I'm back into playing EVE-O again and in a corp with a friend of mine working towards piloting super capitols I was wondering if anyone currently plays who frequests Hatrack if so it would be grand if we played togather.
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Sorry I still haven't beaten Trade Wars 2002 when I'm done with that maybe I'll take a look at your new game. Posts: 14316 | Registered: Jul 2005
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I think he knows that....
Posts: 15082 | Registered: Jul 2001
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Blayne Bradley
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I have.
Yes I know I have no life.
Edit: Just in case, I am joking I have actually never heard of the game before but if its anything like Elite then I know that the Universe would decay and collapse from entropy before on completes it.
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I'm not sure you can call EVE role-playing, really. Because when you're roleplaying someone doing menial grind work for money by doing menial grind work for imaginary money, does it matter that you're just pretending you're in space while you do it?
I mean, by that logic, you could do sandwich assembly at Burger King and -- as long as you pretended you were on a space station, putting together space-burgers -- it'd be a game.Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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It's roleplaying because EVE is a graphically intensive spreadsheet.
Posts: 15421 | Registered: Aug 2005
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Blayne Bradley
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quote:Originally posted by TomDavidson: I'm not sure you can call EVE role-playing, really. Because when you're roleplaying someone doing menial grind work for money by doing menial grind work for imaginary money, does it matter that you're just pretending you're in space while you do it?
I mean, by that logic, you could do sandwich assembly at Burger King and -- as long as you pretended you were on a space station, putting together space-burgers -- it'd be a game.
Its so much more then that, it has one of the greatest PVP systems ever developed and one of the most indepth player driven economies concieved. The Alliance/Corporation Warfare is the most intents game play concepts ever seen. The menial "grind" is optional and convenient you can hop in a frigate with 2 dozen other friends in frigates and actually blow up people who've played the games for years.
Mining is easily done on the side, you can read a book, check your email do other stuff as you mine paying attention only when you need to, mission running... not so much but there's alot of strategy involved in it, I spent a long time equiping my battleship to survive any level 4 mission as I go AFK. And soon I'll be joining a 0.0 Alliance where it will be pvp'ing all the time and its easy to make money in a corporation.
The game has a steep learning curve but its all about joining the right corp if you want to see/do stuff "soon".
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Blayne Bradley
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Also if I am not mistaken Tom you think any online game is a waste of time.
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I think most MMOs are a waste of time, sure. Whenever you're spending a "long time" to ensure that the game can play itself while you're away from it, something's gone wrong.
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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quote: Its so much more then that...[it has]..one of the most indepth player driven economies concieved.
In Tom's Burgar King analogy real life has a much more in depth player driven economy, has just as much grind, and you can actually take your money and buy other real things. It has all the benefits of EVE-Online with an additional 10% employee discount on Whoppers with Cheese. Posts: 2445 | Registered: Oct 2004
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Blayne Bradley
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But can you fly a Thanatos class carrier as a part of a fleet invading someone elses land siezing their assets blowing up their miners and in generally fight the most intense pvp engagements ever?
I thought so.
Tom, its like arguing why person A likes a hamburger over a hotdog while YOUR a vegetarian arguing eating meat is murder, what is one supposed to do in this case nothing I or anyone else who plays these games can ever convince you of otherwise ever.
In EVE the loss of equipment in general once you get to where I am at is irreplaceable and since I can't pay attention to something for more then 5 seconds it stands to reason why i would like to make a tank that cant be broken 99% of the time by NPCs and let my AI drones handle the work.
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My husband plays EVE, but I have no idea what his character name is or anything like that. I think he plays the game 'cause it's got great graphics & he likes blowing ships up.
You must admit, Tom, real life isn't as flashy & full of explosives as the video games.
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Blayne Bradley
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Jhai when you can per chance can you ask for his screen name? Be nice to get some hatrackers together.
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Heh. Lotta EVE-hate 'round these parts isn't there?
He asked if anyone plays. No need to jump on him that you don't like it and don't play it as a result.
And Samp, I don't consider myself to have ever ground out a thing in EVE so far, and I've not bought isk, nor do I ever intend to. If I'm enjoying what I'm doing, then it's not a grind. If it becomes a grind, then I'll stop. I play mmo's to enjoy myself and a little socializing with friends that doesn't require me to travel to see them. If it's not enjoyable, there's no point to it, especially not with the recurring monthly cost.
Posts: 1323 | Registered: Aug 2001
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quote:I don't consider myself to have ever ground out a thing in EVE so far
That's because you're personally defining grind based on whether or not you actively dislike it. it's repetitious activity to advance / unlock other features in the game.
