posted by EmpSquared:
So, I can't back this up at all, but I heard from my girlfriend that Emilie de Ravin (Claire) wants to do movies and such... so she might be disappearing for a little while.

So, when Jacob adopts the form of dead people, since he has to have them is there any part of them left in these images? Are they simply Jacob/Smoke monster looking like them, or have they been assimilated into Jacob/The Island/Smoke Monster2:Electric Boogaloo?

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The horse. Ben's mother. Those are two instances of the phantoms not having any connection to the island. So my guess is that the phantoms are pulled from the minds of the people seeing them.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Strider:

quote:

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Originally posted by Lisa:
The horse. Ben's mother. Those are two instances of the phantoms not having any connection to the island. So my guess is that the phantoms are pulled from the minds of the people seeing them.

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That used to be my interpretation too(still is i guess). But obviously Christian Shepard is the first one to break that mold.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Strider:
He's became way more prominent, and has even communicated now with people who never knew him before(most recently Locke, but also Vincent in that mobisode). Speaking for Jacob seems like a big deal too, why would Jacob not speak for himself?

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quote:

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Originally posted by Strider:
I liked how they split everyone up too Lisa, should make things very interesting in the end. How much of who ended up being in the O6(btw, when did we start using this?)

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quote:

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Originally posted by Strider:
oh, also, The Orchid. That's the station from that orientation video that was released online only, with the rabbit. Interesting.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Tammy:
I think I'd watch a series with just Hurley and Ben in it. Those two together crack me up.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Lisa:
Incidentally, was I the only one who wanted to cry when everyone was met by people at the base when the plane landed except for Kate? She looked so alone.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Strider:
which reminds me, Faraday had the Orchid symbol in his notebook! How and why is it there? Has Faraday ever consciousness hopped?

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quote:

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Originally posted by Shawshank:
Maybe Ben?

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quote:

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Originally posted by Strider:
Michael's a good guess, but I wonder why they wouldn't just include him in the Oceanic 7?

Did he want to stay anonymous that badly? I mean, this would give him a chance to not have to hide his identity.

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quote:

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Bentham's ambition in life was to create a "Pannomion", a complete Utilitarian code of law. Bentham not only proposed many legal and social reforms, but also expounded an underlying moral principle on which they should be based. This philosophy, utilitarianism, argued that the right act or policy was that which would cause "the greatest happiness of the greatest number" — a phrase of which he is generally, though erroneously, regarded as the author — though he later dropped the second qualification and embraced what he called "the greatest happiness principle," often referred to as the principle of utility.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Tammy:

Did you see the two alternate endings? I'm just confused on how they would have used those two in the coffin. I really can't see why Kate would flip out about going to their funerals. She would have definitely went to Sawyer's, and I see no reason for her to not go to Desmond's.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Tresopax:
Ben was extremely utilitarian - he was willing to do any seemingly immoral thing if he thought it would achieve the greater good of protecting the island and the others.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Shawshank:
I'm not going to lie- if I saw the man who killed my daughter mocking that incident, I don't know if I would react any differently than Ben did.

*And I'm not even a parent

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quote:

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Not to mention she wasn't even his daughter, he stole her from the French woman.

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You raise someone for 16 years as your own daughter, they are your daughter. Not saying Ben was right in kidnapping her, but he basically adopted her through vastly immoral methods.
 

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Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
 
I bet that's how Keamy was able to kill her. If she'd been Ben's biological child, he wouldn't have been able to. But it'd been so long that Ben just assumed that she'd be as safe as he was.
 

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Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
 
Here's Adam from MythBusters' opinion on the explosion:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/research/4266333.html?series=6

I thought the exact same thing about the bomb. I didn't know about the explosion bit though, in my mind I think it would have been cooler to see the explosion, then hear it.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
I don't think Keamie is necessarily gone.

I loved him. (I mean, I hated him, but he was still good. Reminded me of a human Terminator)
 

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Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
 
The name "Jeremy Bentham" rang a bell with me, and I finally figured out why. I've got an ancient "Ripley's Believe It Or Not" compilation that has an article about Bentham.

