I am not a big fan of stolling the mall, but yesterday I had some time to kill, and I knew there was a bookstore inside, so I stopped into a nearby mall. (Chesterfield Mall, for the Missourians here).
There I ran across "The Christian Family Store."
My first thought was, "Talk about your niche markets. Who needs to buy a Christian Family?"
Sure, some politicians rent them out during election time, and some indicted felons use them for character witnesses. I'm sure the indicted politicians buy a few extra for emergencies. Otherwise your market would be strictly Satanists and Cannibals.
After further examination I discovered a shop full of all the neccessities of Christianity.
Wait, I thought the neccesities of Christianity were a Bible and Faith. And even the Bible is a bit optional.
Maybe neccesitites is the wrong word. How about a store filled with the paraphanelia of Christianity.
Here was a store filled with treatsies on belief, faith, and all the things a person needs to both demonstrate their beliefs and convince others to believe as well.
It made me wonder of other cultures have similar stores. Is there a Jew-Mart in Isreal? A Buddah Barn in Bangladesh? The Isla-market in Islamabad? How about Crazy Tojo's Shinto Shack?
The Aethiests, of course, have most of the stores. After all, selling and souls usually don't go together. There is a big difference between profits and prophets. Basically, religion is usually more moral, more trancendental, and in my book, more important than retail.
(We'll keep the Medieval church's practice of selling Indulgences out of this for now.)
Yet the Christian Family Store stands in the mall, between Sears and Dillards, not to far down from Victoria's Secret and The Waterbed Store. They sell Angels and Bibles, "How To Evangelize" books and "Ten Commandments" classic key chains.
(PS, Why do we always see the 10 Commandments as a list of Roman Numerals, when they way predate the Romans, not to mention their number system?)
The part that got me, though, was not the Christianity proclaimed in the store's name. I've been to other religious stores. I've had them as customers. They are good places.
Its the "Family" part.
Its the Orwellian concept that Evangalism is a family sport. A family that doesn't pray together is not a family. To leave the church is to leave your family. The bonds of religion equal -- OR ARE GREATER THAN -- the bonds of blood. It is the families responsibility to bring back wayward memebers, using whatever means possible. And that, no matter how poorly we treat our family, as long as we pray together, attend church together, wear the same Pro-Christ t-shirt, then we are a loving family.
One of my favorite sayings is:
Faith, Spirituality, and love in anything are great--especially in Religion.
Faith, Spirituality, and love missing in anything ruin it--especially religion.
However, replacing "religion" in the above with "family" is even more true.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
Christian bookstores are actually quite common.
Posted by Taalcon (Member # 839) on :
I used to work at Lifeway Christian Stores. The LifeWay (Southern Baptist Convention) people sort of looked down upon the non-denominational Family Christian Bookstores because of their decision to open up shop on Sundays.
There's a Judaica shop around the corner from my apartment. I have purchased two books from them that I am very happy to own. I will probably return at some point to shop again.
Posted by Kasie H (Member # 2120) on :
quote:It made me wonder of other cultures have similar stores. Is there a Jew-Mart in Isreal? A Buddah Barn in Bangladesh? The Isla-market in Islamabad? How about Crazy Tojo's Shinto Shack?
The Aethiests, of course, have most of the stores. After all, selling and souls usually don't go together. There is a big difference between profits and prophets. Basically, religion is usually more moral, more trancendental, and in my book, more important than retail.
(We'll keep the Medieval church's practice of selling Indulgences out of this for now.)
Yet the Christian Family Store stands in the mall, between Sears and Dillards, not to far down from Victoria's Secret and The Waterbed Store. They sell Angels and Bibles, "How To Evangelize" books and "Ten Commandments" classic key chains.
While I have little to offer in the way of commentary re: the merit of these sorts of stores, I would like to say that I thought your writing here was brilliant. Especially when you consider that Victoria's Secret has an 'Angels' collection of lingerie. Posted by Uprooted (Member # 8353) on :
quote:Originally posted by Dan_raven: The part that got me, though, was not the Christianity proclaimed in the store's name. I've been to other religious stores. I've had them as customers. They are good places.
Its the "Family" part.
I guess I just take it as "here's a place where you can buy stuff for your family that's not incompatible with the values you are trying to teach them." (buy Christian rock and DVDs for your kids, not the entertainment stuff they're selling in the other stores)
In Mormondom it's Deseret Book. I used to work in one, and was always a little conflicted about it, for just this reason:
quote: There is a big difference between profits and prophets. Basically, religion is usually more moral, more trancendental, and in my book, more important than retail.
You mentioned paraphernalia -- that's the part that gets to me. I mean, I can understand wanting to buy the books and music. It's the keychains and stickers and similar tchotkes that I never had any use for. Although I used to hate listening to that music while I worked (admittedly that was nearly 20 years ago and the quality of LDS pop has greatly improved since then).
