Hi, I just finished "Shadow Puppets" today and was wondering when the new Bean book is coming out.
Posted by Ryuko (Member # 5125) on :
Not for a while. OSC has some other books he's working on beforehand. Anyone else know which ones? I'd assume he was taking a break from writing after finishing The Crystal City...
...Which I still haven't read. Posted by T.J. (Member # 6267) on :
your not alone Gubernator, im kinda itchin for the next Bean book. I was hoping it would be this year but yeah Crystal City... which, when i get some money i'll read, but yeah anyways Like all the other Shadows i think it'll be wicked awesome.
Posted by Taalcon (Member # 839) on :
Rachel & Leah is the next to be released. And it's unknown whether the next will be Shadow of the Giant, Magic Street, or the final Alvin Maker book.
Posted by T.J. (Member # 6267) on :
thanks. *thinks out loud man what a waste of server space"
Posted by Anna (Member # 2582) on :
Magic Street ?
Posted by Taalcon (Member # 839) on :
The alleged new title for what was once called "Slow Leak", a new contemporary fantasy, a la ENCHANTMENT.
Posted by Kai_Hawatari (Member # 6271) on :
Can't wait for the next Bean book. While I learned more from the Ender Saga, I like reading the Bean saga more. I like the current-day politics and military philosophy that is ever-present in these books.
Posted by gwan (Member # 6194) on :
agreed Posted by BattleSchooler06 (Member # 6279) on :
i like the shadow books becasue it involvs all the Battle School kids.....and in SftD and the other sequals none of them have ever once been mentioned....but in the shadow series...they are there! they play a part in almost everything....well ofcourse they would because ender and valentine are on a ship going to a colony....
Posted by Da_Goat (Member # 5529) on :
quote:Rachel & Leah is the next to be released. And it's unknown whether the next will be Shadow of the Giant, Magic Street, or the final Alvin Maker book.
I thought a new Pastwatch was also a possibility.
Posted by HonestAbe (Member # 6254) on :
Advent Rising book 1 is pretty soon too I beleive.
Posted by Kai_Hawatari (Member # 6271) on :
Seems kinda quick. I mean, it was only a few months ago that OSC signed on to that deal wasn't it?
Posted by Defender/In/Arms (Member # 6368) on :
i wonder what the next shadow book will be about. i know that bean and petra are looking for their "kids" but i cant wait to see who osc will put into the mix of things to oppose them, my guess is probably volescue, hes a worm
Posted by gwan (Member # 6194) on :
I was a little disapointed that they ended up killing Achilles. I don't know but I liked him... and I can't explain it, other than saying that OSC is an amazing writter. Also, I just simply don't like the whole your-hero-prevails-and-slays-his-enemies-yeah-to-you-for-loving-him ,thing. It makes me angry and I thought it made Shadow puppets a little weaker than the rest of the Bean series. Personally my favorite is "SHADOW OF THE HEGEMON". I developed this strange crush on Achilles, whilst reading that book.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
That's more than a little sick.
I mean that in the nicests way, of course. Posted by Armoth (Member # 4752) on :
Really? I disliked achilles. I wasnt able to get the best read on his character. I love the character of Peter, and I really cant wait to see how Card develops him into the powerful Hegemon he is/was in the Sftd branch.
Posted by gwan (Member # 6194) on :
I hate Peter, I just can't get Ender's image of him out of my mind. I know he isn't the evil squirrel killing dyck that he once was but, i can't help it. He always seems so cold. I think with Achilles I just loved how he was always flirting with Petra. I think in my mind (and I know how disturbing this is... and know many psychiatrists would probably love to talk to me) but Achilles was so attractive when, Petra was in the truck, getting away, and Achilles came, he shot the man she was talking to, and he took off his shirt and gave it to her to wipe the blood off of her face. Strange I know. Posted by skrika03 (Member # 5930) on :
gubernator is a cool name. gwan is going to have an interesting life. Whatever happened to Grandma Edie?
Posted by Phil Tice (Member # 6370) on :
Although I enjoy the Ender series more, I really enjoy the Shadow books too. I think a part of me was always a little disappointed that Ender never got to see his friends from Battle School again, and I wondered what became of them. Now I know.
