Sigh. My GoogleFu is sadly lacking in this area. I can't find anything I'm looking for. I've also tried MesoWeb, and no luck there either. I'm pretty sure it's my search terms...
In MesoAmerica (I can never remember if it was Aztec or Mayan or Incan, so I'm using that as a catch-all name), there were a number of villages/towns where all the people disappeared. No known reasons. Bread left in the ovens, food on the table, that sort of thing as if, in the middle of a normal day, they just decided to up and leave.
What are the names of those villages/towns? And where I can find more information on them?
Anyone?
Anyone?
And for that matter, if any of y'all know of other places where this happened, please feel free to post that as well. It's all for story research.
Thanks!
Posted by cheiros do ender (Member # 8849) on :
I'm pretty sure it was the Olmecs. I'll get more information in a second.
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Yay for Cheiros!
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
Are you talking about the Anasazi?
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Yeah, the Anasazi jumped to mind.
Though I don't really know much about them, all I remember comes from a few episodes of Johnny Quest.
Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
I ahve wanted to go there and see that site since I was about 10.
Now that my parents have retired fairly close to their (at least compared to where we have lived all of my life) I will probebly get to see it.
My wife is a history geek too, thank God. Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Let me be a bit more clear...
I wasn't talking about an entire civilization disappearing, although that's interesting, too. I was thinking along the lines of individual villages/towns/cities where the occupants of that village/et cetera ad nauseum just up and left one day.
Is that more clear?
Posted by cheiros do ender (Member # 8849) on :
You're right about google not being any help. Everything there seems to be a comparison/contrast to the Mayan culture, and never specifically about the Olmecs.
So the only other place I could think of looking was wikipedia:
quote:Decline It is not known with any clarity what happened to this culture. Their main center, San Lorenzo, was all but abandoned around 900 BC, and La Venta became the main city. Environmental changes may have been responsible for this move, with certain important rivers changing course. However, there is also some evidence suggestive of an invasion and destruction of Olmec artifacts around this time. Around 400 BC, La Venta also came to an end, although the importance of the ceremonial complexes apparently outlasted the Olmec state or culture. Within a few hundred years of the abandonment of their last cities, successor cultures had become firmly established in their former lands – most notably the Maya to the east, the Zapotec to the southwest, and the Teotihuacan culture to the west.
So my guess is the city you were talking about was San Lorenzo, which I'm now looking up on google. Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
My parents retired to Casa Grande, which was named after the ruins of the Hohokam found there.
There isn't a lot of information online that I can find about either Casa Grande or the Hohokam, the people who occupied it. So far, the only useful information I've found about them, other than from Kwea's link (thanks! ) is from VirtualTourist (and not a whole lot there, either) and an AmericanSouthwest link.
I'm still checking the rest of the suggestions y'all have provided. Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
quote:they end up abandoning their magnificent architecture and permanent homes to migrate hundreds of miles and seemingly lose their cultural identities in Hopiland, Zuni and the pueblos of the Upper Río Grande?
Thanks, anyway. Unless there is a specific community where the people disappeared and it's not known where?
Posted by cheiros do ender (Member # 8849) on :
"Unless there is a specific community where the people disappeared and it's not known where?"
The People of San Lorenzo fit this perfectly. Quid, if there's no explanation as to why the people that your thinking of left, then how can it, just an event that's happened many other places in history, be any more helpful than any of the one's whose disappearances are explained?
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
I'm looking for info on San Lorenzo.
And cheiros, it's because, in my story, I have the disappearance explained. I write scifi. And that's why I need people who've disappeared mysteriously.
Clear as mud?
Posted by cheiros do ender (Member # 8849) on :
Oh, much clearer than mud. Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Oh excellent!
And, um, any links that you find that are useful, please pass on. Thanks!
(The story's been fermenting for a few years, but recent collaborations with Fahim have caused it to take sudden and unexpected - and much more fun and interesting - turns, so this story is one that wants to get told sooner rather than later. But. I need a setting. At the same time, depending on my research, I might end up writing a bunch more related ones. Because that can also be fun.)
Posted by cheiros do ender (Member # 8849) on :
I've been spending a lot of time looking into Mormon and Atlantian perspectives on the history of them area, but realised they probably wouldn't be much use to you. So I'm now going to focus directly on San Lorenzo, posting useful links, notes and books here as I find them:
A book about Olmec culture (only read, if you choose to, in the case that you decide San Lorenzo is suitable.)
I don't know what "breaking it" is, but I hope that helps.
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
cheiros, honey, you broke it!
Do you know how to make shorter urls? You can use tinyurl.com (which I don't use myself because people can hide any kind of side in a tinyurl) or you can embed the url in the text. Go to Full Reply Form to do that.
Alright, I'll check out the links. Unfortunately Fahim is now nagging me to read a short story of his that he's just finished completely rewriting and he won't lend me his GoogleFu essence until I've read it. Blackmailer! Vagabond!
*sigh*
I've got such a tough life. Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Breaking it = making it so wide I have to use the scroll bar at the bottom in order to read everything.
Thanks, it's fixed and I'm heppy. Posted by Shigosei (Member # 3831) on :
Disappeared, eh? Well, if you can't find the information you need on missing Mesoamericans, there's always the Roanoke colony.