If I killed 1875 saltwater crocolisks in one day in order to advance a battlegrounds tier and unlock alterac valley that is a grind regardless as to whether or not I enjoy killing saltwater crocolisks. If I mine and/or automate trade routes in order to get enough ISK and gear to upgrade to using a battlecruiser etc etc etc
Posts: 15421 | Registered: Aug 2005
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Blayne Bradley
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Except your completely ignorant of how EVE works Samp which is why you also lack credibility to bash the game we enjoy, you do not have to grind in EVE, you cannot buy ISK either CCP watches this like a hawk and will ban your account or will remove the same amount of isk from your wallet even if you bought stuff with the money putting you into the negative.
You can live in the game 100% off of PVP from looting from the wrecks of player ships you have destroyed.
Magson whats your character name in game Mine is Shi Lang.
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quote:Originally posted by Blayne Bradley: Eve is in no way an addictive game it is 70% of the time a mind numbinfly BORING game. The remaining 30% however of combating ppl in space ships makes it worthwhile to pay to play. the 70% is usually spent moving your ship on automatically preset routes through many star systems or spending hours sitting around mining. Though my second moniter at least gives me the bonus of being able to cha and surf the net.
quote:Except your completely ignorant of how EVE works Samp which is why you also lack credibility to bash the game we enjoy, you do not have to grind in EVE, you cannot buy ISK either
If you actually believe that you can't buy ISK then you are really, really naive.
Secondly, I'm actually not ignorant of how EVE works, though I think it's totally charming how you invariably use this sort of thing as a counter against people you perceive as attacking the games you like; they must just 'be ignorant' of it. I actually played it until the crappiness of the GUI removed all my interest in the game. It also suffers from unfixable lag which defines fleet battles and causes the titan superweapons to be a critically unmanaged game balance issue, you need more POSs than the other side to keep Sov and thus control over station systems thus making late eve a space variant of ZERG WARZ. There was also the Kugutsumen/BoB drama which made the game environment a pit of neckbeard rage from which there was no return.
Wait, but I apparently am completely ignorant of how eve works. I must just be making up words. Shame, that.
Besides, I've listened to you talk about how fantastically tedious EVE is. Are you arguing with yourself now, or .. what?
/edit -- beaten to it
/second edit -- oh my god look at that quote.
Posts: 15421 | Registered: Aug 2005
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Blayne Bradley
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And.... so what? I enjoy the game, I enjoy it moreso now that I have more of my friends playing, what's your intention here bashing EVE do you want to try to get other people to not play it?
Isk buying is not a plausible move if CCP catches you your character is as good as useless until you can get back out of debt, selling time cards doesn't count.
And the "lag" has gotten significantly better, lag is fixable lag is always fixable just not as conveniently as you want it to.
Also the quote doesn't do anything, I didn't say i didn't grind, I however do feel the grinding I do currently is far more rewarding then the grinding in other MMO's and I can stop any time hop into my Hyperion and hunt down pirates.
All MMO's have flaws, I happen to like the ones that aren't clones of World of Warcraft. I am here asking who plays or who is interested in playing I did NOT ask for Uncylopedia's wiki of EVE.
Hmm, since you've implied to stop playing EVE and I geuss permanantly so can I buy your account?
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Blayne Bradley
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Ultimately it comes down to the fact I like multitasking, EVE lets me multitask and gives me an excuse to use 3 computers and some 6 screens to do everything I want.
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If I didn't have to pay for it, I would play in an instant.
Posts: 1594 | Registered: Apr 2006
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Blayne Bradley
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In theory you don't have to if your successful enough at the game in game you can use ingame currency to pay for your account from people who used real money to buy the time cards from CCP.
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quote:And.... so what? I enjoy the game, I enjoy it moreso now that I have more of my friends playing, what's your intention here bashing EVE do you want to try to get other people to not play it?
I don't actively dislike eve. Even though I have no personal interest in playing the game anymore and have not for a long time, it's one of those games that's fun to hear stories about.
My intention here is, obviously, to talk about eve. In the case of this thread, I've mostly pointed out when you personally are saying things that are completely wrong about eve, such as saying "you cannot buy ISK" or defensively claiming I'm completely ignorant about eve.
Posts: 15421 | Registered: Aug 2005
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Blayne Bradley
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your not talking about eve your bashing eve, and yes I am right you cannot buy isk, buying isk gets your account negative what you bought in the red, I am using cannot in the same sense as "you cannot cross the street you will die".
Even if you had played EVE your acting like someone who is completely ignorant of it through your continued bashing of it and your whining about how much grinding is done, grinding is only a fast way or easy way to make isk it is not the ONLY way there are dozens of ways to make isk and have fun my particular play style is simply the safer route.
