quote:I have strong feelings about this election -- I regard it as a potential watershed, and McCain is the centrist candidate I support. But I also know many voters who support Obama, and I know their motives are at least as good as mine.
They believe Obama will reshape our country in good ways. I think they are mistaken -- but I can't fault their motives, or the hopes and dreams that are motivating their vote.
Thank you.
I hope Obama will prove to be a better president than you expect.
Posted by Paul Goldner (Member # 1910) on :
Didn't think he had it in him. Props.
Now, if only he can remember he wrote this the next time he thinks about writing about "the liberal elite out to destroy america."
Posted by happymann (Member # 9559) on :
Why does he have to remember that he wrote this before he writes about "the liberal elite out to destroy america"? I personally never got the impression that OSC was ever comparing "liberal elite" to the "many voters who support Obama" in any absolute equation (if that makes any sense). So OSC can still write an article getting angry at the liberal elite while still believing that the common Obama voter still has good motives.
Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
Excellent article! Amazing attitude. I really wish I could hear that from more McCain supporters.
Are we sure OSC isn't just a name for two different people?
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
It would be lovely to just have positive responses, without all the backhanded compliments and such.
See Sterling's post for an example.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
Very pleased with this Mr. Card's commentary on this matter.
Posted by Threads (Member # 10863) on :
That was a very good article and I'm glad that OSC wrote it. I would like to say that I could have written such an article yesterday but I can't and that is completely my own fault.
Posted by All4Nothing (Member # 11601) on :
I was glad to read this article when I got back here just awhile ago. I could see that Mr. Card was a big supporter of McCain, so this comes not so much as a suprise but as a good omen to me. By saying that I mean, I hope that this is the opinion and insight held by most if not all McCain supporters. Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
I am completely outraged that there is nothing in this article to be outraged about
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
Don't make me come over there. Posted by TL (Member # 8124) on :
May it portend things to come.
Posted by BryanP (Member # 7772) on :
Quite the contrast to his America unplugged article the day before. If you didn't know, you'd think they were written by two completely different people.
Posted by Christine (Member # 8594) on :
I'm usually afraid to read OSC's world watch but here, finally, we can agree. Well, put, Mr. Card!
Posted by Chris Bridges (Member # 1138) on :
Having criticized him for his previous article, I must commend him for this one. Excellent work.
Posted by Trent Destian (Member # 11653) on :
This lack of disagreement is disturbing. Please stop.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
I disagree with this part:
quote: And no matter how it comes out, I'm not moving to Canada. I'll be sticking around to keep on putting in my two cents' worth -- because that's what you do in a democracy. When the votes -- or the rules -- go against you, you swallow hard and vow to work harder next time.
No matter how it comes out, its always a good idea to move to Canada
There's your quota of disagreement.
Posted by Occasional (Member # 5860) on :
I, on the other hand, will not go down without a fight. Part of the reason Republicans keep losing this time is they have not been mean enough. They have not fought enough. They have not called out the liberals enough.
Enough of the nicety. Enough of the compliments. Enough of the giving in to our ideals to pretend the other side has values worthy of mention. Enough friendly conversation! That has been used against us.
Conservatives better start standing up and shout from the rooftops profanities, accusations, and all manner of vile words. If not, we will remain isolated and lose the control we have. McCain lost because he wanted to appear gracious. Instead, he appeard weak and unprepared. Time for Conservatives to stop bowing and start pounding.
The liberals gained ground historically by shouting, protesting, provoking violence, and even bombing like some of Obama's friends. Meanwhile, conservatives stand like deer in headlights. They hold their ground, but eventually get slaughtered. Conservatives must become the proverbial bull in the china shop.
I will not go silently into the night!
Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
quote: Part of the reason Republicans keep losing this time is they have not been mean enough.
What election were you watching?
I think that the Democratic meanness was too often overlooked in comparison to the Republican meanness, but by any definition of "mean" I've ever seen, the Republicans were abundantly mean this election.