Posted by DarkWizard (Member # 6186) on :
I like the shadow series better because it follows the military/political theme more.
Posted by A Daughter of Diko (Member # 6346) on :
I just finished *Shadow Puppets* a few minutes ago. Great read, indeed.
Am clamoring for the next one.
Posted by Defender/In/Arms (Member # 6368) on :
ive read all the ender books and shadow books multiple times, and have wondered something. the way peter acts in enders game is completely different then the way he acts in shadow of the hegemon. was it just an act to get more power over ender and val? if so how come he didnt act the same to seem more powerful to bean?
Posted by Kabederlin (Member # 6304) on :
I always liked Peter better than Achilles. Achilles was driven crazy for his need for revenge. Peter on the other hand doesn;t let his want for revenge take over his mind. Other than that they aren;t much different people. I believe it was Shadow of the Hegemon where Sister Carlotta says something like "One of them will rule the world. Which evil is lesser?" Of course that;s probably not even close to the exact words she said but the meaning is the same. Peter is clever and ruthless. Achilles was just ruthless.
Posted by Armoth (Member # 4752) on :
I disagree. Achilles WAS clever and rutheless. The difference between them was society. Achilles wasnt power hungry in the sense that he needed to be viewed as powerful by society. Peter however, DOES have that hunger to be veiwed as powerful by society, growing not only in REAL power but in the eyes of the world.
Posted by Kabederlin (Member # 6304) on :
But Peter had the brains to win the world before he every took a seat of power. Achilles wanted to win the world by taking a seat of power. I believe, it's been a while since Shadow Puppets, that Achilles seat of power was a brief sit in as the Hegemon, which he blew in his arrogance. Then again Peter also blew his Hegemon spot with his arrogance and luckily Bean hated Achilles or he;d have never gotten it back. So I guess it;s really hard to say why I like Peter better than Achilles. I always saw Peter as being smarter, and he was because he was a Wiggin. And Wiggins are smarter than... No-Last-Names...
Posted by Defender/In/Arms (Member # 6368) on :
too bad bean wasnt power hungry and wanted to rule the world. he was the one who did all pretty much for peter, and i like bean better then peter or achilles. Posted by gwan (Member # 6194) on :
But, if Bean was power hungry like the rest of them, he wouldn't be Bean anymore. He was clever enough not to get caught up in all of the politics. Yes he was smart enough he could have taken over the world, but he doesn't have that need... He "saved" humanity once, why do anything else to put his name in the history books.
Posted by Julian (Member # 6386) on :
Although Ender's Game will always be the One That Started It All for me, Bean's story is the one I can't put down. Ender's Shadow was like reading Ender's Game for the first time, all over again - like peering into a familiar room through a different window. Shadow of the Hegemon and Shadow Puppets are great. Ender is the Untouchable One - the one we want to be like but never can be. Bean is the Real Person, because we see Ender through him and we see Bean in ourselves.
Posted by Armoth (Member # 4752) on :
I always thought of Ender as the real person. The one who was able to understand other humans, which is why he was successful, and Bean was not (in battle school, as the leader). I see Bean's story as a better one because of its applications to our world. Im more in love with Ender, than with Bean.
Posted by Julian (Member # 6386) on :
I identify with Bean, because I see Ender the way Bean sees him, as someone to strive to emulate while knowing at the same time he could never be as Good as Ender. It's Bean's self-doubt and self-questioning that shows his humanity. And it's Bean's love of Ender that makes me love Bean as well.
Posted by Apooche (Member # 6384) on :
Bean was good at thinking, making him kind of Enders Aide, while Ender could command well, getting him the position. It kind of shifts to Peter when he comes around, adding a twist to the plot.
The main reason i'm itching for Shadow of whatever's next is to find out exactly how Peter comes to the power people in SftD, Xenocide and CotM remember him by.