When I say grinding is optional I am completely right and the others who've played posted to that effect.
quote:The only way that grind is optional in EVE is if you purchase your assets outright with real money.
This is what you said, this is completely wrong.
quote: That's because you're personally defining grind based on whether or not you actively dislike it. it's repetitious activity to advance / unlock other features in the game.
This is subjective and ASSUMES we are doing only grinding to make money and somehow fooling ourself otherwise your being a pretensious. Piracy, PVP'ing, manufacturing and to an extant trading can all make money although there is a significantly higher risk factor then with missions or mining.
quote: If you actually believe that you can't buy ISK then you are really, really naive.
Once more I will reiterate, buying isk from isk farmers gets ones account banned at worst or unplayable at best.
quote: Secondly, I'm actually not ignorant of how EVE works, though I think it's totally charming how you invariably use this sort of thing as a counter against people you perceive as attacking the games you like; they must just 'be ignorant' of it. I actually played it until the crappiness of the GUI removed all my interest in the game. It also suffers from unfixable lag which defines fleet battles and causes the titan superweapons to be a critically unmanaged game balance issue, you need more POSs than the other side to keep Sov and thus control over station systems thus making late eve a space variant of ZERG WARZ. There was also the Kugutsumen/BoB drama which made the game environment a pit of neckbeard rage from which there was no return.
All of these complaints invalidated with recent patches and either way have no bearing as you can choose not to engage in a fleet battle you can just mauraude around with smaller gangs.
My in earlier threads commenting on the tediousness of EVE is not a complaint, I like how EVE generally requires little to no time commitment allowing me to focus on either making money ingame or getting work done, I dont have to grind an ionsufferable amount of mobs just to match the big boys.
EVE > WoW
My point stands your not giving an informed discussion on EVE but rather bashing it as the tards on the Uncyclopedia page did before the page mysteriously dissappeared.
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quote:Once more I will reiterate, buying isk from isk farmers gets ones account banned at worst or unplayable at best.
I know five people who sell ISK to players / buy ISK / trade ISK and two more who just run macro mining operations. Anecdote alone disproves you; I don't even need to reference multiple statistics on the amount of ISK that's traded for cash. GM's beg openly in blogs for people to stop casually buying cash from ISK farmers because the scope of it is larger than they can address, similar to every other widely popular MMORPG on the market.
If someday in the future all five of them get teh banz for openly dealing in ISK then I'll give your notion some credit. Presently, I know you're being naive and it fits with your general m.o.; you're a fanboy.
quote:All of these complaints invalidated with recent patches and either way have no bearing as you can choose not to engage in a fleet battle
No. These complaints are not invalidated with recent patches; they never have been. Just because you have the option of personally not participating in a huge POS crunch does not mean that people aren't allowed to complain that if they do want to participate in that part of the game, they're playing with a framerate so low it might as well be a powerpoint presentation. Eve STILL has the lag/desynch wildcard and it STILL annihlates fleets occasionally with the use of titan superweapons. Even titans aren't safe. A few have died to lag and this is a real issue when a titan is an ingame asset representing months of corp grind.
quote:This is subjective and ASSUMES we are doing only grinding to make money and somehow fooling ourself otherwise your being a pretensious.
'what does this even mean' can't even cover this. or the part where you obliquely reference Uncyclopedia. let's fight some more over eve. hurry. bash on me faster. fasterPosts: 15421 | Registered: Aug 2005
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I had a friends once who played EVE, and he was pretty into it. In fact, he was so into it, he ignored me and the movies we were watching to screw around with whatever.
From what I could see over his shoulder, the graphics were pretty intense. I don't know if it's something I'd like to do, though.
Posts: 3932 | Registered: Sep 1999
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Blayne Bradley
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quote:Originally posted by Samprimary:
quote:Once more I will reiterate, buying isk from isk farmers gets ones account banned at worst or unplayable at best.
I know five people who sell ISK to players / buy ISK / trade ISK and two more who just run macro mining operations. Anecdote alone disproves you; I don't even need to reference multiple statistics on the amount of ISK that's traded for cash. GM's beg openly in blogs for people to stop casually buying cash from ISK farmers because the scope of it is larger than they can address, similar to every other widely popular MMORPG on the market.