Posted by Javert (Member # 3076) on :
I hope Occasional is trying to be funny.
I hope.
Posted by Occasional (Member # 5860) on :
Hardly Javert, I am deadly serious. Frankly, Dagonee, conservatives were pansies and your kind are part of the problem.
Posted by Javert (Member # 3076) on :
If that's the case, I'll be glad when you move to Alaska so that you and the Palins can finally secede from the union and form your own country. Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
quote:Frankly, Dagonee, conservatives were pansies and your kind are part of the problem.
I convinced at least 5 people to vote for McCain. What did your meanness do?
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
quote:Enough of the giving in to our ideals to pretend the other side has values worthy of mention.
It's a shame that you'd abandon your principles for short-term gain, really.
Posted by Occasional (Member # 5860) on :
What is funny about that is that my wife wants to move to Alaska. I don't because I can't stand the weather, but that is an interesting statement considering real life conversations.
Posted by mimsies (Member # 7418) on :
Excellent article Mr. Card. Actually it brought tears to my eyes.
Posted by lobo (Member # 1761) on :
This stands in start contrast to the last two elections. The libs have been bitter since Bush was "selected".
libs=poor losers. At least they are ok winners...
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
OSC showed the class and grace in defeat that I wish many of my conservative friends would learn.
-------------
Occasional, once again I feel compelled to say that you honestly scare the crap out of me.
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
quote:Originally posted by El JT de Spang: OSC showed the class and grace in defeat that I wish many of my conservative friends would learn.
I've seen a real mix of reactions among my coworkers (who were overwhelmingly McCain supporters). Some of them have been quite gracious about the whole thing, just saying that they hoped that their concerns about Obama were unfounded, while others have been screaming about how the country is not going to proceed directly into the toilet, and how they'll "see me in the soup lines".
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
A lot of my friends in Louisiana (the majority McCain supporters between the ages of 18 and 30) had facebook statuses ranging from, "I'm moving to Canada!" to "Enjoy socialism!"
Posted by hobsen (Member # 11808) on :
A lot of the rejoicing is because Obama's election proves that an otherwise worthy candidate will no longer be disqualified simply because of the color of his skin. Everyone should be glad about that, regardless of what they thought about Obama himself. And OSC wrote a fine column.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
Why would someone move to Canada from the United States to escape socialism?
Posted by Icarus (Member # 3162) on :
I had quoted the exact same lines from the column, intending to start just such a thread if it didn't exist already.
In fact, hell, I'll quote it again anyway:
quote:I have strong feelings about this election -- I regard it as a potential watershed, and McCain is the centrist candidate I support. But I also know many voters who support Obama, and I know their motives are at least as good as mine.
They believe Obama will reshape our country in good ways. I think they are mistaken -- but I can't fault their motives, or the hopes and dreams that are motivating their vote.
What a classy column. All of it. Thank you.
quote:Originally posted by rivka: It would be lovely to just have positive responses, without all the backhanded compliments and such.
See Sterling's post for an example.
QFT
Posted by LAParent (Member # 11810) on :
quote:Originally posted by Shanna: Excellent article! Amazing attitude. I really wish I could hear that from more McCain supporters.
Are we sure OSC isn't just a name for two different people?
Yeah. Demostenes and Locke.
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
quote:Originally posted by TomDavidson: Why would someone move to Canada from the United States to escape socialism?
Cause they're idiots. Parents are probably idiots too. Comes from upbringing.
Posted by happymann (Member # 9559) on :
quote:
quote:Originally posted by TomDavidson: Why would someone move to Canada from the United States to escape socialism?
Cause they're idiots. Parents are probably idiots too. Comes from upbringing.
"Lorraine, If you ever have a kid that acts that way, I'll disown you."
Posted by sylvrdragon (Member # 3332) on :
You guys read that article far different than I did. I kinda saw it as rather condescending.
The quote in the OP reads to me as "I can't fault your motives for voting how you did; You didn't know any better. You didn't mean any harm by your ignorance, and so, I forgive you."