When Bentham died, he left his fortune to University College Hospital, with the condition that his corpse be preserved and dressed up, and always in attendance at board meetings.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a6/Jbentham.600px.jpg

So, there you have it - even though Locke is dead, he's still running things.
 

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Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Scott R:
Hmm...the wiki on Jeremy Bentham doesn't seem to agree with Rabbit and TK's summation of Bentham's philosophy:

quote:

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Bentham's ambition in life was to create a "Pannomion", a complete Utilitarian code of law. Bentham not only proposed many legal and social reforms, but also expounded an underlying moral principle on which they should be based. This philosophy, utilitarianism, argued that the right act or policy was that which would cause "the greatest happiness of the greatest number" — a phrase of which he is generally, though erroneously, regarded as the author — though he later dropped the second qualification and embraced what he called "the greatest happiness principle," often referred to as the principle of utility.

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quote:

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Originally posted by MEC:
Here's Adam from MythBusters' opinion on the explosion:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/research/4266333.html?series=6

I thought the exact same thing about the bomb. I didn't know about the explosion bit though, in my mind I think it would have been cooler to see the explosion, then hear it.

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quote:

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Faraday had some people in the zodiac raft. They were off the Island when it moved. They may or may not have been taken in the temporal bubble with the Island. If not, then they are lost at sea.

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The zodiac could not be seen from the helicopter after the island moved so I'm assuming it went with the island.
 

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Posted by The Reader (Member # 3636) on :
 
Yeah, the helicopter and the raft were fairly close to each other. Faraday and the rest probably would have seen the helicopter go in and attempt a rescue.
 

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Posted by Wendybird (Member # 84) on :
 
It is still possible Desomond will have to return since he played a key role on the island for so long. Lapidus wasn't an island inhabitant though so I'm not sure if he'll have to return.

I want to know how Locke gets off the island and how his corpse ends up in CA. And how did Jack know Locke's new identity to recognize the funeral notice?

So many new mysteries
 

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Posted by Shawshank (Member # 8453) on :
 
My guess is that season 5 focus is mostly on the O6 and all of them realizing they have to go back as a group. Along with that is what happened on the island immediately after the events following the S4 finale.

My guess is that the S5 finale will end with the O6 + plus Bentham getting back onto the island, and we'll see a new level of devastation to the island. And then John Locke will be revived back to life.
 

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Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
 

quote:

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And how did Jack know Locke's new identity to recognize the funeral notice?

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quote:

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Originally posted by The Reader:
I think this is the first time that a current timelime has gone directly to a flashforward. Ben turned the Island's steering wheel, and was then sent to Tunisia.

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quote:

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After reviewing this thread, I now believe that Locke really did commit suicide, . His faith in the island was that strong. The only question now is why. But I think he died intentionally, believing the island could bring him back.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Elizabeth:
I did a Google search of "Lapidus." The name is derived from Latin, "lapidas," meaning stone.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Shawshank:
The Medusa spider only paralyzes them for 1 hour. Remember at the end of the episode when Nikki's eyes opened right as they covered her face with the dirt?

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Listen, Shawshank, I was all "Yeah, I'm with Shawhank, let's not ever remind ourselves of the Nikki/Paulo incident," and then you yourself reminded me of it!

Ahhhhhhhhhhhh.

I have had buried-alive nightmares since childhood.
 

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Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
 
I feel so neglected.
 

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Posted by EmpSquared (Member # 10890) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Shawshank:
The Medusa spider only paralyzes them for 1 hour. Remember at the end of the episode when Nikki's eyes opened right as they covered her face with the dirt?

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quote:

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Originally posted by Strider:
The Medusa Spider only incapacitates for a short period of time. Locke was "dead" for longer than the time it would have taken him to wake up I think.

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Uh, yeah. I forgot about that.

I initially made the comment as a joke, and then took myself seriously.

It wasn't a very good joke.
 

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Posted by Wendybird (Member # 84) on :
 
Do we know if Locke died on the island or off? We know he visited the O6 (missed that the first time I watched) but we don't know if he remained on the mainland or went back to the island prior to his death. If he did die on the island then how did his body get back to LA?
 