If someday in the future all five of them get teh banz for openly dealing in ISK then I'll give your notion some credit. Presently, I know you're being naive and it fits with your general m.o.; you're a fanboy.
quote:All of these complaints invalidated with recent patches and either way have no bearing as you can choose not to engage in a fleet battle
No. These complaints are not invalidated with recent patches; they never have been. Just because you have the option of personally not participating in a huge POS crunch does not mean that people aren't allowed to complain that if they do want to participate in that part of the game, they're playing with a framerate so low it might as well be a powerpoint presentation. Eve STILL has the lag/desynch wildcard and it STILL annihlates fleets occasionally with the use of titan superweapons. Even titans aren't safe. A few have died to lag and this is a real issue when a titan is an ingame asset representing months of corp grind.
quote:This is subjective and ASSUMES we are doing only grinding to make money and somehow fooling ourself otherwise your being a pretensious.
'what does this even mean' can't even cover this. or the part where you obliquely reference Uncyclopedia. let's fight some more over eve. hurry. bash on me faster. faster
Your acting like the paragon of pretentiousness, anedotal evidence is not even close to statistical evidence, just because some devs complain about it doesn't mean that the market is being flooded with isk buyers/sellers/etc, I have just as much anectdotal evidence if not more then you that people do regularily get their accounts banned or get what they bought and the isk they bought removed from the game.
And once more the complaints about grinding, so what? Grinding is whats in eery MMO its what keeps people playing however eve is different in the sense that it is optional, it is possible to succeed without grinding and you have failed to admit this.
You are being pretentious, you are being rude, you are just here to bash a game you obviously currently dislike and have no interest in actually discussing the merits of the game, you have not said a single positive thing about it and are acting against the very reason why this thread exists I am simply asking who plays and whose interested in playing I did not ask for you to spout ignorant hate speech.
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quote:eve is different in the sense that it is optional, it is possible to succeed without grinding and you have failed to admit this.
I'm genuinely curious, since I know you want to design games: why do you feel EVE is unique in that players can theoretically succeed without grinding? What does EVE do to reduce grind that (as an example) WOW does not?
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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quote:Your acting like the paragon of pretentiousness, anedotal evidence is not even close to statistical evidence, just because some devs complain about it doesn't mean that the market is being flooded with isk buyers/sellers/etc, I have just as much anectdotal evidence if not more then you that people do regularily get their accounts banned or get what they bought and the isk they bought removed from the game.
If you say that 'you cannot buy ISK' in the game, and I know people who both buy and sell isk in the game and don't ever get banned or have the money disappear, this makes your statement untrue.
That you know some people who HAVE gotten their accounts banned and/or isk removed, this only means that there is not a 100% success rate for the purchasing of ISK.
It does not actually make the statement 'you cannot buy ISK' true.
That is the statement I am saying is untrue.
Try to grab the logic behind this one. Don't just take another stab at calling me the 'paragon of pretentiousness' before you can actually come up with something that contradicts my statement.
I can't boil this down any simpler for you.
quote:I did not ask for you to spout ignorant hate speech.
You heard it here first, ladies and gentlemen: bringing up problems people tend to have with eve as a game is 'Hate Speech.'
I'd hate to make this any more Fanboi Fite Nite any more so than I've already done so I'm just up and gonna ask if any eve players are looking forward to Empyrean Age?
Posts: 15421 | Registered: Aug 2005
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Blayne Bradley
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Grind is simply fastest/conveniesnt/safest way to generate money Tom, you however can hope into a newbie frig and go pvping right off the bat and can make an earning from piracy or anti piracy. EVE with its in depth detailed player driven economy also offers a wide variety of options for people to make money by playing the market forces of supply and demand, doing all of this right off the bat is of course not right you need to train up skills of course but once you have the minimum skills playing the market forces, arms smuggling, exploration, manufacturing... there's dozens of ways to make money without having to ever fire a shot outside of the tutorial.
WoW the only way to gain levels is through grind, the only way to get good armor for pvp is to grind, in EVE you only need to grind if you want to grind otherwise you do not have to.
Also then there's Goonswarm. If your a newb under 10,000,000 skill points THEY will hire you as they're entire raison d'etre is to prove that having 500 newbs in newb ships can beat 20 experienced veterans in faction fitted battleships.
Samp, are you blind? I have said repeatedly that I use "cannot" in the same sense I would say "you cannot cross the street" you CAN cross the street, you will just have a non zero, non trivial chance of getting hit by a bus.....
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quote:WoW the only way to gain levels is through grind, the only way to get good armor for pvp is to grind
The latter portion of this is untrue; as in EVE, you can acquire good armor (or, in EVE's case, good ships) as a gift, or with enough cash -- and you can get cash from a variety of sources.
There is a difference I can see, though: as you note, levels and character skills are much less important in EVE, meaning that the experience grind is only necessary in the early game. Once you pick up the minimum skills you need, EVE becomes all about two things: on a personal level, money; and on a corporate level, massed firepower.
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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Mine is Shi Lang.