An interesting phenomenon, this religious retail business.
Posted by Dan_raven (Member # 3383) on :
You know, I have seen and visited many stores offering Christian Music, literature, even trinkets. Most of them are great places to find all kinds of wonders, ideas, and people of faith.
I think the part that got to me was the chutzpah of the owners of this one to label it "The Christian Family Store" as if they were the only true way to Christian merchandise. They are claiming the entire Christian brand name.
Posted by Yozhik (Member # 89) on :
There's a "Jesus Book Store" in my area. That seems like borderline blasphemy to me.
Posted by Uprooted (Member # 8353) on :
quote:Originally posted by Dan_raven: They are claiming the entire Christian brand name.
Ah yes, I see your point.
I first became acquainted w/ this chain this past Christmas. My SIL told me about a certain DVD my nephew wanted, and recommended CFS to find it. I called three of them in my area, and the first two were both out of stock. The third one, about a half hour away, told me "yes, we have it." When I got there--no, they didn't. And not because it sold out between my call and my arrival, but because the clerk didn't read the inventory list carefully enough.
Oh well. He liked the basketball I got him just fine!
As for the "Jesus Book Store" -- !!
Posted by Katarain (Member # 6659) on :
The Christian Family Store is a chain. We have one around us. I don't understand your problem with the name. Christian is pretty generic (since there are many denominations of Christian) and family is something generally held to be important by Christians. I don't see how they're claiming a monopoly on either.
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
[rant]
Like any community, the religious do things to identify fellow members from non-members.
Where is the line between community member identification and worship of graven images? Idolatry is the worship of idols, like little statues of the saints? Am I missing something here? Isn't one of the points that the holy spirt fills you and you don't need an external focus? Isn't always looking to an external focus to commune with God just divorcing God from your own body?
Materialism and religion have always shared an unsteady truce, but how much, aptly named, paraphernalia do you need? Isn't religion about the internal struggle, the journey of the spirt?
Is a "Got Jesus?" bumper sticker really converting anyone?
[/rant]
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
quote:I used to work at Lifeway Christian Stores. The LifeWay (Southern Baptist Convention) people sort of looked down upon the non-denominational Family Christian Bookstores because of their decision to open up shop on Sundays.
Wow. This is literally holier-than-thou. Posted by Tante Shvester (Member # 8202) on :
Jews really do have "Jew-Marts". Our books and religious items (well, except maybe for the menorah) aren't really mainstream. So, where do you go to get your tsitsit, tefillin, tallisim, seforim, kippahs, Havdallah sets, and all that other Jew paraphernalia? Jew-Mart!
(my spellchecker is trying to catch its breath after that list)
Posted by Amanecer (Member # 4068) on :
quote: family is something generally held to be important by Christians
This type of attitude bothers me. It implies that Christians have something in their doctrine that makes them value families more than non-Christians. I do not understand how this follows. I think that family is something generally held to be important by humans. I don't see anything in Christian doctrine that makes one more likely to value families.
Posted by Eaquae Legit (Member # 3063) on :
quote:Isn't always looking to an external focus to commune with God just divorcing God from your own body?
Perhaps if done to excess, but I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with an "external focus." I find it very difficult to concentrate on prayer simply sitting in the dark by myself. I don't generally feel at all "connected" and frequently I just nod right off.
I believe that God created the material world and gave us material bodies and sense-perception. These things can't be inherently bad, nor antithetical to a spiritual experience, even worship. For me, as a Christian, I see worshipping a creation as insulting and rude, at the least, when there's a perfectly good creator in the offing. However, it doesn't mean I can't use material objects to focus my attention or to express my experience. To neglect the physical world is to split the human experience into an artificial half - spirit/mind versus body/matter. I see the two as a whole, not discrete entities. And as such, it isn't wrong to take advantage of the whole.
Added: I don't think it's meant as exclusionary, Amanecer. Simply that Christians do tend to regard family as important. Like a Venn diagram, where "Christians" and "People who regard family as important" overlap.
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
Eaquae Ledit:
While I do not agree with everything you said, I must say you have stated your opinion eloquently and respectfully and I appreciate it.
I do agree that balance is necessary and the physical world should not be overlooked as it is a large part of us.
I think that currently, the balance is tipped much too far in the direction of the physical, of the materialistic, of the literal. I believe that this country/culture would be greatly helped if it internalized more, sought not only wisdom from without, but wisdom from within.
I truly believe that life is a journey, not a destination, and as such, even if someone told you the answer to life's questions, unless you were there, walking the path, discovering the answers, that they would mean very little to you.
Posted by Jenny Gardener (Member # 903) on :
Don't Christian bookstores remind anyone else of the moneychangers in the temple that Jesus kicked out? I find the commercialization of Christianity very sickening.