I think OSC will finish up his first meetings stuff before hitting that topic again, but I hope he does make a sequel soon.
edit = spelling errors
[ March 29, 2004, 08:35 PM: Message edited by: Apooche ]
Posted by megaotaku (Member # 6389) on :
well, i heard some really wierd rumors about what the next shadow book is gonna be about but im not sure where so im not sure if i can rely on it. i heard that it would have bean and petra's son meeting wang-mu and peter. very wierd. well, i took that idea and wrote a fanfic on it so... ^^;
Posted by Phil Tice (Member # 6370) on :
I identify with Ender so much better than I do with Bean. The genius and the good intentions are there for both of them. I think what sets Ender apart for me is how well he understands what motivates other people and human emotion. He is driven by his emotions whereas Bean is driven by his rationale. If Petra is anything like my wife, that drives her nuts.
-PT
Posted by Aeroth (Member # 6269) on :
I think Ender is the one who is more human and easier to relate to. I mean, it was easy to read the speaker books because you weren't constantly worried about some mad genius children being out there. Most of the characters were scientists or Zenadors or whatever, but nevertheless, they were normal humans.
Bean, however, is a human version of Jane. He knows almost everything, sees almost everything, and his knowledge is greater than that of anyone in the world. Not to mention how it took him a while to finally get the grasp of human emotion properly. So basically, Bean is artificial intelligence landed into a human's body.
Ender, on the other hand, didn't amaze me with incredible genius skills like Bean does, which was a relief to me, really. I especially liked the middle-aged Ender in SfTD who was not driven by his own intelligence, but instead by his secret sources, including Jane and the Hive Queen.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
I find both equally unrelatable. Bean is smarter than any human. Ender is better than any human. Neither one is beleivable as an actual human beings.
Don't smite me for my heretical views! I love those books, but still feel that way about those two characters.
Posted by Julian (Member # 6386) on :
See, the thing is, I love Ender in the sense that if he were my leader I would follow him anywhere. But part of that love is to idealize him. Then I got to know Bean from the inside, and discovered he feels the same way as I do about Ender - loving Ender as a leader while also feeling inadequate compared to him. Until Bean came along, it made me kind of melancholy that I could never be as good as Ender. Bean makes me OK with it.
Posted by Bant (Member # 6214) on :
quote: I always saw Peter as being smarter, and he was because he was a Wiggin. And Wiggins are smarter than... No-Last-Names...
Achilles has a last name. It's de Flandres. So Achilles de Flandres. ^^. For whatever reason I liked Achilles more. I just have a kind of "respect" towards someone who can fool so many empires into thinking he's something good for them, when really it's for his own good. I just thought Peter was too...Peter. My minds not working anymore, so I can't think of a good word -_-;;
Posted by Defender/In/Arms (Member # 6368) on :
i think the problem with peter was that he thought since he was just a kid no one would listen to him, and was too cocky once he got to be hegemon. achilles de flandres however knew governments would accept him, and knew the power kids had at that time over the world, and he acted on that knowledge.
Posted by Kabederlin (Member # 6304) on :
quote: Achilles has a last name. It's de Flandres. So Achilles de Flandres
Was it? Thanks. I must have not remembered reading that.
As for the basis of Ender and Bean, I;ve always been more partial to Ender, though I love Bean a lot. I enjoy both ENder's too, the child and the middle aged one. The child because of his innocence yet his will and courage to go on through all the crap they put him through, and then the integrity to accept the death of the Buggers as his own fault.
I like the middle-aged ENder because he was so understanding and patient. I just love the part in SftD where he's struggling with Grego and the boy pees on Ender's pants. And I love the way Ender speaks Marcao's death. It kind of made me want somebody to speak my own death when it happens so I'm not shielded by lies when I die.
As for Bean, I admire him as well, but most of my passion for him comes after Ender's Shadow and on into Shadow of the Hegemon. Esspecially the part (Spoiler Alert (Even though you should be expecting it by reading this topic)) after Sister Carlotta die and Bean is leading his special forces guys against the invading armies. At one part it says
quote: Then on the mission where they worked together, Suriyawong saw something else: Bean had no fear of death. Bullets could be flying, explosives could be near detonation, and Bean would move without fear and with only token concealment. It was if he dared the enemy to shoot him, dared their own explosives to defy him and go off before he was ready. ... It was as if he knew the day he would die, and this was not that day.
I don't know what it is about that passage but it really just always made me love Bean more than I already did.
All in all, Card's unique skill for making readers fall in love with his characters is unbelievable. Although I love some characters more than others, I have passion for all of them, even if it does mean accepting Achilles.
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