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Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
 
Maybe Locke's not actually dead, and Jeremy Benthem is actually an incarnation of the island.
 

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Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
 
Well, this is the thread that moved me from lurker to poster, so I thought I'd just bring it to the top once more to say "farewell" to the thread.

Alas! No more Lost until next season. :-/
 

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Posted by The Reader (Member # 3636) on :
 
Before this thread dies, I have some observations that I want to get out here.

Farday needed Desmond to be his constant. Desmond is gone, presumably for at oleast three years. Faraday will die very soon if Desmond doesn't return, and Faraday knows some things about the properties of the Island that few others know. I think that is more important than what has been indicated.

Because Lapidus is the only person on the Kahana to return to the world, there will be a lot of questions about him from inquiring people, like Charles Widmore and Matthew Abaddon. He is in mortal danger because he knows about Oceanic 815, and he isn't a celebrity. I think he'll have to return to the Island not only for his own safety, but also because he has been exposed to the Island's secrets. Desmond in the same situation, and may even be worse off because he carries properties from the Island. Also I don't think he has fulfilled the destiny that Mrs. Hawking predicted.

If Penny didn't know about the Island before, she does now, and she has to be part of the conspiracy. She has to use her significant resources to keep the Island a secret, and to protect the O6, Desmond, and Frank. On the other hand, she might also be working with her father to lead them into a trap. If this is true, then Ben becomes the good guy because he is protecting the O6, Frank, and Desmond. I love that irony.

The Survivors left on the Island have no option but to try to ally with the Natives. The success or failure of this option is probably one the "terrible things" that Locke warned about. There would probably be dissention among the ranks of both parties about this.

The Survivors would be split among the people who want to leave and those who want to join the Natives. Those who want to leave would risk exposing the Island.

The Natives would be split among those who believe that the Survivors should be accepted and those who think that they should be kicked off the Island. That option also leaves the Island vulnerable.

When Ben unleashed the Smoke Monster, he may have changed its nature. It's possible that it is now unstoppable and this would be another one the things that Locke told the O6. It might even be impersonating the mercenaries.
 

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Posted by Sterling (Member # 8096) on :
 
The way the other members of the Oceanic 6 talk about Bentham, it sounds as though his "suicide" was a cover for his being murdered. I suspect Whitmore's hand; either "going after" those he sees as Ben Linus' agents, or trying to kill the person he sees as key to Ben, not him, being in control of The Island.

For anyone who's still observing the thread, I'm curious as to opinions: is Hurley really crazy? Or has he just become a conduit for forces beyond his control? (Not that both isn't a possibility...)
 

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Posted by The Reader (Member # 3636) on :
 
Hurley has been able to communicate easily with his imaginary people, like Dave, Charlie, and Eko. For everyone else who has seen people, it has been like contacting a ghost. The contact is ephemeral and fleeting. What he perceives as a curse and mental illness is actually his ability, or abilities, that he doesn't know how to control.

Or maybe he has a mental illness that makes him a savant in the ability to use the island.
 

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Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
 
This seems too obvious, but maybe he's the only sane one, the only one who sees what's real.
 

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Posted by Uprooted (Member # 8353) on :
 
Dude. Hurley's always been the sanest one on the Island. And off.

Seriously, Everybody Loves Hugo, right?
 

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Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
 
To the point that it really irked me when Jack called him Hurley. I mean, even Sawyer calls him Hugo now.
 

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Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
 
Do any of the losties except Sawyer and Locke call him Hugo?

What did Sun call him when he comes to see her and the baby?

What did Sayid call him when he comes to break him out of the psychiatric hospital?
 

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Posted by Wendybird (Member # 84) on :
 
I *think* Sun and Sayid called him Hurley. My daughter has worked her way through seasons one and two and we are in the middle of three. When she finishes we'll watch all the season 4 episodes I have on the DVR - which should be the whole thing. Its really really interesting watching season three having the answers season 4 gives us. Desmond's whole time travel episode - man.
 

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