Posted by KarlEd (Member # 571) on :
I don't have a problem with commercialization of Christianity. What sickens me is the Christianization of commercial ventures. I used to drive passed "Christ Auto Sales" (Your Christian Auto Dealer) on the way home from work every day. I dispise the implication that because the owner is Christian you're more likely to get a better deal at his shop.
Posted by SC Carver (Member # 8173) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jenny Gardener: Don't Christian bookstores remind anyone else of the moneychangers in the temple that Jesus kicked out? I find the commercialization of Christianity very sickening.
I agree completely. As a Christian I am torn. There are good, useful things to be found in the Christian book store like: Bibles, study guides, theological resources, ect. Some of which can’t be found elsewhere. But every time I look around at the Christian T-Shirt's, W.W.J.D. bracelets, Angel statuettes, and Bible action figures I can't help but think of Christ with a whip driving the money changers out of the temple who were only using God's name to make money.
Posted by Jenny Gardener (Member # 903) on :
Right. One of the reasons I had issues with being Christian (at least Christian in the way people practice in my area) is this terrible schism between what is preached and what is done. The generosity, compassion, humility, etc. of Christ, if actually practiced, would be considered foolish, naive, or perhaps harmful. What I see practiced is judgmentalism, divisiveness, and exclusion.
Posted by Taalcon (Member # 839) on :
Moneychangers in the Temple were making profits off of compulsory ordinances for the remission of sins.
Bookstores are making profits off people who want to wear Jesus Fish on their cars. Slightly different scenarios.
Posted by Stephan (Member # 7549) on :
quote:Originally posted by KarlEd: I don't have a problem with commercialization of Christianity. What sickens me is the Christianization of commercial ventures. I used to drive passed "Christ Auto Sales" (Your Christian Auto Dealer) on the way home from work every day. I dispise the implication that because the owner is Christian you're more likely to get a better deal at his shop.
Agreed. Private owners have a right to be that way, but how much business sense does it make? I walked into an auto repair shop once and saw a Jesus statue with "Have you been saved?" literature all over the place. They didn't get my business.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
quote:But every time I look around at the Christian T-Shirt's, W.W.J.D. bracelets, Angel statuettes, and Bible action figures I can't help but think of Christ with a whip driving the money changers out of the temple who were only using God's name to make money.
Which is it that bothers you -- that people would put religious messages in bracelets, statuettes, and action figures, or that they don't give them away for free?
Posted by SC Carver (Member # 8173) on :
It’s a hard line to define. Some people's spiritual growth may be helped by these things and if so they are good.
I have no problem with putting religious messages on things. It’s more the Marketing of Jesus that bothers me. Especially if you get the feeling they are only including the message to make a buck.
There can be an implied message, if you are a good Christian then you will buy this "Christian" version of whatever it is.
Posted by BaoQingTian (Member # 8775) on :
quote:Originally posted by Amanecer:
quote: family is something generally held to be important by Christians
This type of attitude bothers me. It implies that Christians have something in their doctrine that makes them value families more than non-Christians. I do not understand how this follows. I think that family is something generally held to be important by humans. I don't see anything in Christian doctrine that makes one more likely to value families.
You may already know this, but the family is of paramount importance to the LDS faith, and we worship Christ. TheProclaimation to the World details some of our beliefs about the family's importance if you care to read it. We believe that the family is an eternal unit. So if one believes that the family is important not only in this world, but for eternity, that would be something in our doctrine that makes us likely to value families.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
quote:I have no problem with putting religious messages on things. It’s more the Marketing of Jesus that bothers me. Especially if you get the feeling they are only including the message to make a buck.
So if the stuff was all given away for free, would you have no problems with it?
If they sold it but didn't do any marketing, would it still bother you?
If they marketed it and sold it but gave all of the profits to charity, would it still bother you?
Posted by Dan_raven (Member # 3383) on :
I believe its playing to the Pharise. Its great to walk around wearing Christ's bling-bling. But that can not be mistaken for true faith and belief.
The question I ask is whom are they trying to convince, me or themselves.
Christians should identify each other by their behavior, not their marketing slogans.
Posted by SC Carver (Member # 8173) on :
No problem with giving it away. People can accept or reject it.
I don't think these companies do that much marketing, but they definitely have a core market in mind when making the products.
My ill feelings may come from a few people who act like they are better people because they only listen to "Christian" music or read "Christian" books. That goes back to the judgmentalism, divisiveness, and exclusion that J. Gardener was talking about.
Of course I have problems with the entire sub-cultural Christianity thing when people try to separate themselves from society. Christ called us to be a light on a hill. Its hard to do that if you never interact with other groups of society.
Dan I agree. There should be more of a difference between believers and non-believer than the T-shirts they wear.
