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Posted by lem (Member # 6914) on :
 
I heard that Americans only pay 1/4 for gas then the rest of the world because our Gov. subisdizes our oil consumption. Is it true we only pay 1/4th? Is it true that the Gov. Subsidizes our oil consumption?

Where can I go to get hard data to back this up?

If it is true, why should the gov. raise gas tax to cut back back our use of oil? WHy not just stop subsidizing it and let a free market dictate behavior?

just wondering....

[ March 27, 2005, 01:26 PM: Message edited by: lem ]
 
Posted by Zamphyr (Member # 6213) on :
 
I think its closer to 1/3 world price; highest I've seen mentioned in another forum was Holland @ $6.94/g.

Yes, the govt. subsidizes, don't know how much. I always try to check Cato Inst. or other libertarian-type sources as they hate govt. spending on "non-essentials".

We subsidize oil for the same reasons McDonalds & Microsoft can get govt. cash - we like US companies to do well overseas.
 
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
 
In my travels, much of the world pays per liter what we pay per gallon, so yes, about 4x as much as we do.

With recent gas price hikes here in the states, that ratio may have changed somewhat.

As for government subsidies, I doubt it. I think that other countries are tacking on fees, or their oil companies must gouge consumers there more than ours do here.
 
Posted by jack (Member # 2083) on :
 
This is probably some wacko-nut jobs but they seem to have researched the tax laws, at least.

http://www.distributiondrive.com/Article4.html

quote:
This report by the International Center for Technology Assessment (CTA) identifies and quantifies the many external costs of using motor vehicles and the internal combustion engine that are not reflected in the retail price Americans pay for gasoline. These are costs that consumers pay indirectly by way of increased taxes, insurance costs, and retail prices in other sectors.

The report divides the external costs of gasoline usage into five primary areas: (1) Tax Subsidization of the Oil Industry; (2) Government Program Subsidies; (3) Protection Costs Involved in Oil Shipment and Motor Vehicle Services; (4) Environmental, Health, and Social Costs of Gasoline Usage; and (5) Other Important Externalities of Motor Vehicle Use. Together, these external costs total $558.7 billion to $1.69 trillion per year, which, when added to the retail price of gasoline, result in a per gallon price of $5.60 to $15.14.

TAX SUBSIDIES - $9.1 to $17.8 billion.

The federal government provides the oil industry with numerous tax breaks designed to ensure that domestic companies can compete with international producers and that gasoline remains cheap for American consumers. Federal tax breaks that directly benefit oil companies include: the Percentage Depletion Allowance (a subsidy of $784 million to $1 billion per year), the Nonconventional Fuel Production Credit ($769 to $900 million), immediate expensing of exploration and development costs ($200 to $255 million), the Enhanced Oil Recovery Credit ($26.3 to $100 million), foreign tax credits ($1.11 to $3.4 billion), foreign income deferrals ($183 to $318 million), and accelerated depreciation allowances ($1.0 to $4.5 billion).


It goes on from there. The tax subsidies is by far the cheapest of what they consider subsidies. Take if for what it's worth. The tax breaks might be real and concrete but some of the "environmental, health and social costs" had me rolling my eyes, so I can only imagine what others would think of it.

Here's a ton of information from the DOE.

http://www.eia.doe.gov/oiaf/servicerpt/subsidy/introduction.html

quote:
Studies of energy subsidies have varied widely in purpose, scope, definition, and methods of estimation (see Appendix A). For instance, because the U.S. Government raises and spends vast sums of money on transportation infrastructure projects, studies that view transportation spending as an energy subsidy tend to have larger estimates of subsidies than those that do not. Similarly, because the Government spends large sums of money on defense, studies that view military spending--whether directed toward the Persian Gulf or elsewhere--as energy subsidies also tend to produce considerably larger estimates than those that do not.

There are other ways in which the scope of energy subsidies can be broadened. For instance, one study completed in the mid-1980s concluded that subsidies to the U.S. electricity industry amounted to $80 billion per year because of the U.S. regulatory practice of pricing electricity at average rather than marginal cost. (6) Another study estimated subsidies to U.S. motor gasoline producers alone at $84 billion per year, based on the inclusion of such costs as defense-related expenditures and energy-related health care costs. (7)


Okay, I'm having a hard time believing them either. http://www.eia.doe.gov/oiaf/servicerpt/subsidy/executive_summary.html

quote:
A subsidy amount of $4 billion or $5 billion is, in general, too small to have a significant effect on the overall level of energy prices and consumption in the United States;
Not that I have a problem with point of view, it's just that I have a hard time believing that 4-5 billion is the whole ball of subsidy wax.

Anyway, you should be able to gorge yourself on information from those sites and their appendixes.

[edited for content no longer needed as problem was fixed. Can re-edit again iffin ya want.]

[ March 27, 2005, 07:58 PM: Message edited by: jack ]
 
Posted by lem (Member # 6914) on :
 
Thank you Jack! No wonder I was getting no results on google. lol

Darn my speling!
 


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