I don't know if subtle condescension is any better than ranting. At least with ranting, we're sure about what he's thinking.
/shrug
I could be wrong.
Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
You are.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
quote:Originally posted by TomDavidson: Why would someone move to Canada from the United States to escape socialism?
I'm not sure, but I had to say this very thing to a woman who said if Obama was elected that she was moving to Canada. She just looked at me for a second, started laughing and said, "I must be going insane."
Since she was about to stick a needle in me to draw blood, it was alittle unsettling. Posted by CRash (Member # 7754) on :
quote:Originally posted by happymann:
quote:
quote:Originally posted by TomDavidson: Why would someone move to Canada from the United States to escape socialism?
Cause they're idiots. Parents are probably idiots too. Comes from upbringing.
"Lorraine, If you ever have a kid that acts that way, I'll disown you."
A reference I actually recognize! Love that movie. Posted by Scooter (Member # 6915) on :
Dear Mr. Card.
I have been a fan for a long time of your books. I remember when I first read Ender's Game when I was nine. I really appreciated your sense of moral fairness and compassion. I read a few other of your books and found you to be consistent in this regard.
However, when I read EG again at age 16, it changed my life. I really got into all the military stuff. Ender's brutality was incredibly profound. I started seeking out even more of your writing--I was in awe.
Achille--wow! Bean's cold-hearted apathy. Alvin's little brother's (forgot this name--Calvin?) intellectual manipulation. Abner Doon--what power, what vision! Elemak's amazing abilities to read people (or rats) and turn them toward his own designs. Any many, many more inspiringly cold, dark characters. I really felt I knew you.
Then, I thought I heard on the radio that Rush Limbaugh had read one of your political essays (I didn't know you got into that stuff), so yesterday I went looking for them and read the first one I saw--about this "very good election year."
Wow.
This is not the Orson Scott Card I knew from his books. I cannot believe his affable, warm, open-minded tone in the essay. He even gave credit to the enemy! Where did all that come from? I don't know if I will be able to enjoy his books again. I will certainly boycott buying any!!
I'm just so torn. What an eye-opening experience. I just had to come on here an express my unexpected dismay. I wish you would just stick to exploring the merits of hate through your Science Fiction novels and keep your even-handed, empathic political commentary to yourself.
-if anyone really needs it
Posted by Eaquae Legit (Member # 3063) on :
I thought it was a wonderful article. Thanks, OSC. I hope Obama proves to be a far better president than you fear, and I hope he manages to live up to even half the adoration poured on him. He's got a tough job ahead, and classy responses like this one will help him.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by BryanP: Quite the contrast to his America unplugged article the day before. If you didn't know, you'd think they were written by two completely different people.
What if?
Posted by Nikisknight (Member # 8918) on :
quote:Originally posted by Shanna: Excellent article! Amazing attitude. I really wish I could hear that from more McCain supporters.
Are we sure OSC isn't just a name for two different people?
Try Dennis Prager for another example. And Bill Whittle as well. Like them, I think this result is a bad thing for our country because of Sen. Obama's qualifications and beliefs (what I can ascertain them to be anyway) but I congratulate him for winning and will be very happy to be proven wrong in my fears. If not, I will civilly criticize his policies. I'm sure this is how most level-headed conservatives will react; any that are worth reading in the first place, anyway.
Posted by C3PO the Dragon Slayer (Member # 10416) on :
quote:Originally posted by Orincoro:
quote:Originally posted by BryanP: Quite the contrast to his America unplugged article the day before. If you didn't know, you'd think they were written by two completely different people.
What if?
Ooo, the complete reversal of the Locke/Demosthenes concept!
Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :
Also, STORMY!!! You're ALIVE! Posted by Shigosei (Member # 3831) on :
I too was very pleased to read this column. There has been a fair amount of graciousness from McCain himself and some of his supporters, and I hope that we'll see good cross-aisle relationships in the future.
![[Angst]](graemlins/angst.gif)
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)