Posted by Belle (Member # 2314) on :
quote:I agree. There should be more of a difference between believers and non-believer than the T-shirts they wear.
Of course there should be. But people like to belong, they like to identify themselves. Some people want to wear Christian t-shirts because they like identifying themselves because their faith is an important part of who they are, and wearing that t-shirt is a way of proclaiming that to the world. I don't see a single thing wrong with that.
I don't think on judgment day God is going to ask me how many "God is Rad, He's my Dad" bumper stickers I put on my car.
But I've shopped Christian Family stores and LifeWay and others because I can get things there that I can't get anywhere else. Usually books and music. Most of the time they aren't available in regular bookstores or in libraries, and that's the only place I can get them. So I think the stores serve a valuable function, they provide access to hard-to-find products to the community. One thing you are also overlooking is that these stores carry curricula, and many churches use them as sources for their Bible Studies and classes and children's programs. Not to mention Christian homeschool families use them often.
Posted by Dan_raven (Member # 3383) on :
I wonder if there is a connection between what we are discussing with the large number of "Christian _____" spam I've been getting. From Christian Mortgages to Christian dating, about 10% of the gunk in my spam filter is trying to sell me something with the Christian monicker on it.
Oh, and like I said, Christian stores are not my big problem, though I am curious if other cultures have similar stores. Its the name they use I find amusing.
Posted by advice for robots (Member # 2544) on :
quote:Originally posted by Amanecer:
quote: family is something generally held to be important by Christians
This type of attitude bothers me. It implies that Christians have something in their doctrine that makes them value families more than non-Christians. I do not understand how this follows. I think that family is something generally held to be important by humans. I don't see anything in Christian doctrine that makes one more likely to value families.
It's not that somehow family isn't important to non-Christians. It's that Christians might put family above a lot of other considerations or argue for "family values" over other things.
Posted by Tante Shvester (Member # 8202) on :
quote:Originally posted by Taalcon: Bookstores are making profits off people who want to wear Jesus Fish on their cars.
Just saying.
Posted by narrativium (Member # 3230) on :
quote:Originally posted by Tante Shvester: Jews really do have "Jew-Marts". Our books and religious items (well, except maybe for the menorah) aren't really mainstream. So, where do you go to get your tsitsit, tefillin, tallisim, seforim, kippahs, Havdallah sets, and all that other Jew paraphernalia? Jew-Mart!
(my spellchecker is trying to catch its breath after that list)
I think you killed it.
Posted by Will B (Member # 7931) on :
I don't suppose the "got jesus?" bumpersticker converts anyone to Christianity, but then the "got root?" sticker on my computer probably doesn't convert anyone to Unix.
Posted by JennaDean (Member # 8816) on :
Even within the Christian community, smaller groups have their own stores. We've got an LDS publishing company and LDS bookstores that sell stuff specifically to the LDS market. Some of it is invaluable, some of it is inspirational, and some of it is just "fluff" - Nephi action figures. But I don't see anything wrong with the fluff - if they're going to play with action figures, what's wrong with playing scripture stories in addition to superheroes? If they're going to wear jewelry with messages on it, why not a message to remind them to "Choose the Right" or "What Would Jesus Do?" Doesn't bother me. I don't waste my money on most of it, but I don't think the production of items to make living your faith easier is a bad thing.
Posted by Jenny Gardener (Member # 903) on :
It's not the stores and goods so much that bother me. It's the subculture, I'm sure. The people who look down their noses at Christians who don't feel the need to wear the t-shirts, or who listen to non-Christian music. And what really gets me is a talk show I heard on Christian radio (sometimes I listen to see if I'm really missing out on anything) where a young woman in desperate need of assurance and help had her issues touched on in a very shallow way and then the speakers went on to promote their literature. Nearly every broadcast or television program is a vehicle for that preacher's tapes or books. It's a lot like using t.v. shows to market toys. Both practices make me feel yucky.
Posted by Belle (Member # 2314) on :
Jenny, I know exactly how you feel.
One reason I don't write in the inspirational market anymore, despite my early success in it, is the commercialization of it. I'm sick of the same things you are, of people who seem to be more concerned with profit than with spreading a genuine message.
I know that even in my own church I'll probably be looked down upon for writing fiction, particularly fantasy fiction, but you know what? I don't believe that God only respects our work if it's supposedly "Christian" or inspirational. I think that anything I do, if I do it to the glory of God and for the right reasons, is pleasing to Him.
Posted by Jenny Gardener (Member # 903) on :
Belle, you are following a tradition that has the potential to inspire so many people. Your writing will always reflect the beauty and power of your faith, no matter what world it is set in. I think that more people are inspired to do what is right and good by following the examples of their heroes in literature and life than are moved by "inspirational" writing that is more like Mommy telling you what to do. You are one passionate Christian woman, and I continue to admire you.
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