That's pretty cool. For the nematode, at least.
Posted by Tammy (Member # 4119) on :
I'm repulsed and intrigued at the same time.
*shutters*
Posted by SoaPiNuReYe (Member # 9144) on :
I once read a book that involved a certain species of tapeworm. It lived in cows, but when it needed to reproduce it would lay eggs and they would pass through the cow's digestive system. Ants would get ahold of it and when the eggs got inside the ant, it would do something very freaky. The ant would act normal during the day, but at dusk everyday, the ant would climb a blade of grass and just sit there all night. When a cow takes a bite out of the grass it digests the eggs and becomes infected with the tapeworm and it starts all over again. It is kinda of scary to think that simple parasites can alter creatures' behavior like that, especially when there's no telling if they are doing something similiar to us.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
I'm not convinced these guys are making the correct conclusion as to why these ants are behaving in this manner.
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
quote:Originally posted by Avadaru: That's pretty cool. For the nematode, at least.
For a nematode? Hell, that's just cool, period. I am absolutely *fascinated* by the way that parasites can change their hosts behavior; it's kind of a pet topic for me, honestly, so I'm really excited about hearing of a (likely) example of it that I hadn't heard about. Thanks, Phanto!
Posted by MightyCow (Member # 9253) on :
Why not BlackBlade? That's evolution 101. The parasites which happen to make ants hang out on grass are successful.
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
It hasn't been conclusively demonstrated. The researcher quoted in the article was saying things to the effect of "I never actually saw the smoking gun, but I'd be willing to bet that this is what's happening". I wouldn't be at all surprised if he's right; this certainly wouldn't be the only parasite to alter its host's appearance and behavior in some significant and, for the host, dangerous ways. It hasn't been proven that that's what's happening here, though.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
Oh I have no problem with the idea the parasite is altering it's hosts behavior in order to increase it's own chances of survival. But if he is not seeing the birds go for the ants, then he has no evidence that the parasite wants the birds in particular to eat it.
For all he knows there is another animal besides the birds that eats berries. Monkeys, frogs?
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
Monkey-frogs.
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
Or Frog-monkeys, possibly.
Posted by Juxtapose (Member # 8837) on :
I once read a book that involved a certain species of tapeworm. It lived in cows, but when it needed to reproduce it would lay eggs and they would pass through the cow's digestive system. Ants would get ahold of it and when the eggs got inside the ant, it would do something very freaky. The ant would act normal during the day, but at dusk everyday, the ant would climb a blade of grass and just sit there all night. When a cow takes a bite out of the grass it digests the eggs and becomes infected with the tapeworm and it starts all over again. It is kinda of scary to think that simple parasites can alter creatures' behavior like that, especially when there's no telling if they are doing something similiar to us.
Heh. According to Daniel Dennett, religion is a meme-parasite that spreads by doing just this. (See the opening of his Breaking the Spell, which you can read for free at Amazon, where he discusses this ant behavior.)
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
quote:Originally posted by Noemon: I am absolutely *fascinated* by the way that parasites can change their hosts behavior; it's kind of a pet topic for me...
So, has your pet tapeworm made you give him a name yet?
Posted by The Pixiest (Member # 1863) on :
Might I sugguest "Colin"?
Posted by aragorn64 (Member # 4204) on :
Ugh, on the left of that zombie snail video there was a link for a "worm in the face" video or something. I feel like throwing up now...whenever I read about (or watch videos of) parasites, I always start to get really paranoid and whatnot. *shiver*
Anybody ever read Parasite Pig by William Sleator?
Posted by aragorn64 (Member # 4204) on :
So this was really weird. Has anybody in this thread ever played Resident Evil 4? I'm playing it for the first time (Wii version) and stumbled across something this morning. There was a memo that was talking about parasites that just so happened to mention the one that makes ants stand still on leaves at night, AND that zombie snail that Juxtapose linked to.
Just thought that was kind of ironic.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
quote:Originally posted by aragorn64: So this was really weird. Has anybody in this thread ever played Resident Evil 4? I'm playing it for the first time (Wii version) and stumbled across something this morning. There was a memo that was talking about parasites that just so happened to mention the one that makes ants stand still on leaves at night, AND that zombie snail that Juxtapose linked to.
Just thought that was kind of ironic.
I thought about this very thing when I loaded up the thread for the first time. Remember don't shoot for the head in RE4 it just makes the parasites angry. Posted by The Flying Dracula Hair (Member # 10155) on :
quote:Originally posted by BlackBlade: Oh I have no problem with the idea the parasite is altering it's hosts behavior in order to increase it's own chances of survival. But if he is not seeing the birds go for the ants, then he has no evidence that the parasite wants the birds in particular to eat it.
It's not about 'wants' and 'evidence' for the parasite. It's just about survival. If other animals that the parasites can't live in eat the ants that the parasite changes, then that type of parasite dies off.
The ones who happened to change the ants a tiny bit more berry-like were better at surviving. And their young made the ants even a little more berry-like, and so on and so on.
Natural selection at its finest.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
quote:Originally posted by Javert:
quote:Originally posted by BlackBlade: Oh I have no problem with the idea the parasite is altering it's hosts behavior in order to increase it's own chances of survival. But if he is not seeing the birds go for the ants, then he has no evidence that the parasite wants the birds in particular to eat it.
It's not about 'wants' and 'evidence' for the parasite. It's just about survival. If other animals that the parasites can't live in eat the ants that the parasite changes, then that type of parasite dies off.
The ones who happened to change the ants a tiny bit more berry-like were better at surviving. And their young made the ants even a little more berry-like, and so on and so on.
Natural selection at its finest.
If the birds are NOT in fact eating the ants then you have to find a predator that is. If one cannot be found then perhaps we are misunderstanding the behavior the parasite is attempting to cause. If we understand the behavior perfectly and it just is not working, then it makes no sense to say, "Well I haven't seen anything eating the ants, but I KNOW I saw one bird take an extra long look at the ant this one time."
Posted by Javert (Member # 3076) on :
quote:Originally posted by BlackBlade: If the birds are NOT in fact eating the ants then you have to find a predator that is. If one cannot be found then perhaps we are misunderstanding the behavior the parasite is attempting to cause. If we understand the behavior perfectly and it just is not working, then it makes no sense to say, "Well I haven't seen anything eating the ants, but I KNOW I saw one bird take an extra long look at the ant this one time."
I actually just scanned the article, so serves me right if I'm wrong, but does it say that they aren't being eaten by birds more often? Or are they hypothesizing that that's the reason?
It could, of course, just be a mutation that results in this type of parasite to die out.
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
I don't recall anything in the article that conclusively proved that the parasite was causing the change in the ants. Am I just misremembering?
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