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
True. I'd forgotten about them. *adds one more thing to the list of things to research* Posted by mackillian (Member # 586) on :
and the Red Paint People.
(I'm also working on a story like yours O_O)
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Uh oh.
Posted by mackillian (Member # 586) on :
I think the only thing they probably have in common is disappearing mesoamerican people. I'm fairly certain that we don't have them disappearing for the same reason.
Posted by theCrowsWife (Member # 8302) on :
Hey, quid, you still interested in the Casa Grande ruins? That's only about two hours from where I live, and I've never been. If you want I can check it out, get pictures, etc. There are probably also locally published books about it. I could see if I could find any if you want.
Note: Two hours might seem like a lot to some people, but this is desert sprawl we're talking about here. My sister-in-law and I both live about a mile from Tucson city limits, yet it takes about 45 minutes (on the freeway!) to get to her place from here.
--Mel
Posted by lem (Member # 6914) on :
Sorry for the tangent, but this thread makes me want to play civilization. I can't wait till work is over. Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
mack - still, it's a pretty funny thought, ya know?
Mel - I don't know. Let me do some more research and figure out what will best suite the story, and once I have that figured out, I'll let you know. Having said that, though, if you happen to be going there anyway, then please. I'm always a geek for photos and info on ruins and stuff. The problem with Casa Grande so far is that there doesn't seem to be a lot of info on the internet about the place, so it's difficult to tell right now whether it would work or how. That it's thought to be an astronomical observatory does have certain... well, it appeals, if not for this story, then for others.
lem - yeah, I hear you. Completely.
Posted by mackillian (Member # 586) on :
Oh, it IS funny.
I also thought HEY! I did days of using GoogleFu to find all my information and quid goes straight to the Rack!.
Certainly shows who is smarter and it sure isn't me.
Posted by cheiros do ender (Member # 8849) on :
GoogleFu?
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Oh, yeah. GoogleFu. It's a well-known word. Haven't you heard of it before?
mack - you're hilarious! Um, thing is, I tried doing research and couldn't find what I wanted. It just shows that I gave up sooner. But I like the way you put it better. Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
I will be going to the Casa Grande ruins when I visit my parents, although I don't know when that will be. Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Alright. Anyone who's going to any kind of MesoAmerican ruins and will be photographing it, please let me know! If you've already been, please let me know! Yes, I want all pictures!
And I suspect mack might have a few requests, too. mack, are you writing at the Red Paint people? (I haven't researched them at all yet.) Or some other group?
And does anyone else have any more useful ideas or links? Anyone? Anyone?
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
I think my mom went to some in Colorado with my brother. I can ask if she has pictures and/or information (she might have picked up a book, and I'm pretty sure she took photos, and we have a scanner. )
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Mel, those links are fascinating! I might want. Let me do more research and get back to you.
See, one thing I hate doing is inconveniencing people, and I would hate for you or anyone else to go to a lot of trouble if I'm not even sure I'm going to use the material. So I'll figure it out first. You're terrific! Posted by theCrowsWife (Member # 8302) on :
Too late! I saw that I already had several pictures on my computer, so I went ahead and scanned the rest. In addition to ruins, would you also like pictures of unusual desert rock formations? I also have some photos with water in them, so you can see how the desert vegetation is affected by standing water (not much, except right next to it). These other pictures might help you get a feel for the kind of environment your disappearing people lived in.
I'm just excited to share my knowledge. I've lived in Arizona for almost 15 years; it's nice to actually use some of that experience.
--Mel
Posted by human_2.0 (Member # 6006) on :
Um... Anasazi were in Utah. That is pretty far from where the Mayans were.
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Well, alrighty then!
Um, this is where I admit that I'm perpetually interested in anything/everything archaeological and anthropological and otherwise interesting, bizarre, or unusual? In other words, yes, and context is always good!
Yowsa, Mel! You're the best! My email addy is in my profile. Feel free to use it. Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
Well, yeah, so is Colorado and Arizona. She was interested in several types of ruins, if I'm not mistaken...
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Oh, human, yeah, I think we know. Don't worry, I won't be putting the Anasazi into, you know, Belize or anything silly like that.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
I just thought of something! I was at my mom's the other day and was searching the shelves for something to read, having finished her "Number One Ladies Detective Agency" books, and on my way to finding a novel came across a book of "true unexplained mysteries" or something aimed at pre-teens from when I was a kid. There was something about a disappearing city, or rather, a town where the people just vanished, in that book, if I'm not mistaken. I'll check it out next time I'm over there and see if it might be useful to you. Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
Roanoake, VA? Posted by theCrowsWife (Member # 8302) on :
Hey, quid, did you get my email?
--Mel
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Mel,
I did. I meant to respond, but I've had a lot of stuff going on and long days. I'll fire off an email to you tomorrow. And you're a peach. Posted by theCrowsWife (Member # 8302) on :
Oh, no worries. I just had issues getting gmail to upload the files, so I wasn't sure if it had gone through properly.
Get some sleep
--Mel
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Easier said than done. I'm wide, wide, wide awake. Have been since about 1:30am. It's now... 3:30am.
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Fahim is now nagging me to read a short story of his that he's just finished completely rewriting and he won't lend me his GoogleFu essence until I've read it. ![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
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